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 sticky  Author  Topic: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Truth  (Read 55818 times)
neveleeleven
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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1050 on: Jun 3rd, 2009, 9:48pm »

Tomi holy s**t, you have bad memory.

When I first started discussing this dumb HOAX, I started by proving that the "antigravity" device is CGI, in ATS. PURE CGI, there is more lighting problems in the "antigravity" device then there is with every drone image.

Not only are the shadows FAKE, but ALL of the symbols and characters on it are FAKE too. The reason there is an illusion of "detail" is because of the "texture map" on the CGI model. You don't even have to be a pro to make a texture map, its basically just an image. You can take a picture of something painted in real life, and apply it to your 3D model, so it looks painted in the model. DONT YOU KNOW THAT YET?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texture_mapping

You really need to learn about texture mapping, Tomi....

The "antigravity" device is a PIECE OF S**T. It's half mirrored! What that means is, only half of the device was created in CGI, and the other half was CLONED and MIRRORED. That is why the "symbols and characters" are mirrored too. In 3D Studio Max they have a tool called "symmetry" that does this for you.

This is what CGI artists do when they want to SAVE TIME, or when they are LAZY. ALL CGI modelers are lazy in one way or another, they look for ways to add detail with minimal amount of work. A good example is a car. Look at almost any car modeling tutorial, and you will see that they create HALF of the car first, either the left or the right side. When they finish, all they do is CLONE and MIRROR the half they made, and then weld them together (symmetry tool does this automatically), to get a complete car with identical sides, because a car is usually symmetrical.

http://www.dmu.com/maxmodel/maxm13.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symmetry

Professionals usually do texturing before using the symmetry tool, so both sides are textured identically. However, if you use characters and symbols on your texture, then use symmetry, they will be mirrored too (just like the Isaacs device). This is why real professionals use "detail/decal maps" for characters and symbols that aren't supposed to be mirrored.

So the "antigravity" device has major points against it for CGI:

1) Evidence of "symmetry tool" used. (symmetrical model, and mirrored characters).

2) Fake shadows with a low "rays/samples" and "filter" light setting. (shadows aren't solid, they are grainy).
http://www.kxcad.net/autodesk/3ds_max/Autodesk_3ds_Max_9_Reference/graphics/il_light_tracer_filter_samples.jpg

3) Missing highlights/reflections.

4) Evidence of image manipulation on the following image:
User Image

THE ENTIRE HOAX IS CGI!!!!


« Last Edit: Jun 3rd, 2009, 9:49pm by neveleeleven » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1051 on: Jun 3rd, 2009, 10:02pm »

This is a closer look at the FAKE shadows which show ABSOLUTE signs of being CGI.

User Image

You can see on the left the "antigravity" device's shadow is grainy. Just like it would be on a low ray/sample setting in CGI. The image on the right shows different sample settings 5, 30, 100. If the "antigravity" device was created with Light Tracer, I would guess the Rays/Samples setting was somewhere between 30 and 100.

This is a quick tutorial using Light Tracer, read the "Rays/Samples" and the "Size Filter" sections:

http://www.kxcad.net/autodesk/3ds_max/Autodesk_3ds_Max_9_Reference/light_tracer.html

You have to be a complete CGI noob to not spot this...

There are so many different possible light and shadow settings that it would take quite some time for someone to create an exact replica of ANY CGI image.
« Last Edit: Jun 3rd, 2009, 10:12pm by neveleeleven » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1052 on: Jun 3rd, 2009, 10:49pm »

grin grin

I remember when I first saw the "pigasus" device and noticed the mirrored lettering and the "airbrushed" shadow effect and thought, "Oh please! Nobody is going to believe that!" Boy was I wrong! They could have used a light box. rolleyes Since the lettering is part of the function... and on and on. That's when I left the field for several months. It was all so retarded. I am boggled of the mind that we are still arguing about that crap. I knew nothing about CGI, really, at that point, so I did not know what to call cloning or mirroring, but it wasn't hard to see what had been done. I mean, Duh!
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Gort
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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1053 on: Jun 4th, 2009, 12:25am »

She knows its a hoax, doesn't matter, she just likes the attention. You can show her everything, she'll still ask questions.
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neveleeleven
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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1054 on: Jun 4th, 2009, 12:29am »

on Jun 3rd, 2009, 10:49pm, Stubble Dot Pi wrote:
grin grin

I remember when I first saw the "pigasus" device and noticed the mirrored lettering and the "airbrushed" shadow effect and thought, "Oh please! Nobody is going to believe that!" Boy was I wrong!


I thought the same thing. lol

Actually, just seeing the plain white environment that resembles a light box, my B.S. detector went off.

