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 sticky  Author  Topic: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Truth  (Read 35191 times)
DrDil
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #885 on: Aug 24th, 2009, 1:32pm »

on Aug 23rd, 2009, 6:07pm, Masker33 wrote:
Must we put a bigger stake through the heart of this thing for it to die. We had assumed it was finished as planned. Next will bring the Holy Water and Cross.

Frog in your pocket?

The royal, "We"?

Ohhhh, is that the group thingy? grin

Cheers.
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #886 on: Aug 24th, 2009, 1:55pm »

on Aug 24th, 2009, 1:29pm, DrDil wrote:
Hi Tomi smiley,

I agree that too much time was spent elaborating on the finer details of the Kecksburg case but I believe it was one of James’ “pet cases” and something of a benchmark for Mufon so are you surprised?


Exactly.. suppose "We" Royal or not... wink came into the Mufon structure and demanded that he give us his research on Kecksburg, (his pet project) while we maintain it to be nothing more than a prelude to the drones... His pet project was Kecksburg.. Ours was the drones. Is it any wonder we took offense at this lack of appreciation?
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #887 on: Aug 24th, 2009, 2:01pm »

on Aug 24th, 2009, 1:29pm, DrDil wrote:
As you know Tomi it’s never personal I’m just surprised to see you still believe James is, for want of a better term, a “wrong ‘un” especially when it appears as if your reasoning for assuming such is fatally flawed.....

Cheers!! grin


WE all share a common interest. Cameron didn't. Cameron was demanding information like it was owed to him all the while taking a diametrically opposite opinion about the event, to the one we had. Heads clashed. But primarily we were not going to hand our many hours of hard investigative work still being formed over to this guy...
« Last Edit: Aug 24th, 2009, 2:05pm by tommi01 » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #888 on: Aug 24th, 2009, 2:07pm »

on Aug 24th, 2009, 1:55pm, tomi01uk wrote:
Exactly.. suppose "We" Royal or not... wink came into the Mufon structure and demanded that he give us his research on Kecksburg, (his pet project) while we maintain it to be nothing more than a prelude to the drones... His pet project was Kecksburg.. Ours was the drones. Is it any wonder we took offense at this lack of appreciation?

That’s moving the goal-posts Tomi, unsurprising but surprisingly disappointing.

Funny enough I suspected that you’d single it out so allow me to elaborate as ALL I was implying by, “Pet theory” was by being such it was at the forefront of his mind, and due to the correlation between this and the dates that Isaac stated (or as I prefer alleges) that the crashed UFO/s were discovered then it is a logical correlation to draw.

Again, I feel it necessary to point out this was ONE of the possibilities presented, but even if not and stated as fact, so what? If you find out you are wrong you simply accept it, admit it and move on. Much the same as I guess you did with the thumper Drone, well, after much (i.e. a LOT grin) of time first spent resisting the obvious conclusion.

Cheers!!
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #889 on: Aug 24th, 2009, 2:19pm »

on Aug 24th, 2009, 2:07pm, DrDil wrote:
That’s moving the goal-posts Tomi, unsurprising but surprisingly disappointing.

Funny enough I suspected that you’d single it out so allow me to elaborate as ALL I was implying by, “Pet theory” was by being such it was at the forefront of his mind, and due to the correlation between this and the dates that Isaac stated (or as I prefer alleges) that the crashed UFO/s were discovered then it is a logical correlation to draw.

Again, I feel it necessary to point out this was ONE of the possibilities presented, but even if not and stated as fact, so what? If you find out you are wrong you simply accept it, admit it and move on. Much the same as I guess you did with the thumper Drone, well, after much (i.e. a LOT grin) of time first spent resisting the obvious conclusion.

Cheers!!


grin Yep, sometimes I'm wrong, it's great to admit it as well... wink
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #890 on: Aug 24th, 2009, 2:22pm »

on Aug 24th, 2009, 2:19pm, tomi01uk wrote:
grin Yep, sometimes I'm wrong, it's great to admit it as well... wink

I'll let you know how I feel about it when it happens..... kiss


on Aug 24th, 2009, 2:01pm, tomi01uk wrote:
WE all share a common interest. Cameron didn't.

