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 veryhotthread  Author  Topic: Moon Dreams  (Read 2513 times)
ZETAR
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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #15 on: Jan 11th, 2015, 11:23am »

HAL,

IT DOES APPEAR YOU PREFACED YOUR CAVEAT WITH QUITE AN INSPIRATIONAL ATTITUDE...

TO WIT:
By the time your body is cold the 'real you' will have long departed to another realm.

THERE IS HOPE! cool

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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #16 on: Jan 11th, 2015, 11:38am »

ZETAR

I GOT THAT IDEA FROM PANDORA.

WHEN THERE IS NOTHING ELSE LEFT IN THE BOX........

HAL
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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #17 on: Jan 11th, 2015, 12:59pm »

on Jan 10th, 2015, 2:32pm, ghostofsilver wrote:
Purr,

I agree with you!

The last full moon this past Monday, my wife and I were at the grocery store and when we came out, just like in a werewolf movie, the clouds parted and a large, bright full moon appeared.

We both went wow!

We both felt something like a special force.

INT21,

I am 69 years old, but my wife being younger, she will not get social security/medicare until 65, which will be this coming April.

I can not think about age because I still have to work to afford her private medical insurance.

Private medical insurance is extremely expensive.

Also, my wife and I have seen so much paranormal over the years, that we know there is something going on after death.

Our stories would not be accepted or believable by people, but there is something after death.



Went "wow"? I sure hope this doesn't mean you and the better half turning into werewolves under the full moon or sumtin, Ghostofsilver! I respect your efforts in getting you wife the medical coverage needed. We are in agreement "there's something going on after death". I model it as human beings having temporary living bodies as well as eternal spirit selves. So reincarnation as well as curious questing into ideas about God/Gods/Heaven seems an inevitability for our species.


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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #18 on: Jan 11th, 2015, 1:08pm »

on Jan 11th, 2015, 11:11am, INT21 wrote:
Purr,

By the time your body is cold the 'real you' will have long departed to another realm.

HAL
INT21

P,S. That only applies if you believe there is some where else to go to.

p.p.s
It all depends upon where you think the 'real you' resides. And what it is.


I kinda dare assume we both are evolutionists, Hal. So.. ah... how in your view (as an Atheist) did human consciousness beyond physical death evolve? What mechanism do you envision?

I respectfully disagree on your use of "believe" and "think" (in P.S. and P.P.S.). I don't think our beliefs/thoughts cause the sum of reality, but rather the other way round. Reality informs our minds. (If not, we are mad.)

smiley

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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #19 on: Jan 11th, 2015, 6:22pm »

Purr,

...So.. ah... how in your view (as an Atheist) did human consciousness beyond physical death evolve...

I'm not saying it does. If you have proof that this is so i'll be very pleased to study it.

I was only hinting at the problem posed when people are declared dead on the evidence of flat line brain readings.

Operations on people by using extreme cold would seem to suggest that, although the brain is apparently dead, even for hours, in the right circumstances full recovery is sometimes possible.

...I don't think our beliefs/thoughts cause the sum of reality, but rather the other way round. Reality informs our minds. (If not, we are mad.)...

Quantum physics may disagree with you. What is 'reality' ?

As for evolution.

I would say that for years I accepted Darwin as being right. But recently I have some doubts.

All you have to do to be afflicted with the same doubts is to start going backwards through the history of every thing. Right back to the first nucleus.

HAL
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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #20 on: Jan 16th, 2015, 1:12pm »

on Jan 11th, 2015, 6:22pm, INT21 wrote:
Purr,

...So.. ah... how in your view (as an Atheist) did human consciousness beyond physical death evolve...

I'm not saying it does. If you have proof that this is so i'll be very pleased to study it.

I was only hinting at the problem posed when people are declared dead on the evidence of flat line brain readings.

Operations on people by using extreme cold would seem to suggest that, although the brain is apparently dead, even for hours, in the right circumstances full recovery is sometimes possible.

...I don't think our beliefs/thoughts cause the sum of reality, but rather the other way round. Reality informs our minds. (If not, we are mad.)...

Quantum physics may disagree with you. What is 'reality' ?

As for evolution.

I would say that for years I accepted Darwin as being right. But recently I have some doubts.

All you have to do to be afflicted with the same doubts is to start going backwards through the history of every thing. Right back to the first nucleus.

HAL
INT21


Ah, INT21, your use of 'another realm' may have caused some confusion among us theists and deists and what not. If not Afterlife, what did you mean by the term?

And could you be mixing up the tentative, yet apparently real correlation between a lowered body temperature during cardiac arrest and full recovery, even after occasionally incredible rescuscitation delays (over 1 hour)..

with:

The correlation between low body temperatures (coupled with long rescuscitative delays) and the occurrance of Near Death Experience. There's no factual basis for the latter correlation. NDE seems to potentially happen to anyone going into cardiac arrest, though not everyone, including some who register EEG flatlines (= no measurable brainactivity).

