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 veryhotthread  Author  Topic: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..  (Read 18082 times)
mahigitam
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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #75 on: Jan 6th, 2013, 02:59am »

on Dec 30th, 2012, 2:52pm, MysterEd wrote:
Have you read any of the skeptical articles, books, etc. and their analysis and tried to reconcile them with the subject source and your technical background (if applicable) to draw your own conclusions? I realize some material requires a certain expertise, and not knowing your background, reliance on experts is needed. Unfortunately experts disagree as any major court case demonstrates.


Yes, i have read almost all of the debunkers & skeptics arguments against the case. And i have found that some of them are reasonable & some fall between unreasonable/illogical & pure slander. Fortunately the case does not depend upon only one form of evidence but many. We do not have to get stuck & complain about the lack of original negatives/slides/film because there are others forms of evidence in which by the corroborations of prophecies/predictions is considered to be the strongest of them all & which anyone can test for themselves and need not have any expertise at all(assuming common sense is intact grin ).

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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #76 on: Jan 6th, 2013, 10:44am »

on Jan 6th, 2013, 02:52am, mahigitam wrote:
I have already posted this in my earlier post:
"JPL, IPL ASU(Arizona State University), DIAL Labs, UofAz(University of Arizona), SDX, DeAnza Computers Company(DACC), ..etc. These are some of the labs which i came across while superficially looking over the analysis reports. Much info about it was published in Preliminary & Supplementary Investigation Report books published by wendelle.
More info here: http://www.theyfly.com/scientific-experts-comments-meiers-evidence"

Preliminary & Supplementary Investigation Report books are each ~500 pages that specifically covers the investigation on meier case, testing of evidence, labs, equipment,...etc. These are books that are available as torrents.
http://torrentz.in/search?f=billy+meier

Without having any background information & relevance, it is hard to continue any discussion.


Thanks for the links....I'll ck them out.
In brief what was the conclusion of these labs? Did they come down on his side or are they undecided?
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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #77 on: Jan 6th, 2013, 10:46am »

on Jan 6th, 2013, 02:59am, mahigitam wrote:
Yes, i have read almost all of the debunkers & skeptics arguments against the case. And i have found that some of them are reasonable & some fall between unreasonable/illogical & pure slander. Fortunately the case does not depend upon only one form of evidence but many. We do not have to get stuck & complain about the lack of original negatives/slides/film because there are others forms of evidence in which by the corroborations of prophecies/predictions is considered to be the strongest of them all & which anyone can test for themselves and need not have any expertise at all(assuming common sense is intact grin ).



How do the 'prophecies' support anything since anyone could have backtracked to add these things to support them since they were in the possession of the believers?
How does Meier explain the 'garbage can lid' photos, the dinosaur pic from his time travel trip which was taken from a book, and the Semjase pics which were obviously based on magazine and other pics? Does he claim he was framed?
« Last Edit: Jan 6th, 2013, 10:49am by drwu23 » User IP Logged

MysterEd
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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #78 on: Jan 6th, 2013, 11:30am »

Itís doubtful there will be any analysis of original slides. It appears Meier was instructed not to provide them. Some may view that as a convenient excuse. The reasons why will just go off on a tangent as being required of Meierís mission, sign of trying to hide something, justified because of unknown agencies wanting to get them or they were stolen. None of which really prove anything, least of which their subject legitimacy.

So moving to something else for the moment, hereís one prophecy(?) I have issues with:

On pages 34 -38 of the Supplemental Investigative Report by Stevens thereís a recounting of a 1956 Asket transmission to Meier. The original notes were lost in his travels and we are told this was a re-transmission by automatic writing September 1, 1964 in India. One section regards a US president being murdered in 1963 by the CIA and a second political murder to follow 5 years later. Meier does not mention the names but this is clear reference to JFK and RFK by any stretch of the imagination. It immediately jumps out at me and I was not aware of it from any other material Iíve read.

