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 sticky  Author  Topic: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Truth  (Read 5122 times)
DrStern
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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #270 on: Dec 17th, 2008, 4:03pm »

I rest my case.

Please can you All have a Merry Christmas, And for once think "out of the box"?

DrStern
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Marvin
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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #271 on: Dec 17th, 2008, 4:06pm »

on Dec 17th, 2008, 3:37pm, DrStern wrote:
Ps: I said TY (The photographer) changed his position...

PPS: If you're not behaving right, I'll consider reclaiming my Christmas gift for you...and you wouldn't want that! wink



My apologies if I misunderstood what you said:


on Dec 17th, 2008, 12:34pm, DrStern wrote:
Marvin, I think TY did move, and the forground image of the trees changed, but the farther trees stayed in the same position.

Maybe this is where the evidence halts, because we don't know the exact perspective, but he sure didn't move more than a couple of steps...



It seemed to me you were implying the background trees stayed in the same position (photo to photo). Clearly, the photographic evidence does not support this point of view.



As for Christmas gifts, the best gift (IMHO) would be the fellowship we share here at the Casebook. What more could one want? smiley
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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #272 on: Dec 17th, 2008, 4:11pm »

on Dec 17th, 2008, 2:20pm, ABCStore wrote:
I would say, all the factors outlined by DrStern plus the fact that it is super-difficult to come up with a something totally different and alien to us with such a compelling bag of evidence.
I was saying from the beginning it's not about being able to re-create the model in the computer, it's about producing the whole idea from nothing. Only a few geniuses throughout history were able to truly think outside the box.

ABC



Proof is not about what is "impressive" or "compelling."

Proof is about what is "factual."

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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #273 on: Dec 17th, 2008, 4:17pm »

on Dec 17th, 2008, 2:25pm, Radi wrote:
Not to get off track here but something wrong with this picture if I remember correctly...Wasn't pluto declared no longer a planet in 2006... grin wink laugh



It's planet like...


(yes, it is an old example of relitave sizes... but it still works, even for the dwarf. wink ). grin grin grin
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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #274 on: Dec 17th, 2008, 4:20pm »

on Dec 17th, 2008, 3:07pm, ABCStore wrote:
I am sorry, but I don't see "two light sources"... Everything in the picture is within normal.

IMHO.

ABC



Then you are welcome to your opinion, bless your heart. wink
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DrStern
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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #275 on: Dec 17th, 2008, 4:25pm »

Marvin, I love you! You are the best!

Here's a second present for you: (And all here are invited in!)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwId01XG2ug
For those interested: http://www.paramounttheatre.com/resource.html

Please enjoy, as this will be my last post here on UFO Casebook for a while.

Signing off,

DrStern
« Last Edit: Dec 17th, 2008, 5:11pm by DrStern » User IP Logged

Marvin
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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #276 on: Dec 17th, 2008, 5:35pm »

on Dec 17th, 2008, 4:25pm, DrStern wrote:
Marvin, I love you! You are the best!

Here's a second present for you: (And all here are invited in!)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwId01XG2ug
For those interested: http://www.paramounttheatre.com/resource.html

Please enjoy, as this will be my last post here on UFO Casebook for a while.

Signing off,

DrStern



An awesome gift by far! Happy Holidays and a Merry Christmas!


Edit to add... do not be a stranger here Doc. Come back soon.

And a gift to you and all here at the Casebook...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oe-dDn8Bee8
« Last Edit: Dec 17th, 2008, 5:41pm by Marvin » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #277 on: Dec 17th, 2008, 7:38pm »

Marvin, try, for once, to think at a difference perspective. Instead of saying to yourself "it is not possible", try to figure out how it could be possible. Think of it as a tricky problem at the test. Any explanation will do, even if the photographer had to go 20 feet up in the air.

ABC
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TeachersPet
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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #278 on: Dec 18th, 2008, 01:13am »

Perhaps its the word possible, when maybe what you mean most probable and highly improbable., within a range of possibilities..
Knowing what the limitations were from onset, it would be highly improbbible. That does not eliminate an astronomically insignicant possibility, but itdoes not make it probable.

