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 veryhotthread  Author  Topic: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic  (Read 108575 times)
MOKSHA
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1500 on: Nov 12th, 2011, 09:42am »

YEA<>HAL,
Some of the reports, from different cases have bits of craft, I was pointing out, the skeptics, call this type of evidence RUBBISH, I am not sure why.
could it be denial?
due to believe systems?
that stance is a puzzle to me, what about you?
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1501 on: Nov 12th, 2011, 10:44am »

MOKSHA,

It's almost impossible to take a position on most cases.

As they get older, bits keep on being added to the stories.

The internet has only made things worst.

We can only wait and see what comes along.

HAL
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LoriCordini
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1502 on: Nov 13th, 2011, 1:09pm »

on Nov 8th, 2011, 2:35pm, timetraveler wrote:
I don’t think that this is the time in history to quote passages from religious books or belief systems or to decide which religion is best. I think that we should have personal awareness and opinions based upon our own reaction to the happenings of today.

Irwyn Greif


1. religion is a creation of man to better understand what he doesn't understand! grin

2. There is only one EXISTENCE, only one God, only one system...with many beliefs of that system.

3. I have found it interesting that so many of the thoughts, lessons etc. given to me by my off-world teachers I have found in the Baha'i Writings.

4. I am not asking anyone to do anything but investigate their own belief system and see how it fits into what we discuss.

5. Believe everything and believe nothing--then you will know.

6. Our concepts of God and religion need to be taken a good look at if we are going to become active participants in a galactic society. "Religion" "Knowledge" all are progressive. Hence each new era of mankind progresses in understanding. As a human graduates from 1st grade to college level he/she grows in knowledge, so it is with spiritual awareness and knowledge. All is One. Wars and arguments keep on happening over absolutely nothing!!
Think finite and there is no understanding, think infinite and there is understanding.
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1503 on: Nov 13th, 2011, 1:20pm »

don’t think that this is the time in history to quote passages from religious books or belief systems or to decide which religion is best. I think that we should have personal awareness and opinions based upon our own reaction to the happenings of today.

Irwyn Greif

PSIf we have our own personal awareness and opinions based on the happenings to today, there will never be any progression...man will be in the same mud hole in 100 years as he is now, as he was 200 years ago. It is my deepest hope, my most sincere prayer that humans will mature soon enough to realize they no longer have much
time left before Project Earth shuts down as a failure. This beautiful planet is unlike no other in the universe in its beauty, in its diversity, we have been given one chance and one chance only we have to stop old traditional ways of killing each other and tearing down trees for profits before it is too late. Please dear friends, we can no longer depend on the ways of past thinking. Give unconditional love a chance. The next phase of human evolution is spiritual evolution...will we be ready? -Watana-
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1504 on: Nov 13th, 2011, 1:27pm »

on Nov 12th, 2011, 10:44am, HAL9000 wrote:
MOKSHA,

It's almost impossible to take a position on most cases.

As they get older, bits keep on being added to the stories.

The internet has only made things worst.

We can only wait and see what comes along.

HAL

The best way to know if someone is telling the truth is that the story doesn't change. If you tell the truth, you don't have to remember what you said. I do have to admit however, that my story may at times "appear" to change, but this is not change, just new memories coming forward, the basic truth does not change. Like the night the sky lit up story when I was 5. I thought it was our babysitter who was present at the time I "went through the wall."
But when talking with my mother she said, it was she, and that they visited so many times it is easy to get it mixed up.
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icepick
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1505 on: Nov 14th, 2011, 12:27am »

on Nov 9th, 2011, 06:21am, HAL9000 wrote:
Timetraveller,

...The latest criticism was that he criticized the prime minister of Israel for threatening to take preemptive action against Iran if it continues its nuclear weapons development. Israel has a right to defend itself from its Arab enemies and to protect its borders from imminent danger...


But no one has the right to defend themselves against Israeli agression ?

You seem quite happy to let this bunch of East European thugs carry on with their own illegal atomic weapons ? Have you the faintest idea what would happen if the Iranian nuclear projects were bombed ?
Particularly as this would most likely be accomplished with the aid of US AWACs as it was during the attack on the Iraqi reactor.