Per the report this was a re-transmission in 1964 - after JFK. Was this re-transmission verified prior to the RFK assassination or is it based on what Meier is telling investigators in the 1970's. In the authors discussion afterwards there is no mention of what has to be a startling accurate foreseeing or recollection from time travel! I wonder why? Is it later in the report? If these contact notes were not proven made prior to the events why should anything in them be believed? I see sites where this is taken as fact and even used to bolster various CIA involvement conspiracy theories with the assassinations. Past recollections of material is not just isolated to this contact note.

I have problems with other notes that are date verified. Are they really providing information and theory that is not already known or under study at the time or even prior? Is the material even always correct? Stretching these into prophecy and picking and choosing the hits only is not difficult nor is it any proof they came from Pleiades sources.

If the background of Meier presented by the author(s) is correct his real world education and experiences far outweigh his limited formal education. Supporting his claims and evidence using arguments of him not being smart enough to do it or produce the contact notes is a fallacy and disservice IMO. He appears well learned in history, various religious teachings, travels and experiences some might consider unsavory to write quite intelligently enough so that average people may not recognize errors. As to missing an arm, thatís no hindrance in his writing and verbal communication of his mission material. Rigging photo shoots in isolation does not seem impossible. No proof he faked certain things but no proof he did not.

Iím still reading and hoping to find verification that other witness who saw the same type craft views (not lights in the night sky) were fully vetted and not just listed as someone who canít be identified (perhaps for legit reasons). There should at least be some formal interview transcripts. * Iím also trying to form an opinion as to who was actually in control of the investigation protocols and conditions Ė the investigators or Meier?

Iím sure nothing new here except perhaps for me. Itís still a very interesting study that involves much more than the UFO photos. A little bit of everything unless one is inclined to believe or write off completely without learning all they can first. However, it would take a lifetime if one desires to read it all before forming an opinion. grin

* Some examples that to me are very poor collaboration of the crafts presented in the Meier photos or other events are in the last link below. Read and decide for yourself. That link was obtained from within the article linked in the first post of this topic thread. Repeated here:
http://www.ufodigest.com/article/mufon-meltdown

Text from this original post linked article:

His first photos were taken in India, in 1964, and a major witness to those events, Phobol Cheng, is a highly credible retired UN diplomat.

Page link after clicking on witness Cheng name.


http://www.tjresearch.info/witness.htm

Should these type testimonials be considered supportive of Meier's claims? undecided
« Last Edit: Jan 6th, 2013, 12:58pm by MysterEd » User IP Logged

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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #79 on: Jan 7th, 2013, 10:13am »

on Jan 6th, 2013, 11:30am, MysterEd wrote:
Itís doubtful there will be any analysis of original slides. It appears Meier was instructed not to provide them. Some may view that as a convenient excuse. The reasons why will just go off on a tangent as being required of Meierís mission, sign of trying to hide something, justified because of unknown agencies wanting to get them or they were stolen. None of which really prove anything, least of which their subject legitimacy.

So moving to something else for the moment, hereís one prophecy(?) I have issues with:

On pages 34 -38 of the Supplemental Investigative Report by Stevens thereís a recounting of a 1956 Asket transmission to Meier. The original notes were lost in his travels and we are told this was a re-transmission by automatic writing September 1, 1964 in India. One section regards a US president being murdered in 1963 by the CIA and a second political murder to follow 5 years later. Meier does not mention the names but this is clear reference to JFK and RFK by any stretch of the imagination. It immediately jumps out at me and I was not aware of it from any other material Iíve read.

Per the report this was a re-transmission in 1964 - after JFK. Was this re-transmission verified prior to the RFK assassination or is it based on what Meier is telling investigators in the 1970's. In the authors discussion afterwards there is no mention of what has to be a startling accurate foreseeing or recollection from time travel! I wonder why? Is it later in the report? If these contact notes were not proven made prior to the events why should anything in them be believed? I see sites where this is taken as fact and even used to bolster various CIA involvement conspiracy theories with the assassinations. Past recollections of material is not just isolated to this contact note.