If you try hard enough, lots of things are possible. but they get farther away from what may have actually happened..
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« Last Edit: Dec 18th, 2008, 01:14am by TeachersPet » User IP Logged

Marvin
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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #279 on: Dec 18th, 2008, 09:41am »

on Dec 17th, 2008, 7:38pm, ABCStore wrote:
Marvin, try, for once, to think at a difference perspective. Instead of saying to yourself "it is not possible", try to figure out how it could be possible. Think of it as a tricky problem at the test. Any explanation will do, even if the photographer had to go 20 feet up in the air.

ABC




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1111’s 3D pole study

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1111’s 3D pole and Drone study (top view)

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1111’s 3D pole and Drone study (camera view)

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My 2D study


Both show two light (non-interacting) sources… meaning the Drone is post added to the photo.


What did Nekitamo have to say about this (who happens to be a Global Moderator and Founding Dronie at the DRT):


on Dec 12th, 2008, 04:04am, nekitamo wrote:
But what I really wanted to say is this: IMO, we can't figure out what really happens with light in pic0016 without some kind of 3D analysis, either using CG or - even better - real models. Why do we still discuss some "lines" drawn on 2D images over and over again when we already have results of advanced 3D analysis from multiple independent sources? If I remember correctly, practically everyone who did 3D computer analysis (including myself) noted the following "problems":

1. There's a significant misalignment of shadows on the drone and the pole. Here's an illustration using two drones with the one on top tilted and rotated to achieve similar shadows as in Raj's image:

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2. Even thus tilted and rotated, shadows on the top drone in previous example still don't quite fit those in Raj's images. In order to reproduce them correctly, we have to use a local (or "point") light source, like this:

User Image

3. Feel free to add other problems I forgot to mention here.

Please excuse my simple 3D models, but you can also find similar results from other 3D analysts in other forums with much better quality. As for problems I discovered using other methods of analysis, I'd also like to point out this thread at the DRT forum. Now, could we please move on from discussing "crude" 2D analysis methods and some reappearing issues that IMO seem irrelevant in light of the above mentioned research and continue our analysis from the (IMO) already achieved, much more advanced point where we left it?

Btw, note that I'm not offering any kind of conclusion here, just presenting facts as I see them.


Even Nekitamo is finding the issue and more that is not correct in the photo.

Your debate is not with me, but with anyone who has done a 3D analysis. All of the 3D analysis just confirm my analysis (and conclusions of two light sources). Maybe you should debate Nekitamo?
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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #280 on: Dec 18th, 2008, 10:06am »

Marvin,
I was referring to Ty's pictures...

ABC
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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #281 on: Dec 18th, 2008, 10:48am »

For the record Marvin, the first three images you posted in your last post were not created by me.

The first image was created by SPF33, after I explained the shadows at OMF with my renders.

The second two images were created by Kris A.

However both images completely show MY conclusions. Making it 3 completely different people from different places on the Earth coming to the same conclusion..

Here is a song I dedicate to everyon LOL:
http://www.actionext.com/names_t/tool_lyrics/anema.html

Here's the lyrics:

Some say the end is near.
Some say we'll see armageddon soon.
I certainly hope we will.
I sure could use a vacation from this

Bulls**t three ring circus sideshow of
Freaks

Here in this hopeless f***ing hole we call LA
The only way to fix it is to flush it all away.
Any f***ing time. Any f***ing day.
Learn to swim, I'll see you down in Arizona bay.

Fret for your figure and
Fret for your latte and
Fret for your hairpiece and
Fret for your lawsuit and
Fret for your prozac and
Fret for your pilot and
Fret for your contract and
Fret for your car.
Fret for your drones. :lol: jk

It's a
Bull***t three ring circus sideshow of
Freaks

Here in this hopeless f***ing hole we call LA
The only way to fix it is to flush it all away.
Any f***ing time. Any f***ing day.
Learn to swim, I'll see you down in Arizona bay.