Your (shared) interest may be primarily defined as the Drones but mine is in the broader UFO phenomenon, warts & all (a.k.a. hoaxes) but in the context of your quote then my “interest” that I thought I had in common with everyone else is best described as simply, “truth”.

Cheers. smiley
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #891 on: Aug 24th, 2009, 2:23pm »

on Aug 24th, 2009, 1:55pm, tomi01uk wrote:
Exactly.. suppose "We" Royal or not... wink came into the Mufon structure and demanded that he give us his research on Kecksburg, (his pet project) while we maintain it to be nothing more than a prelude to the drones... His pet project was Kecksburg.. Ours was the drones. Is it any wonder we took offense at this lack of appreciation?


There is a big difference. Mufon would have allowed you access to any information on the Kecksburg case. They do not hide or conceal information in order to further an agenda. They try to uncover the truth...not bury it. The dronies had a chance to colloborate with a large, well known UFO investigative group like Mufon. They chose not to as if they were guarding national security secrets.

The gist of it, I presume, is that the OMRT had nothing to share, especially no vetted photo witnesses. They spent their time analyzing and hypothesising on how this drone technology worked before it was even shown to be an actual event. James embarrassed them by asking professional questions and expecting professional answers to which they could only respond with bitterness and attitude.

After all this time, there is no justification for the way the dronies acted as the photo witnesses not only still remain anonymous but have only been shown to be deceitful, untruthful, and unreliable. No case can be built around that. James attempted to explain that in the OMF forum but it fell on deaf dronie ears.
« Last Edit: Aug 24th, 2009, 2:42pm by Jeddyhi » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #892 on: Aug 24th, 2009, 2:47pm »

on Aug 24th, 2009, 2:23pm, Jeddyhi wrote:
There is a big difference. Mufon would have allowed you access to any information on the Kecksburg case. They do not hide or conceal information in order to further an agenda. They try to uncover the truth...not bury it. The dronies had a chance to colloborate with a large, well known UFO investigative group like Mufon. They chose not to as if they were guarding national security secrets.

The gist of it, I presume, is that the OMRT had nothing to share, especially no vetted photo witnesses. They spent their time analyzing and hypothesising on how this drone technology worked before it was even shown to be an actual event. James embarrassed them by asking professional questions and expecting professional answers to which they could only respond with bitterness and attitude.

After all this time, there is no justification for the way the dronies acted as the photo witnesses not only still remain anonymous but have only been shown to be deceitful, untruthful, and unreliable. No case can be built around that. James attempted to explain that in the OMF forum but it fell on deaf dronie ears.


Such early days, we were calling pages of ppl with similiar names to the witnesses, trying to find them. We really didn't need the demoralisation from Cameron or the attributes from Mufon.
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #893 on: Aug 24th, 2009, 2:49pm »

on Aug 24th, 2009, 2:22pm, DrDil wrote:
I'll let you know how I feel about it when it happens..... kiss



Yep.. I knew you would say that . grin kiss


Quote:
Your (shared) interest may be primarily defined as the Drones but mine is in the broader UFO phenomenon, warts & all (a.k.a. hoaxes) but in the context of your quote then my “interest” that I thought I had in common with everyone else is best described as simply, “truth”.

Cheers. smiley


I've been interested in this subject since the 80's smiley And I agree.
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #894 on: Aug 24th, 2009, 2:57pm »

I assume you mean Carrion. James Carrion. In what way could he have been demoralising? He offered the group to share what they had that could help show the drones as a real event and to give them full credit for their contribution. That sounds like it would have been a boost to moral....unless that path conflicted with the pro drone agenda.

James and Mufon labeled the drones as a likely hoax or disinformation campaign early on.....that seems to have ruffled some pro drone feathers. But the ruffled feathers could not offer anything to refute that early conclusion. And they were asked if they could again and again.