These panoramic, dramatic, emotional and often life altering reports, which cannot be attributed to a brain in flatline, beg the question if they originate in another reality, somewhere out of time and space.

If so, it explains why some people have past life memories, dream of the future and have faith in God and a heavenly realm.


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Let us be sure that those who come after will say of us in our time, that in our time we did everything that could be done. We finished the race; we kept them free; we kept the faith.

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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #21 on: Jan 16th, 2015, 3:44pm »

Purr,

..If not Afterlife, what did you mean by the term?..

Tricky one. How to start ?

Let's begin by removing all forms of organised religion from the equation. Let us disregard deities with flowing beards and visions of heaven replete with unsullied maidens. Things floating around playing musical instruments and beings who look remarkably like ancient Greeks who tend to sit around on mountain tops bored out of their skulls and spend an inordinate amount of time plotting inter god family squabbles while holding an unhealthy interest in their sons and daughters.


Ok, we have an empty space.

At this point it would be quite easy to say 'if you believe in what is generally called an after life, bring on your proof. Show me the experiment that I can preform to show that you are right'. But I know you can't. No one can. A bit like the ufo.

However.

There does seem to be plenty of things happening that do indicate that there is something going on that we cannot measure or detect. People see odd things. Hear odd things. Strange things happen. And it is on a scale that is very hard to deny.

So, if there is something else that we are perceiving., it has to be coming from somewhere. An undetectable somewhere.

The people in the ultra cold that I mentioned had been in this state for hours. With body core temperatures far below that which induced hypothermia. They had been flat lining for hours. Technically they were dead.

Yet they were brought back.

Now, if their brains were dead. Where was their personality ? It can't have been in the dead brain, which was showing no activity.

This is what I mean by another realm. For something to be returned, it had first to leave and go somewhere, then come back.

I suspect that there is a whole section of knowledge we simply do not have access to.

Not Carolnistri's rather crude demons. or the things out of horror movies.

It is very hard for me to explain what I am thinking here.

HAL
INT21

p.s. you more or less got it with...

...These panoramic, dramatic, emotional and often life altering reports, which cannot be attributed to a brain in flatline, beg the question if they originate in another reality, somewhere out of time and space...
« Last Edit: Jan 16th, 2015, 3:46pm by INT21 » User IP Logged

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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #22 on: Jan 16th, 2015, 4:04pm »

on Jan 16th, 2015, 3:44pm, INT21 wrote:
It is very hard for me to explain what I am thinking here.

HAL
INT21




You actually explain it very well. Except that we're discussing something beyond our knowledge horizon.

I will think carefully about my answer.

HAL/INT21, here's a thought I'd like you to consider in the mean time: could dreams, measurable in the active, living brain, also explore an 'outside realm'? This would mean our brains are not just sustaining our earthly lives, but also transmitting data between our reality and alternate ones. Too weird for you?

undecided

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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #23 on: Jan 16th, 2015, 4:19pm »

Purr,

No, not too weird.

I think I see where you are coming from here. My take on dreams is that they are mostly triggered by something you were thinking about before you drifted off to sleep. These thoughts then get passed around in the brain in an uncritical manner and become mixed with memories and other things that are going on in your sub consciousness,

The interesting thing is that people under general anesthetic don't dream.

But dreams are strange things, they sometimes bring premonitions. Or are these premonitions simply your sub conscious doing a remarkably good job of analysing the known facts and presenting you with it's conclusion.

Again, there is no way we can test this.

HAL
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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #24 on: Jan 16th, 2015, 4:29pm »

...Except that we're discussing something beyond our knowledge horizon...

Agreed, up to a point.

Try kicking this about a bit.


I expect that we all agree that we are made of atoms.

And that the atoms are made of subatomic particles separated by spaces.

I.e quarks and gluons.

And there are even smaller bits with stranger sounding names.

it is fairly easy to inagine out thoughts as electrical signals shuffling around a few pound of brain material.

Now if we try to imagine the electrical signals without the brain. as little fields flitting around in space (which they are if you thing hard about it) then perhaps this is where 'we' really are.
Our bodies just along for the ride and there to enable us to carry out some grand design.

After all, we can do all the thinking we need without arms and legs etc. But we couldn't build anything.

HAL
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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #25 on: Jan 16th, 2015, 4:33pm »

PURR,

TO WIT:

"This would mean our brains are not just sustaining our earthly lives, but also transmitting data between our reality and alternate ones."