One day all the Arab states will club together and that may put a stop to Israel's posturing. But mayby that is why so much effort goes into keeping the region de-stabalised.

Bagel , anyone ?

HAL



Hal, why do you refer to the Israelis as thugs. If you will read current issues of the region back to their source, it becomes very clear that the Jews are not the heavies in this matter. However, your country is indeed a prime suspect.

Is it because they continually feel obliged to try and eradicate various factions from Lebanon who have continued to attack their civilians over the years? Once again, I only need point to Ireland to show you the folly of that. If we were attacked out of Mexico repeatedly, even our pacifists would back retribution. Which is being advocated even now.

If the Arabs want a solution to their Jewish problem, it stares them in the face. But they insist on following despotic leaders, refusing to acknowledge the reality of the holocaust and such. Why?

This is why I posted that thread about Muslim condemnation for the French incident. If the Arabs want to enter the modern world, most of us will welcome them. If history is a guide, this goes in triplicate for the Israelis.

We both know the least desirable Middle Eastern course. Turkey's recent dreams of lost empire, correct? It's a disgrace that they're a NATO member at times, isn't it? I notice they're not in the union over there .............
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timetraveler
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Some UFOs are angelic !!!

ICQ YIM YIM
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1506 on: Nov 14th, 2011, 08:09am »

I am so gratified at the intelligent and incisive postings on this website. Everybody is “coming out of the closet” and revealing their true beliefs and spiritual teachings. I wish to comment on each of the posters;

Lori, I do not believe that the human race is capable of change or saving itself. I believe that basically the human race is genocidal. I believe that the systems of this World will be changed according to the Mayan prophecy in 2012, because of the intervention of Angels and UFOs.

Hal, you frighten me. I wonder if you are sent by the CIA as a disclaimer to spread disinformation and to muddy the waters of intelligent reason.

Icepick, I am impressed by your sources of information and your ability to accurately analyze the meaning behind the words of the posters. You are a very accurate analyst.

I believe that this World will be saved by higher intelligence Beings and that this transition is taking place now. That is why I ask you to look at the news to see the evidence of revolutions and changes of government and collapses of the monetary systems in our World and of the challenges being made to science and religion regarding the accepted dogma of our structured World.

We are witnesses to a changing World.


Irwyn Greif
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HAL9000
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1507 on: Nov 14th, 2011, 09:09am »

Icepick,

We need to make an important distinction here. At no time do I say that the Jews are thugs. I refer to the State of Israel.
I know that it is a fine line, for almost by definition most Israeli are Jewish; But the exact definition is important.

We've been over this before, but my reasoning is that it (Israel) is an imposed state upon someone elses land. And it is no suprise that the previous owners (Palestinians) are pretty agrieved about how it was stolen from them by us Brits and supported by both us and your country over the years.

The Jewish people lost that area many years ago when it was Judea. And they lost it in the kind of war that was common then. They could not have regained it without the help of the West. The reasons for this help are easily found and most of them relate to WWII. Churchill and David Ben-Gurian. It's makes interesting reading.

The treatment of the Palastinians, particularly during the early days, was reprehensible. And we supported it.

I wish no ill on any Israeli, but I do wish that the state would just go aweay as it is the root cause of most of the area's problems. Fat chance of that happening.

Timetraveller,

...spread disinformation and to muddy the waters of intelligent reason....

Quite the opposite. I hope to help clarify these muddy waters a bit by asking people questions that they often have trouble answering.

For instance, what do the waters of intelligent reason reveal about the following line by one of our collegues..

...5. Believe everything and believe nothing--then you will know...

Possibly you don't see a problem with it ?

HAL

Not CIA
smiley
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1508 on: Nov 14th, 2011, 1:29pm »

on Nov 8th, 2011, 5:51pm, MOKSHA wrote:
I think NEO already, caused a event.
to see, should be, interesting.
Irwyn, posted his concerns about a war in the middle east, or possible, preemptive actions, on the "DEFENSIVENESS".
For me, I am still waiting for JUST one day of, NO WAR in the brothers of ABRAHAM, I am from NOAH, this is not my WAR.
Besides, I get this funny feeling, EVERYTHING will happen JUST the way it is supposed to.


