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 sticky  Author  Topic: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TRUTH  (Read 10723 times)
ufaux
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xx Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TR
« Reply #575 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 08:47am »

Unbelievebale! All of yours still working on that hoax?
Very cute kiss
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xx Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TR
« Reply #576 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 08:57am »

on Sep 14th, 2007, 08:47am, ufaux wrote:
Unbelievebale! All of yours still working on that hoax?
Very cute kiss


Oh? and you have some definitive proof that every aspect of this very complex case is a hoax? We'd love to see your research and documentation.

You know .... people coming in here just to be sarcastic and condescending are getting really tiresome. It's also not very mature. Please find another thread that you don't find so silly to participate in, there are plenty to choose from.
« Last Edit: Sep 14th, 2007, 08:59am by MarkM » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TR
« Reply #577 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 10:00am »

on Sep 13th, 2007, 7:53pm, TeachersPet wrote:
This is why I would not dismiss Gorts "Reader" Post at OM outright..he/she did bring out something well worth considering .


LMH has always been and continues to be 100% in support of Isaac and the drone case being true and legitimate. It does not matter what any kooky forum poster types. I find it odd that the only people who are even considering Reader's incoherent babbling are also the ones who can't see the sincerity in the drone case. DISCERNMENT.
« Last Edit: Sep 14th, 2007, 10:07am by Latitude » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TR
« Reply #578 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 10:28am »

I'll say one thing for reader, if you read his very first posts on OMF, he raises some very obvious problems with Isaacs letter. A worthy read.

Who is to tell what he currently mentions is true. Like other lines of enquiry, it shouldn't be ignored just because it doesn't fit everyones way of thinking. The floor is still wide open on this, and no one can say true or false.
Give reader time, it could be important.
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xx Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TR
« Reply #579 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 11:27am »

on Sep 14th, 2007, 10:28am, Saladfingers wrote:
Give reader time, it could be important.

Can't you see you are being played? You'd think you would have learned from Lev. And we're the gullible ones? rolleyes

Which is more gullible? To believe in the drone case when enough evidence is in your face? Or to believe in a hoax with no evidence other than a gut feeling?
« Last Edit: Sep 14th, 2007, 11:53am by Latitude » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TR
« Reply #580 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 11:57am »

Until I came across one of his last posts I was unaware of "reader". I have read all of his posts some 80 plus. Some observations of particular note. He is obviously well spoken and very intelligent. In all of his posts on various threads he is nonconfrontational. It seems that he has particular knowledge and on occasion he provides hints. He is every bit as credible as Isaac.

I get the impression after reading all of his posts some 80 plus posts that he is observing this episode unfold, has particular knowledge, and derives some amusement at it all. That you should refer to him as a nutcase is in itself somewhat contradictory, and shortsighted as one could interpret your blind obsession as falling into that category also. Reviewing your posts I find two predominant themes, 1) even if it is a hoax I don't care the rest of you are all crazy, I'm convinced so don't make up my mind. 2) unlike reader you seem to be very confrontational in promoting this viewpoint. This gives me all the more reason to see the humor "reader" finds in all of this, and supports his credibility.

The only way this will be proven is if Arthur shows us a videotape of the various models he has made, how he has suspended them using fishing line (or something) and how he has cut and pasted (cgi) them into various scenes. But this will not happen. As "reader" has suggested Arthur's intent was to make you people think and that you certainly have done.


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Mmm, yes, very curious, very interesting....


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xx Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TR
« Reply #581 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 12:15pm »

on Sep 13th, 2007, 7:15pm, Nodnunk wrote:
For completeness, here is a visible satellite image for May 16, at 17:00 PDT = May 17, at 00:00 Z
Still looks clear along the California coast.

http://virga.sfsu.edu/pub/composites/wcsathts_vis/0705/07051700_wcsathts_snd_vis_alt.gif

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Nodnunk, am I reading the photo correctly, 17th May?

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xx Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TR
« Reply #582 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 12:44pm »

on Sep 14th, 2007, 12:15pm, Marvin wrote:
Nodnunk, am I reading the photo correctly, 17th May?



Yes, PDT is 7 hours behind Zulu.
00:00 Zulu (May 17) is the same as 24:00 (May 16).
So 24:00 minus 7 hours is 17:00 (May 16) PDT.
Agree?
« Last Edit: Sep 14th, 2007, 12:46pm by Nodnunk » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TR
« Reply #583 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 12:54pm »

on Sep 14th, 2007, 12:15pm, Marvin wrote:
Nodnunk, am I reading the photo correctly, 17th May?



You people are off on another wild goose chase, forget about Mufon. Don't you realize what “reader” has said, investigate that.
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xx Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TR
« Reply #584 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 1:06pm »

on Sep 14th, 2007, 11:57am, Gort wrote:
Until I came across one of his last posts I was unaware of "reader". I have read all of his posts some 80 plus. Some observations of particular note. He is obviously well spoken and very intelligent. In all of his posts on various threads he is nonconfrontational. It seems that he has particular knowledge and on occasion he provides hints. He is every bit as credible as Isaac.


Are we talking about the same Reader? Well spoken? Ha! Yes I admit that for the most part he is non confrontational. But that behavior has absolutely no indication of intelligence. As a matter of fact it may indicate a lack of confidence in one's own grasp of the subject. The guy is certainly not well spoken. He is somewhat hard to understand. He says he's German and that may account for his lack of eloquence. I can't believe you can compare this guy with Isaac who I read as a very intelligent man who is very able to convey abstract and very deep thoughts

It always amazes me that the pro hoaxers are so against all of the Isaac/ drone evidence and so easily discount all of it but will so quickly latch onto anything strange that remotely supports their odd conclusion.