AH THOSE COSMIC STEPPING STONES ~ grin

IN THAT PATH OF TELEPATHY ~ AS I'VE ONLY JUST READ ABOUT IN THE NEWS rolleyes ~ THERE ARE THOSE WHOM RECEIVE ~ TRANSMIT ~ AND THE UPPER TIER IS TO DO BOTH ~ SO WOULD IT BE LOGICAL IF YOUR HYPOTHESIS BEING CORRECT ~ TRANSMISSION/RECEPTIONS FROM ALTERNATE REALITIES ~ DIMENSIONS ~ OR JUST PART OF THAT HIGHWAY ~ ONCE YOU CROSS THAT EINSTEIN-ROSEN BRIDGE (BUT HAL ~ SINCE IT CAN'T BE TESTED ASSERTS IT'S A FIGMENT OF ONES IMAGINATION/MACHINATION...OR IS IT? ) ~ BUT OF COURSE THOSE LED ZEPPLIN FANS ~ WHERE'S THAT CONFOUNDED BRIDGE...

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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #26 on: Jan 16th, 2015, 8:06pm »

I am lost, are we talking about remote viewing ?

I know of a case where a person dreaming about dancing caused footsteps to be heard in their aunt's house.

The aunt said the footsteps where in a dancing pattern.

Hard to believe, but 100% true.

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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #27 on: Jan 17th, 2015, 12:59pm »

on Jan 16th, 2015, 4:33pm, ZETAR wrote:
PURR,

TO WIT:

"This would mean our brains are not just sustaining our earthly lives, but also transmitting data between our reality and alternate ones."

AH THOSE COSMIC STEPPING STONES ~ grin

IN THAT PATH OF TELEPATHY ~ AS I'VE ONLY JUST READ ABOUT IN THE NEWS rolleyes ~ THERE ARE THOSE WHOM RECEIVE ~ TRANSMIT ~ AND THE UPPER TIER IS TO DO BOTH ~ SO WOULD IT BE LOGICAL IF YOUR HYPOTHESIS BEING CORRECT ~ TRANSMISSION/RECEPTIONS FROM ALTERNATE REALITIES ~ DIMENSIONS ~ OR JUST PART OF THAT HIGHWAY ~ ONCE YOU CROSS THAT EINSTEIN-ROSEN BRIDGE (BUT HAL ~ SINCE IT CAN'T BE TESTED ASSERTS IT'S A FIGMENT OF ONES IMAGINATION/MACHINATION...OR IS IT? ) ~ BUT OF COURSE THOSE LED ZEPPLIN FANS ~ WHERE'S THAT CONFOUNDED BRIDGE...

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Egyptian relief of squatting birth shown in doorway with Gods attending, suggesting birth bridges different worlds/realities.




ZETAR, my tentative position (as humble non-quantum calculation capable flatskulled primate smiley) is that wormholes can and do exist, and I predict we will attain a level of control over such awesome forces of nature. Give it a couple of centuries.

But I mean to allude to a bridge between worlds that is so close, it is almost overlooked. I imagine that our dreams, endless adventure, meetings and weird ideas we experience whenever we fall asleep, have something in common with our ensoulment while still in mom's womb, and expiring/passing on at death. All three imo represent travel to another place.


Birth=moving from Spiritworld to Earth.


Dream=lifelong pattern of brief excursions into various dreamworlds, including the Spiritworld.


Death=leaving ones body and earthly life behind to return to Spiritworld.



Life then in my model is just one of many worlds/realities which by living as human beings, we pass through as part of a long journey through many realities. Reincarnation notes the times we spend down here.

ZETAR: we might be spending an eternity on the bridge, so we may visit many places.


purr
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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #28 on: Jan 17th, 2015, 1:13pm »

on Jan 16th, 2015, 8:06pm, ghostofsilver wrote:
I am lost, are we talking about remote viewing ?

I know of a case where a person dreaming about dancing caused footsteps to be heard in their aunt's house.

The aunt said the footsteps where in a dancing pattern.

Hard to believe, but 100% true.



Hi Silver, well basically my thread wonders if dreams indicate other realities exist beyond our normal Time-Space. One might ask oneself if we really GO SOMEWHERE when we dream.

The same could be asked about Death, and Near Death Experiences. And uh... where were we before we were born?

Paranormal experiences, like seeing/perceiving ghosts imho could well be part of the same phenomenon. Life is merely passing through...


smiley


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Let us be sure that those who come after will say of us in our time, that in our time we did everything that could be done. We finished the race; we kept them free; we kept the faith.

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xx Re: Moon Dreams
« Reply #29 on: Jan 17th, 2015, 1:29pm »

PURR,

YEAH ~ I QUITE AGREE! ONE MUST...IMHO...PUSH THEIR MIND TO INCORPORATE THAT/THOSE DREAM AQUISITIONS WHILE FULLY CONSCIOUS RATHER THAN RELYING ON THE SUB-CONSCIOUS/REM STAGE AS A TRIGGER TO SUCH REALMS...LIKE ANY MUSCLE (THE MIND) THE MORE IT IS EXERCISED...WELL...YOU GET MY POINT.

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MY QUESTION TO YOU AND ANCIENT CONTACT ~ WHY DO YOU SUPPOSE CERTAIN INDIVIDUALS WERE CHOSEN TO ENCOUNTER VARIOUS ENTITIES? WHAT MIGHT BE THAT COMMON DENOMINATOR?

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