Some guy took my marbles, so I'm mad, so I'll get my buddies together and hit on him and get my marbles back, plus his. Then I'll give a few to my buddies for helping me.
Then a new guy comes to town with a huge amount of marbles...I have to buy some of his, so I prize them more and when the guy from on the other side of town plays me in the big tournament and I lose my expensive marbles, we start to fight, a knife is pulled--someone is killed, the police come and they all lose their marbles!!!

Now if we all divided our marbles equally, put our money together to buy some ,marbles for the new kid in town without any, we'd all have some marbles to play with and have a great time.
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LoriCordini
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1509 on: Nov 14th, 2011, 1:41pm »

on Nov 14th, 2011, 09:09am, HAL9000 wrote:
Icepick,


For instance, what do the waters of intelligent reason reveal about the following line by one of our collegues..

...5. Believe everything and believe nothing--then you will know...

Possibly you don't see a problem with it ?

HAL

Not CIA
smiley

That's my point Hal...Lori wrote..."'believe everything and believe nothing...then you will know. I'll try to explain that phrase to you, but its as simple as it is intellectually deep.

Allow yourself to listen and believe what someone is saying, but don't hold tight to that belief, allow them, and yourself the chance to grow and see the perspective of both "believes" wink "Believe everything (don't be critical, open your eyes to all possibilities--Believe nothing (don't get hung up on idea so strongly that you can't see the possibilities of another idea" Now do you understand? Now you know!!! grin
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MOKSHA
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1510 on: Nov 15th, 2011, 06:33am »

YES<>LORI,
This great idea has been expressed in many ways, "OPEN".
I find it possible, it will be different for everyone.
I see IT like this: If one wishes to connect to the universal perfect plan, this maybe a ONE to ONE, plug-in, this could also explain why some see it so differently, cause IT IS.
MKW
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1511 on: Nov 15th, 2011, 07:23am »

LoriCordini,

Basicaly your description of what you mean is simply another way of expressing constructive skepticism. I have no problem with that.
What I am having trouble with is your use of the word 'believe'.
I would prefer the word 'consider'. 'Believe' implies (to me) that you have already accepted the premise, and to change this you have to obtain knowledge that will make you disbelieve it.
For instance, I don't believe that there are flying saucers. However, based on the object that I saw and upon the reports by people of similar objects, I accept that there is probably some kind of phenomena that we refer to as ufos.

I don't need to start from a position of belief, For me it is a probability based upon personal evidence. And it may be wrong.

Based on the evidence I do not accept the probability of 'V' type reptilian beings, LGMs, Grays or intergalactic councils advising governments etc.

Anyone who does is entitled to do so; it's their choice.

HAL smiley
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1512 on: Nov 15th, 2011, 8:29pm »

Hal, word games/semantics are always in play aren't they. We can always put things better. For example; ignorance? Or uninformed? How much difference truly exists between the two?

On a similar line of thought, I wanted to point out a couple more points about the Israelis and Palestinians. You seem to forget that when Jews were being relocated to uninhabited Palestinian Land, Arabs made great sport of going to the local Kibbutz at night, to take pot shots at Jews in the dark. In other words, they perpetuated more suffering than they received.

Also, why is there no outcry about the portions of Palestine which now lie in Jordan? There is much more land there that was theirs than is in Israel. Who knows, maybe even some oil too.

"Moses wandered the desert for forty years, only to settle where oil wasn't". Golda Meir.

We've discussed this before. Israel is not the problem. Relocate the Jewish people and they will only fight about something else.

Is it the heat? They should be used to that. Culture? That changed and still they fight. Arabs can be good people, but they are racist. And nationalistic. I suspect the issue ties into both of those. I only wish they would resolve their differences. I have a hunch the Israelis would jump up and down at a chance to be the region's primary defenders. And what a defense they would be, eh? 1948, with nobody to help them, armed with Mausers, home made Stens, M1 Garands, and lever action Winchesters they fended off all Arab nations. Who had tanks, air forces ........... one would think a marriage made in Heaven, right? Hard to say what drives them. Sadat made peace and got the Sinai back in the process, but they killed him. Syria tried to build a breeder reactor because of Iran, not Israel. Of course Israel didn't stand still ............. but what gives? When they come here they're nice and courteous. The Middle Eastern Political Landscape is nothing but riddles? Why?

