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 sticky  Author  Topic: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Truth  (Read 67852 times)
tommi01
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1200 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 03:57am »

on Sep 16th, 2009, 03:34am, Klatunictobarata wrote:
Do you tomi, believe that LM Howe:

a.) ...posesses more evidence about the drones than she admits to,


Evidence as opposed to theories or leads that may come to her? NO.

Quote:
b.) ...do you believe in your heart of hearts that she knows more about this affair than she has written?

See above. NO.
I'm sure in my heart of hearts, and from conversations with her, that if LMH had any substancial answer to the drones mystery then she would provide maximum exposure to the saga.

Edit to add: LMH has years of experience as an investigative journalist and has seen her fair share of tribal contentions in the UFO field. She will use her best judgement in how to carry this case forward. I am not privey to her current research with the PI's but I respect their integrity to get to the bottom of this.
« Last Edit: Sep 16th, 2009, 06:53am by tommi01 » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1201 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 05:26am »

What about the unreleased hi-res scans?
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1202 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 05:56am »

on Sep 16th, 2009, 05:26am, murnut wrote:
What about the unreleased hi-res scans?


Those scans would go a long way out in the public, generating analysis. I personally hope that once LMH has made sufficient analysis of this matter herself, in time, she will release them.
« Last Edit: Sep 16th, 2009, 06:40am by tommi01 » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1203 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 06:56am »

on Sep 16th, 2009, 05:56am, tomi01uk wrote:
Those scans would go a long way out in the public, generating analysis. I personally hope that once LMH has made sufficient analysis of this matter, in time, she will release them.


So if I am reading you correctly, you personally believe that LMH is still analyzing the hi-res scans for some future use or purpose after two and a half years?

To what end, tomi?

_________________________

on Sep 16th, 2009, 05:56am, tomi01uk wrote:
I'm sure in my heart of hearts, and from conversations with her, that if LMH had any substancial answer to the drones mystery then she would provide maximum exposure to the saga.


I guess that means you still hold out the possibility that she will solve this "mystery" as she has the best possible evidence that anyone knows of, correct?

Or are the original hi-res scans in her posession NOT the best evidence in this case?
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1204 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 07:28am »

on Sep 16th, 2009, 06:56am, Klatunictobarata wrote:
So if I am reading you correctly, you personally believe that LMH is still analyzing the hi-res scans for some future use or purpose after two and a half years?

To what end, tomi?

_________________________



I guess that means you still hold out the possibility that she will solve this "mystery" as she has the best possible evidence that anyone knows of, correct?

Or are the original hi-res scans in her posession NOT the best evidence in this case?


That is misquoting what I'm saying and putting the emphasis on those scans. I don't know more than what I've tried to convey here. The ultimate intention of everyone concerned is to solve this case and make the information public without regard to if it is a hoax or not. If not, why the investment in time and research?

edit to add: One sure way of creating an atmosphere where LMH and others will not be so expiditiously motivated to bring information to the public is by venemous attacks when they are using their resources and best efforts to solve this thing.

Encouragement to keep going, support if possible. Recognising the best intentions in people instead of imagining the worst. Giving allowances for the learning curve and adjustments necessary in this case as well as the need for confidencial protection to some shows a great deal more support than has been handed out to the people who are vested with solving this atm.
« Last Edit: Sep 16th, 2009, 07:44am by tommi01 » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1205 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 07:44am »

on Sep 16th, 2009, 07:28am, tomi01uk wrote:
That is misquoting what I'm saying and putting the emphasis on those scans. I don't know more than what I've tried to convey here. The ultimate intention of everyone concerned is to solve this case and make the information public without regard to if it is a hoax or not. If not, why the investment in time and research?

edit to add: One sure way of creating an atmosphere where LMH and others will not be so expiditiously motivated to bring information to the public is by venemous attacks when they are using their resources and best efforts to solve this thing.




Tomi, that was not an attempt at defaming or trapping you or whatever you believe was going on.

I wanted to know if you still believed in certain things, and you answered my question(s).

For a while there I thought you were beginning to come to the conclusion it was all a hoax and that confused me a bit.

Thanks for your responses.
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1206 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 07:49am »

on Sep 16th, 2009, 07:44am, Klatunictobarata wrote:
Tomi, that was not an attempt at defaming or trapping you or whatever you believe was going on.