I have problems with other notes that are date verified. Are they really providing information and theory that is not already known or under study at the time or even prior? Is the material even always correct? Stretching these into prophecy and picking and choosing the hits only is not difficult nor is it any proof they came from Pleiades sources.

If the background of Meier presented by the author(s) is correct his real world education and experiences far outweigh his limited formal education. Supporting his claims and evidence using arguments of him not being smart enough to do it or produce the contact notes is a fallacy and disservice IMO. He appears well learned in history, various religious teachings, travels and experiences some might consider unsavory to write quite intelligently enough so that average people may not recognize errors. As to missing an arm, thatís no hindrance in his writing and verbal communication of his mission material. Rigging photo shoots in isolation does not seem impossible. No proof he faked certain things but no proof he did not.

Iím still reading and hoping to find verification that other witness who saw the same type craft views (not lights in the night sky) were fully vetted and not just listed as someone who canít be identified (perhaps for legit reasons). There should at least be some formal interview transcripts. * Iím also trying to form an opinion as to who was actually in control of the investigation protocols and conditions Ė the investigators or Meier?

Iím sure nothing new here except perhaps for me. Itís still a very interesting study that involves much more than the UFO photos. A little bit of everything unless one is inclined to believe or write off completely without learning all they can first. However, it would take a lifetime if one desires to read it all before forming an opinion. grin

* Some examples that to me are very poor collaboration of the crafts presented in the Meier photos or other events are in the last link below. Read and decide for yourself. That link was obtained from within the article linked in the first post of this topic thread. Repeated here:
http://www.ufodigest.com/article/mufon-meltdown

Text from this original post linked article:

His first photos were taken in India, in 1964, and a major witness to those events, Phobol Cheng, is a highly credible retired UN diplomat.

Page link after clicking on witness Cheng name.


http://www.tjresearch.info/witness.htm

Should these type testimonials be considered supportive of Meier's claims? undecided



If the witnesses are being quoted accurately and they are telling the truth then it would seem to corroberate Meier's claims.
But there are other problems with the case that have been mentioned many times over the years. Do we just ignore those ?
My biggest question is why would advanced aliens contact an obscure Swiss 'farmer' to reveal their message and just give scraps of 'evidence' over the years like the pics and noises but no real disclosure to prove their existence? Surely they know this would lead only to a small group of believers and contention among everyone else. What's the point of it all?
It seems wrong to me somehow in that it's meant to cause confusion and divisiveness and not a message of aliens here for peaceful contact.
As Vallee once asked; are we dealing with 'Messengers Of Deception?
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MysterEd
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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #80 on: Jan 7th, 2013, 10:52am »

Wu, you see nothing odd about many of these witness reports?

Young impressionable children
Testimonials of believers and close acquaintances
Questionable sources and reliability of quoted material
No probing questions
Meier goes off somewhere and then something is seen or heard
Lights in the night sky
Landing prints found afterwards brought up by Meier

Where are concise accounts and reviews of someone seeing the same craft at the same time as shown in his many photos?

What is striking out at me is a very uneasy similarity to many paranormal and phychic claims that simply do not hold up to scrutiny. You may think these side events are caused by some other unknown forces. I lean more towards suggestion and the need to believe for various reasons. The affair appears to stand on the lack of someone being able to prove and explain 100% of how everything was faked rather then any extraordinary claims being able to be proven 100% real.

It's a case of faith for those willing to overlook the issues.