I guess we'll have to wait and see but what I think is happening is we are witnessing a member beginning to implode.
« Last Edit: Sep 14th, 2007, 1:11pm by Latitude » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TR
« Reply #585 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 1:15pm »

Since I do not have tons of extra time, I have concentrating on the Ty Big Basin photos. Of all the drone photos, in the eyes of an novice, this series of photos appear to be the easiest to manipulate.

It appears that Ty sent in “photographs” (on photo paper) according to the statement made by LMH. I quote her:

“June 17, 2007 Big Basin, California - In yesterday's post office mail, I received twelve more images of the latest, more menacing-looking dragonfly-shaped aerial "drone," along with a letter mailed on June 11, 2007, from an eyewitness named Ty. He had also emailed me on June 11, telling me that he was sending photographs he had taken while bicycling with a group of riders near Saratoga, California, in Big Basin.”

http://www.earthfiles.com/news.php?ID=1270&category=Environment

Therefore, it has been assumed that the photos were taken with a non-digital camera. I believe that is not the case.

If you look at the high-res photo, which we can assume was scanned by LMH (or her staff… hey Linda, clean you scanner or was the “dust debris” already in the photo?), we can see parallel lines through the feelers (on the top of the drone), through the blue colored edges of the drone components and through some of the drone components themselves.

According to some experts I have spoken with, these lines are generated when you enlarge a digital picture. Why are the lines there? It has something to do with how the CCD receives, processes the image and records it.

If LMH scanned the photo and did not over enlarge it, these lines should not be visible and a 100% enlargement and they are in the high-res version. Therefore, number one, you have to assume that the original camera used to capture the drone was a digital one.

Number two, the odd thing that was noticed is on the trees. What little of the trees that can be seen in the high-res photo, do not show any parallel lines… even in the blue areas. It is almost as if the drone has been over enlarged and the trees have not. Without the whole high-res photo, one can not be conclusive, but it opens the possibility that the drone may have been pasted in to the photo (and is not really there, even though I thought it was).

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Does any one have another explanation?
« Last Edit: Sep 14th, 2007, 1:55pm by Marvin » User IP Logged

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« Reply #586 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 1:26pm »

on Sep 13th, 2007, 5:23pm, Gort wrote:
from (onthefence omf)

Now we're getting somewhere. Are you saying that you have proof that "Arthur" and "Jack" hoaxed the drones/Isaac issue?

You mention FDDL, is Arthur the one listed here:
http://citeseer.ist.psu.edu/491227.html

Fill in the details please.


So, if this Arthur -- the UT professor - from this website is the one who is being accused of hoaxing this (which I really doubt) it is interesting nonetheless that on his personal website (you can google him to find it) he has his "favorite website" button which comes up as Whitley Streiber's Dreamland -- and he also has a dream journal on his site with many dreams similar to those posted on this casebook. So, he is someone that knows the UFO community (possibly) and/or it could be that he is just pretending to have been the hoaxer, or whoever READER is, has the wrong person.... either way, where is the proof.
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« Reply #587 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 1:28pm »

on Sep 14th, 2007, 1:15pm, Marvin wrote:
Does any one have another explanation?


Marvin,

Can you illustrate the parallel lines you speak of? It was never said what kind of camera Ty used. It could be digital or film. LMH has stated she received 12 5x7 prints along with the typed letter from Ty B. So the hi rez photo could be considered an enlargement. I guess it all depends on how you view it on your monitor. Parallel lines could be explained by anomalies with LMH's scanner or Ty's printer.

One thing you should consider in all this are Steven's photos which captured the same object in the same location on the same day from a different vantage point. How would that figure into a fake Ty photo theory?
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xx Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TR
« Reply #588 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 1:32pm »

on Sep 14th, 2007, 12:44pm, Nodnunk wrote:
Yes, PDT is 7 hours behind Zulu.
00:00 Zulu (May 17) is the same as 24:00 (May 16).
So 24:00 minus 7 hours is 17:00 (May 16) PDT.
Agree?



It is cornfussing, I know.

Yes, 00:00 Zulu would be a day ahead (then minus 7 hours would be 5:00 pm the 16th on the west coast).

God save the Queen.
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xx Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE TR
« Reply #589 on: Sep 14th, 2007, 2:32pm »

Latitude. Honestly, I never said anything about Reader should be believed without proof. I think it is fair enough that someone is given time to explain themselves is it not?
Reader has made some very valid arguments and observations in the past, so I have no reason currently not to allow him that time, even if he is being a little evasive. What is the rush?

(Note: I started writing this some hours ago but had to leave it because I went out. On return, reader has explained himself, and I see what he was doing. My above comments stand, and he did explain his posts... see)

As for evidence of it being real, well all I can say is that it is evidence without any substantiation or verification. So such hopes should not be pinned upon it. You have to understand, that no one who believes that it could be a hoax pin hopes on that. The hope for anyone is that it is real, and this whole silly tension between the two camps shouldn't exist.

If some light can be shed on this case that leads in one direction or the other, then everyone should welcome it.

There is no enlightenment to be gained from a lie. To invest such hopes and dreams without verification is detrimental to the study of this entire phenomenon. To believe this is real, is only so much a gut feeling as to believe it is a hoax, and the given 'evidence' is proof of nothing without verification. I don't see how you can argue otherwise!

...'what can be asserted without evidence, can also be dismissed without evidence.'

Quote- Derren Brown.



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