I wanted to know if you still believed in certain things, and you answered my question(s).

For a while there I thought you were beginning to come to the conclusion it was all a hoax and that confused me a bit.

Thanks for your responses.


It could all be a hoax. It could be 100% hoax. I don't know. Some say if it is a hoax then forget solving the who and why. That is IMO stopping short of getting to the bottom of this, and I hope that doesn't happen.
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1207 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 07:50am »

on Sep 16th, 2009, 07:28am, tomi01uk wrote:
That is misquoting what I'm saying and putting the emphasis on those scans. I don't know more than what I've tried to convey here. The ultimate intention of everyone concerned is to solve this case and make the information public without regard to if it is a hoax or not. If not, why the investment in time and research?


Why? Why should you or I or anyone even care? Why is this hoax more deserving of a truth crusade than any other hoax? Why?

It is a hoax. The origin of the hoax is not that important. What's important is that it is recognized as a hoax and not held up as some great Ufo event.... ( For the sake of Ufology)


What are the PI's even investigating (at someone's great expense)?......it is a hoax. Even if the hoaxers were found, what then? Basically, what the heck is so special about an internet hoax that fooled alot of gullible minds? Are the fooled intent on painting this simple scheme of a hoax as something greater than it is?

"We were fooled because this is the greatest hoax ever in the history of hoaxes!"

No, you were fooled because you were taken in by CGI photos and some creative witness accounts. it really is as simple as that. Why complicate it. The truth is simple, really. A hoax created some hoax victims that refuse to to accept it as a simple hoax.
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1208 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 08:00am »

Tomi, here is another thought to ponder. What if those that are investigating (or funding the investigation) are the actual hoaxers.

What if Earthfiles and C2C was in collusion? What if they orchestrated the whole affair? What if it was simply to get more viewers, more website hits, more attention to them in general? Not saying it is so, but what if?
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1209 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 08:36am »

on Sep 16th, 2009, 03:57am, tomi01uk wrote:
Evidence


Edit to add: LMH has years of experience as an investigative journalist and has seen her fair share of tribal contentions in the UFO field. She will use her best judgement in how to carry this case forward. I am not privey to her current research with the PI's but I respect their integrity to get to the bottom of this.


Reporting the Rudd Kite as a drone and posting it is hardly "Best Judgement" IMHO...
Btw it takes less then an hour to figure out if a photo is fake.... wink
« Last Edit: Sep 16th, 2009, 08:37am by Radi » User IP Logged

Marvin
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1210 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 10:46am »

on Sep 16th, 2009, 07:49am, tomi01uk wrote:
It could all be a hoax. It could be 100% hoax. I don't know. Some say if it is a hoax then forget solving the who and why. That is IMO stopping short of getting to the bottom of this, and I hope that doesn't happen.



If I may… this is the issue and what is at the heart of your research.

As an investigator and researcher, you must have a plan or at least a basic concept of what you need to accomplish. You need a starting point, an ending point and checkpoints (with criteria to meet) along the way… this is so you will know if you are track or not (that is to say, that you are doing the right things and making progress).

As an investigator and researcher, you research is guided by answering a series of what will be interrelated questions. Answering one question will guide you to another question (so on and so on), basic questions should be apart of your plan (you know, that which gives you direction, decision making... and a final destination, which gives you a solution or answer to you investigation).

With all of the time that has passed… and the information at your finger tips, if you cannot determine this is a hoax or not (by now), then you are basically at square zero. There is nowhere for you to go because you have no criteria to get there. You have no investigative plan.

You do not know if this is a hoax because you have no criteria to determine if it is a hoax.

It’s time to do some research, so you will know what we know. Then if you want to pursue who did it, you will be armed with the information and tools to do that. But as it stands, you do not know if it is a hoax. Therefore, how will you be able to find a hoaxer? What criteria will you use, if you do not know (what the criteria should be)?

Best of luck to you Tomi.

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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1211 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 1:42pm »

on Sep 16th, 2009, 10:46am, Marvin wrote:
If I may… this is the issue and what is at the heart of your research.

As an investigator and researcher, you must have a plan or at least a basic concept of what you need to accomplish. You need a starting point, an ending point and checkpoints (with criteria to meet) along the way… this is so you will know if you are track or not (that is to say, that you are doing the right things and making progress).