Every time somebody here comments against Israel, I point out that if we had their neighbors, we'd be surrounded by obsidian glass. And I've had more than one Muslim agree. They're wise to this as well. It may have been some time since you've been there, but I'll bet much of the same still applies.

My father noticed the difference between coastal Arabs and desert nomads in WWII ......... how much does this play?
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1513 on: Nov 15th, 2011, 8:33pm »

BTW, sorry about OT subject matter. This issue perplexes me, that's all.

We're going to be dealing with it soon too I suspect. Maybe with little choice. Politicians fifty years ago kept saying this. I'm not too sure about today's crop.
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xx Re: Angels, UFOs, and Psychic
« Reply #1514 on: Nov 15th, 2011, 9:42pm »

I have come to accept the journey we all call life; and individually speaking, that I am SOUL having a human experience. Twenty years ago; I was knocking on death's door when I had blood clots (medically known as pulmonary embolisms) travel to my lungs, thus cutting off vital oxygen from reaching my brain, and thus losing consciousness. Then I quickly was within the realization that my consciousness was very lucid; I could see things from what I best describe as 360 degrees, the crippling chest pain I had moments earlier was gone, I was in a feeling of complete bliss, surrounded by this most loving feeling that completely permeated my entire being. I could also see my body laying on the floor, and my consciousness was about ten to twelve feet away; hovering at a side angle over my body; but toward the ceiling. My wife was hysterical; screaming at me not to let go (she thought I was dead at this point in time) and my brother inlaw was pounding on my chest; started CPR until the paramedics arrived. My body lay their unconscious (to the rest in the room) and I was very lucid, seeing everything that was going on; but unable to get anyone's attention. At this point in time; I realized that I was "me" away from where my body lay. I remember neighbors running from next door through the front door to try and give assistance. This was Christmas Day 1990.

The paramedics hooked up a portable CKG machine, used the resuscitator mask on me, it has a big squeezy thing on it, and I was watching all this from the ceiling. I felt this sensation of being pulled into what I would call a great abyss, yet surrounded by this most loving of all feelings. I remember watching the paramedics and family members assisting them carry me down over the doorstep into the waiting ambulance. After that instant; I recall nothing, until waking up in the ambulance as it was backing into the hospital Emerg dept. As I came to; the incredible level of chest pain was as bad before the moment my consciousnesses slipped away from where my physical body was laying. The paramedics has oxygen tubes into my nose, the resuscitation mask was still being applied over my face, and they rushed me into the resuscitation room. The medical staff quickly sprang into action, drawing blood, doing more EKG's etc. My blood oxygen level saturation was so low, the doc said I should have been dead! The next five weeks, I had to spend in hospital recovering from these blood clots.

It was at this point in my life, I was an athiest; did not believe in any God or intelligent being. I was very fearful to tell anyone what I just experienced, as I did not know how to really put it all in words. This few minutes or moments of being outside my body consumed every second of my waking thoughts. What happenned to me; and what was this all about? When those blood clots dropped me to the floor (fainted due to lack of oxygen) was what one doctor said likely happened when I dropped; but no one could explain why I was conscious and alert to what was happening; as my body lay limp and lifeless on the floor in my sister in-laws living-room on Christmas Day.

In the months following this experience (some would call it a Near Death Experience) I started to go to the library; book stores, looking for articles about consciousness etc. I came across a book by Dr. Raymond Moody called Life after Life and after reading it; some of the things that happened to me, were similar to what he documented in his book. However, in many of the accounts of NDE's in his book, people reported seeing a tunnel, a bright light and meeting dead relatives. Those aspects did NOT happen to me, but being out of body consciousness certainly did.

Since that event happened to me, it was not the end; but a beginning of some strange events that have taken place since that time. I will elaborate further on it in future postings.

My days of being an athiest came to a quick end, and after having a lucid experience out of body; (or what seemed to be that) I started to look for answers. I am still looking for those answers today, but believe that I am much closer to that answer today, than the days following that NDE like event that happened to me.

EBS
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