Ultimately, I believe James inadvertantly embarrassed the OMRT into a bad attitude. It was not his fault that you guys were not ready and only had a pro drone conclusion in mind.
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #895 on: Aug 24th, 2009, 3:10pm »

I was more that content for this series of very real events to be washed away as a silly hoax. All that could be got at this stage is gotten. Surely the debate is nicely wrapped up on the hoax side now.
As I said before, I do know something and relish that fact, but I admit being called back from time to time.
The Royal "WE" like honey to the bear.
Interesting to see what comes next, but do not accuse me of this resurrection, my plans are much further out.
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #896 on: Aug 25th, 2009, 12:46am »

on Aug 23rd, 2009, 4:19pm, Jeddyhi wrote:
Hi DrDil. Thanks for posting that. I remember the James Carrion incident well. I was appalled at how he was treated by the drone believers and how OM staff allowed it to continue. At the time, I was still an Administrator of the OM forum and posted my dismay. It seemed to me then ( and more so later) that OM was catering to the believers of the Drones.

Here is a link to James Carrion's account at OM. View all 65 posts made by James and see how he was professional and courteous as he could be. He asked sensible questions that were answered with evasive attitude. I do not blame Carrion for how he feels towards OM. I said it then and I say it now. That is not the way to treat any International Director of Mufon.

http://lucianarchy.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=viewprofile&user=jcarrion




Strange to look back at that time...I got my first banning from OM during that incident.

And you were/are so right Jed

Sorry to be so late in replying.....hard drive issues
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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #897 on: Aug 25th, 2009, 10:36am »

on Aug 25th, 2009, 12:46am, murnut wrote:
Strange to look back at that time...I got my first banning from OM during that incident.

And you were/are so right Jed

Sorry to be so late in replying.....hard drive issues


I see, so we now have a Grand Poobah
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_Poobah
we owe alligence to?? Or respect?

I really don't want to get into debate here, but Carrion didn't approach us asking for help or insight, he was contentious and opinionated like everyone else at the time. That lowers the bar IMO.
« Last Edit: Aug 25th, 2009, 10:39am by tommi01 » User IP Logged

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« Reply #898 on: Aug 25th, 2009, 10:52am »

No need to get so touchy, Tomi! wink

When I read it today, James Carrion comes off as the National Director of Mufon, willing to view, publish and give credit for whatever the Dronies had....they had nothing, suffered embarrassment, and took it out on James.

You guys dropped the ball that day and have been kicking it ever since. History doesn't lie and the James Carrion thread at OM is a historical record of what happened. It can't be changed, glossed over, or ignored.

That's why it is always best to act in a professional manner while on the internet posting in forums....it is all recorded for posterity.

When a small unknown group of anonymous drone researchers met the International Director of Mufon, you would think that you all would have been thrilled by his offer of publishing your results. But that pro drone stance set in concrete prevented such a partnership from happening.

Was it more important to continue propagating a drone reality than to publish true accurate assessments, even if those assessments did not point to a drone reality?
« Last Edit: Aug 25th, 2009, 12:30pm by Jeddyhi » User IP Logged

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xx Re: #9 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
« Reply #899 on: Aug 25th, 2009, 1:05pm »

on Aug 25th, 2009, 10:52am, Jeddyhi wrote:
That's why it is always best to act in a professional manner while on the internet posting in forums....it is all recorded for posterity.

When a small unknown group of anonymous drone researchers met the International Director of Mufon, you would think that you all would have been thrilled by his offer of publishing your results. But that pro drone stance set in concrete prevented such a partnership from happening.

Was it more important to continue propagating a drone reality than to publish true accurate assessments, even if those assessments did not point to a drone reality?


shocked Aaach! Please tell me this is a windup??
I'm guessing it isn't though... rolleyes Seriously, this isn't worth the time debating because there are two perspectives here never the two shall meet in the middle on this issue it seems.

I had communications with ppl behind the scenes, also with ppl of a much higher "eschalon" than myself.. so all I'm going to say is my position holds on him with no regrets for that particular situation.
« Last Edit: Aug 25th, 2009, 1:22pm by tommi01 » User IP Logged

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