As an investigator and researcher, you research is guided by answering a series of what will be interrelated questions. Answering one question will guide you to another question (so on and so on), basic questions should be apart of your plan (you know, that which gives you direction, decision making... and a final destination, which gives you a solution or answer to you investigation).

With all of the time that has passed… and the information at your finger tips, if you cannot determine this is a hoax or not (by now), then you are basically at square zero. There is nowhere for you to go because you have no criteria to get there. You have no investigative plan.

You do not know if this is a hoax because you have no criteria to determine if it is a hoax.

It’s time to do some research, so you will know what we know. Then if you want to pursue who did it, you will be armed with the information and tools to do that. But as it stands, you do not know if it is a hoax. Therefore, how will you be able to find a hoaxer? What criteria will you use, if you do not know (what the criteria should be)?

Best of luck to you Tomi.



Why are you telling me this? Have you not listened at all to the basis of what I'm trying to say here, let alone the subtext... ?? I'm not directing this investigation. I'm not even in it anymore.

I'm not a ufo researcher either. I just happened on the drones along with a few others and it evolved into the DRT. I like to research and dig for information.

And hoax, no hoax or partial hoax.. I don't give a rat's petunia wtf it is. I said that before as well. I want to get to the bottom of this and that means finding out who and why as that will also help define what.

You got better ideas.. send them to the DRT.. not to me. And very good luck to you too Marvin. smiley
« Last Edit: Sep 16th, 2009, 2:15pm by tommi01 » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1212 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 2:12pm »

on Sep 16th, 2009, 1:42pm, tomi01uk wrote:
I want to get to the bottom of this and that means finding out who and why as that will also help define what.


Why is it so important for you to know who is at the bottom of it? It is a simple internet hoax that intrigued some gullible minds....thats it. Your endless quest for who and why will never be answered. Who was John Titor? Who performed the Great Lakes Dive Company hoax? Where is the obsession for those hoaxes? You honestly act and sound like someone who got fooled by the drones and now have a personal vendetta because your own gullibility allowed you to become a victim of a hoax.

The drones never fooled me, therefore I am happy that they have been exposed as a fraud and can leave it at that.

Over two years later and not one photo witness has been identified, so what in the world makes you think that anyone is going to find the actual hoaxers? You used the phrase 'get real' to Marvin. Perhaps you should heed your own advice.
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1213 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 2:17pm »

on Sep 16th, 2009, 2:12pm, Jeddyhi wrote:
Why is it so important for you to know who is at the bottom of it? It is a simple internet hoax that intrigued some gullible minds....thats it. Your endless quest for who and why will never be answered. Who was John Titor? Who performed the Great Lakes Dive Company hoax? Where is the obsession for those hoaxes? You honestly act and sound like someone who got fooled by the drones and now have a personal vendetta because your own gullibility allowed you to become a victim of a hoax.

The drones never fooled me, therefore I am happy that they have been exposed as a fraud and can leave it at that.

Over two years later and not one photo witness has been identified, so what in the world makes you think that anyone is going to find the actual hoaxers? You used the phrase 'get real' to Marvin. Perhaps you should heed your own advice.


I could walk away and forget about it. In fact, I've been spending my spare time studying trading again. I just would love to know. I think that this will teach us something important. We may never see the likes of this kind of saga again, and to have it in our back pocket all sussed out.. will be a plus.
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #1214 on: Sep 16th, 2009, 2:24pm »

There’s no real reason to be angry with me… you need to look at what you are saying.

You give the impression to some folks that either you are clueless (let me quote you; “It could all be a hoax. It could be 100% hoax. I don't know.”)… or, that you are apart of “it” (you are just trying to keep the hoax alive). I am just giving you the benefit of the doubt.

I never said you should not continue to investigate the “who and why” (that would be other folks who said that), the issue here… your communicated understanding… you are not able to say it is a hoax. Don’t you need to know what you are looking for, so you will know when you find it (you claim to be looking for the “who and why” which strongly suggest you are looking for a hoaxer… but you are unable to confess there is a hoax)? Do you really need to have plausible deniability on this point (and why)?

I believe this is the heart of contention (on both sides) here, the dancing around what it is (that it is a hoax)…that and the lack of trust on both sides.

But that is the “bed” that has been made.

Have a great one Tomi.

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