The all white environment and floor (light box style) is normally called a "Work In Progress (WIP) Render" in the CGI world.

http://www.3dvalley.com/tutorials/rendering-wip-images-in-3d-studio-max

In step #4 in the above tutorial, you create a "plane" for a floor, and make it white, so you can place the object on top of it to render shadows on the floor. Usually, you try to hide the "edges" of the "plane" so the model looks like it is in a light box. However, if you have a reflective surface, it is going to reflect the edge of the plane.... it does that on Isaacs device...

I made an example: First I created a cylinder, gave it a mirror reflection (raytrace reflection), then I made a yellowish sphere, then I created the white plane (floor).

User Image

As you can see in the above image, the mirror like cylinder is reflecting the yellow sphere, and it is also reflecting the edge of the white floor/plane where it meets with the grey environment (like a horizon).

Isaac's device is reflecting the edge of the white floor/plane too!!

This proves that Isaac's device is NOT in a light "BOX", it is actually sitting in a 3D render software on a light "PLANE", and you can see the edge of the plane in the reflection.

....aces are wild.

p.s. -to whom this may concern- feel free to add this observation to dronehoax.com, you have my permission.
« Last Edit: Jun 4th, 2009, 01:51am by neveleeleven » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1055 on: Jun 4th, 2009, 02:28am »

It's good to see these opinions about the antigravity device. I have no experience using cgi programs and that is why it is important to have everyone express their opinions who can weigh in with experience who use these. I'm taking on board what you have said about the edge of the "horizon" showing up on the device. I'm not convinced this is cgi yet. What about the "skin"? It seems it is very hard to get this same effect for the guys working on the model over at drt.

What if that edge is actually light reflected from a floor of a light box? How can you know it is not light reflected in real life? Wouldn't a light box produce the same effect on an object? And the detail of distressing on the object. Has anyone really considered how much of that is worked into this object? No-one so far has commented regarding this aspect.

All any of us non-experts of cgi can do is listen to the opinions and observe the results of those who are doing this research. As far as I've read over on drt, hpo and spf are having a hard time matching the "lightbox" effect and the skin. The last attempt on the skin surface by spf was pretty remarkable, but didn't he say that the surface effect on that object is extremely hard to achieve? I'm only observing here and rationalising this to myself and posting the questions. One should not be criticised for doing this. It is necessary.

@ Gort, attention is not what I am after here. Contrasting points of view, to learn or just express one's self is not "attn seeking", it is open communication. Are you saying Gort, that I should remain silent because anything I say in your mind is worthless attention seeking? Well, you basically are saying that any of my opinions are worthless. And many may think that. But until you have all the answers you really only have your opinions too. JMO.
« Last Edit: Jun 4th, 2009, 02:58am by tommi01 » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1056 on: Jun 4th, 2009, 05:06am »

old old old bla bla bla

nothing new just keep it going


maybe contribute something new


if you can
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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1057 on: Jun 4th, 2009, 06:13am »

on Jun 4th, 2009, 05:06am, Gort wrote:
old old old bla bla bla

nothing new just keep it going


maybe contribute something new


if you can


I don't want to start a contention here with you Gort, but I just read the last 10 posts you have made on this board and I would like to know where you get off. You have made no contribution of any new information, you have asked no questions, you have only criticised everyone else. You brought up my name numerous times in your posts and yet accuse me of attention seeking!

You accuse me of being a nutter who believes everything, and throw me in with the tin hat crowd over on Mufon. That is not true, I'm pretty skeptical but open minded. I am not frozen in a belief system and I have the ability (unlike some here) to see things not just as black and white but also the gray points inbetween. Something you might try cultivating if it is not too late.
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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1058 on: Jun 4th, 2009, 06:26am »

on Jun 4th, 2009, 05:06am, Gort wrote:
old old old bla bla bla

nothing new just keep it going


maybe contribute something new


if you can


Gort, I can not contribute anything new. My wonderment about the antigravity device or my opinions is all I can add right now. Don't you realise that I was put out of drt for advocating a more unified approach to solving this case. I can see their point though and appreciate it, they will not take this kind of verbal onslaught from those with opposing opinions.
But it unfortunately leaves a great deal about this case unexpressed and unaddressed. Occassionally I have to address these issues. I'm so sorry this annoys you as well.
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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1059 on: Jun 4th, 2009, 06:43am »

on Jun 4th, 2009, 02:28am, tomi01uk wrote:
What about the "skin"? It seems it is very hard to get this same effect for the guys working on the model over at drt.

I'm no CGI expert or even user of any of these programs but from looking at neveleeleven's post #1051 you can see texturing(grain?) vary throughout the image as the fake shadow quality is altered. It is interesting that as quality (iteration) levels are reduced it can actually give impression of more realism in some things. Hard to describe.