Some say a comet will fall from the sky.
Followed by meteor showers and tidal waves.
Followed by faultlines that cannot sit still.
Followed by millions of dumbfounded dipxxxxs.

Some say the end is near.
Some say we'll see armageddon soon.
I certainly hope we will, cuz'
I sure could use a vacation from this

Stupid S**t
Silly S**t
Stupid S**t

One great big festering neon distraction,
I've a suggestion to keep you all occupied.

Learn to swim
Learn to swim
Learn to swim

Mom's gonna fix it all soon.
Mom's comin' round to put it back the way it ought to be.

Learn to swim.

F**k L Ron Hubbard and
F**k all his clones.
F**k all those gun-toting
Hip gangster wannabes.

Learn to swim.

F**k retro anything.
F**k your tattoos.
F**k all you junkies and
F**k your short memory.

Learn to swim.

F**k smiley glad-hands
With hidden agendas.
F**k these dysfunctional,
Insecure actresses.

Learn to swim.

Cuz I'm praying for rain
And I'm praying for tidal waves
I wanna see the ground give way.
I wanna watch it all go down.
Mom please flush it all away.
I wanna watch it go right in and down.
I wanna watch it go right in.
Watch you flush it all away.

Time to bring it down again.
Don't just call me pessimist.
Try and read between the lines.

I can't imagine why you wouldn't
Welcome any change, my friend.

I wanna see it all come down.
suck it down.
flush ďt down.
« Last Edit: Dec 18th, 2008, 10:49am by neveleeleven » User IP Logged

Romans 12:6
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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #282 on: Dec 18th, 2008, 11:48am »

on Dec 18th, 2008, 09:41am, Marvin wrote:
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My 2D study


Both show two light (non-interacting) sources… meaning the Drone is post added to the photo.



Hi Marvin,

If you are using the glare coming off of the metal tag as an indication that there are two sources of light in this photo, then I have a counter point to make about this assumption. The tag is metal and it is going to reflect and refract light in a completely different way then the surface surrounding it. IMO it is entirely possible that this light on the tag comes from the same angle that highlights the drones.

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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #283 on: Dec 18th, 2008, 12:16pm »

Studies and research by some very bright people have proven that there are two distinct light sources. Whether or not "drone believers" want to accept this evidence is another matter. They do not have to accept it at all. But I have yet to see any research or study that refutes the two light source conclusion. All I ever see or hear is that the conclusion is wrong....never why it is wrong.

I personally believe that the drones started as viral marketing for the SCC tv show but that the viral campaign timing was screwed up due to the writers strike. So the campaign was abandoned. Those that fell for it have kept whatever spark that remains from going completely out.

The SCC viral marketing explains the quality daylight photos (done with state of the art CGI programs and a nice budget) and the anonymous witnesses who, for all intents and purposes do not even exist.

But I guess that "dronies' will continue to believe, defend, and investigate until hell freezes over lol! wink
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Marvin
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xx Re: #7 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #284 on: Dec 18th, 2008, 12:38pm »

on Dec 18th, 2008, 10:06am, ABCStore wrote:
Marvin,
I was referring to Ty's pictures...

ABC


My bad.

The Ty photos have an issue that is unique to themselves. The trees (any of them) lack any change in perspective from photo to photo. If you go back and read the analysis, it is talked about. You can over lay all of the photos and the leaf positions (outer edges) and *tree outlines do not change. Leaf and tree outlines will quickly change with just three foot steps (as proven by experimentation). Ty’s trees (outline and shape) do not change with “camera movement” as one would expect them to do. So DrStern’s assertion is intuitively correct, but there is no physical way to actually reproduce it in the real world. Ty’s photos give the appearance of being one photo of the trees that has been cropped different ways to give the illusion of being different photos.

Move the camera 20 feet in any direction and you will not be able to reproduce Ty’s photos… so good luck on keeping an open mind on that.

*It has been suggested that the wind is blowing in the photos… but the leaves in the outline of the trees show no evidence of that being the case… a wind strong enough to move branches around would change the profile or outline of the trees, but again this is not happening in Ty's photos (as proven by experimentation).
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