My first thoughts on that anti-grav picture was a scan of a photo of a model. The grain stood out for me. But the more I learn the more I know not to trust a lot of what I see in images anymore. I have to often yield to the opinions of those with years of experience in this field and not just what my eyes see and I think in regards to the technicals of the presentation. The story behind the images are, of course, another matter. grin
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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1060 on: Jun 4th, 2009, 08:18am »

on Jun 4th, 2009, 05:06am, Gort wrote:
old old old bla bla bla

nothing new just keep it going


maybe contribute something new


if you can


Thanks Gort. This is indeed tiresome, and needs to be exposed for what it is. One post Tomi is DRT, all "we this" and "we that." Then when it suits her rhetoric, she is an outcast who is just trying to find the truth.

Whether they are paid to do so or not, whether they realize it or not, or even whether or not they care, the DRT is functioning as an important part of the hoax. Without those people, in whatever capacity at the time, the hoax would have died long ago and been forgotten. As clueless and fractious as ufology can be, it was well represented by Mufon. Ufology looked at the drones, shook its collective head and snorted, and went on with its business. I am starting to wish I had done the same.
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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1061 on: Jun 4th, 2009, 08:23am »

When masc came in here the goal was close the thread. Failing that..we now have tomi, a known thread killer. An MP# was made just to honor her ability. Unprecedented.
She states all she can add to the discussion is her Awe of the complexity, that anyone would go thru that trouble. These are not just anybody Then she is not familiar with the movie business.
Why would steven spielberg go thru the troble of getting UFO experts on his film as consultants..Attention to detail..
both in narrative and film.
How is this surprising in a hoax viral. Its not, especially when the goal is longterm.
What if the consultants here included Disclosure people, it had hypnotists for lands sake, SCC Natalie Chaidez and her executive Directors Asst. like assistant Jessica Lowery helped canvass canvass the UFO community .
They had the past work done already from Zoics involmnent , and detected by Marvin and myself and others..in past films.So its not l starting from scratch..
Why?..Detail..veracity..
Its enormous to Tomi but routine for them.
The Devil is in the details.
And we have them by the tail.
I suggest all members refrain from responding to questions or comments by her or masc that are rhetorical in nature,
There are ample threads even poetry threads on OM that can accommodate such subject but highly immaterial commentaries.
I will return to where we left off.
The search for the people, not ETs behind the story.
The real global Truth, not the Shock and Awe one get from ones pants being pulled down and not getting over it .
Pull them up..move on.








« Last Edit: Jun 4th, 2009, 08:35am by Quincy » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1062 on: Jun 4th, 2009, 09:01am »

on Jun 4th, 2009, 08:18am, Stubble Dot Pi wrote:
Thanks Gort. This is indeed tiresome, and needs to be exposed for what it is. One post Tomi is DRT, all "we this" and "we that." Then when it suits her rhetoric, she is an outcast who is just trying to find the truth.

Whether they are paid to do so or not, whether they realize it or not, or even whether or not they care, the DRT is functioning as an important part of the hoax. Without those people, in whatever capacity at the time, the hoax would have died long ago and been forgotten. As clueless and fractious as ufology can be, it was well represented by Mufon. Ufology looked at the drones, shook its collective head and snorted, and went on with its business. I am starting to wish I had done the same.


When I say "we".. I mean the whole community. Not DRT but everyone. And if you want to take that cynical approach to the work drt has done, it's your right.

You seem to think that you have all the answers by just dismissing this case as a hoax. If that satisfies you, why are you still reading this thread?

What the DRT has done has been to set this case on a foundation of facts, inspite of the initial bias of some members of the drt, they provided conclusive evidence that even contradicted their beliefs. You can't ask for more than that from a group. Without their continued efforts we would not know what we do today. Ok.. other people outside of drt have provided answers and insights too.. and that is EXACTLY why I have taken the position I have. Believe what you want, but if you are after the truth about the people and this case I suggest you too need to cross check your facts and opinions.
« Last Edit: Jun 4th, 2009, 09:03am by tommi01 » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1063 on: Jun 4th, 2009, 09:07am »

Good idea, Sammy. The Drone Rehash Team hasn't come up with anything new in months, and that was the astonishing revelation of the pole location. Zounds! What clever people! How on earth did they ever find that? shocked
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xx Re: #8 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1064 on: Jun 4th, 2009, 09:11am »

on Jun 4th, 2009, 08:23am, Sammy Davis Jr. wrote:
When masc came in here the goal was close the thread. Failing that..we now have tomi, a known thread killer. An MP# was made just to honor her ability. Unprecedented.



Yeah, that's true. I can't figure it out, but somehow I manage to kill threads. rolleyes This one though has a life of its own and it is to explore and discuss the drone saga.
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