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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #81 on: Jan 7th, 2013, 1:33pm »

Klat...Thanks a bunch for that particular image of Semjase!! She is gorgeous indeed. I have been following along on this thread which is very interesting to say the least. I too have read quite a bit of info on Billy Meier and yes there will always be two sides to this coin. Personally, my interest is drawn to the information, prophecies and different messages from these benevolent aliens as opposed to trying to prove whether Billy was a fraud or a hoaxer. Yes, the whole story seems quite fantastic but so do quite a few others when dealing with stories of contactees/abductees. As most of you know, Mr. Meier is not the only one who claims to have been contacted by a race of ET beings. Is it possible they are all liars, charlatans, fakes or imposters? I sincerely doubt it but then again......we are dealing with a very subjective topic which is constantly being fueled by mis-information and deceipt from those who actually might know if there is truth to any of it. Just my 2 cents.
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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #82 on: Jan 7th, 2013, 3:06pm »

Hi rfraga, I'm starting to dig a little deeper into the messages.
As you said there are issues that makes it very subjective.

There are references about how they are very accurate and ahead of their time. I have not matched the original writings to the claims being made about them. I do not know if they are consistent and based on the original text information alone or helped along by the interpretations of the people trying to promote them. One can make general statements (shotgunning) especially about world affairs, science, etc. and find events that would seem to validate it and snag many believers. Likewise, disproving vague open ended predictions is difficult.

The predictions that give a precise date, name and details need to be proved written before the events. I won't believe someone telling me it's a later re-transmission of a contact made prior to the event(s). How does one determine the real dates some of these predictions were really made?

Anyway, I agree in it being interesting. cool
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drwu23
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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #83 on: Jan 7th, 2013, 3:48pm »

on Jan 7th, 2013, 10:52am, MysterEd wrote:
Wu, you see nothing odd about many of these witness reports?

Young impressionable children
Testimonials of believers and close acquaintances
Questionable sources and reliability of quoted material
No probing questions
Meier goes off somewhere and then something is seen or heard
Lights in the night sky
Landing prints found afterwards brought up by Meier

Where are concise accounts and reviews of someone seeing the same craft at the same time as shown in his many photos?

What is striking out at me is a very uneasy similarity to many paranormal and phychic claims that simply do not hold up to scrutiny. You may think these side events are caused by some other unknown forces. I lean more towards suggestion and the need to believe for various reasons. The affair appears to stand on the lack of someone being able to prove and explain 100% of how everything was faked rather then any extraordinary claims being able to be proven 100% real.

It's a case of faith for those willing to overlook the issues.




Yes it does seem odd to me.....I agree with you in that I don't trust this case. What I'm saying is that if these events ,or some of them, are legitimate then it's not a case of simple space aliens contacting this man.
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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #84 on: Jan 7th, 2013, 3:50pm »

on Jan 7th, 2013, 1:33pm, rfraga wrote:
Klat...Thanks a bunch for that particular image of Semjase!! She is gorgeous indeed. I have been following along on this thread which is very interesting to say the least. I too have read quite a bit of info on Billy Meier and yes there will always be two sides to this coin. Personally, my interest is drawn to the information, prophecies and different messages from these benevolent aliens as opposed to trying to prove whether Billy was a fraud or a hoaxer. Yes, the whole story seems quite fantastic but so do quite a few others when dealing with stories of contactees/abductees. As most of you know, Mr. Meier is not the only one who claims to have been contacted by a race of ET beings. Is it possible they are all liars, charlatans, fakes or imposters? I sincerely doubt it but then again......we are dealing with a very subjective topic which is constantly being fueled by mis-information and deceipt from those who actually might know if there is truth to any of it. Just my 2 cents.


Did you now that FIGU ,and I assume Meier also, claim that only his alien contacts are genuine..?
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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #85 on: Jan 7th, 2013, 4:53pm »

on Jan 7th, 2013, 4:13pm, Dolf wrote:
In fact I know it the other way, that Meir himself claims to be the only one in the World real contactee, and that all the others are... fakes/hoaxes/misenterpretations... whatever.


I'm not so sure of that. I may be wrong but I believe the Pleiades say there are other ET visitors on earth. I recall something in some contact conversations about other contactee's and some possibly being fake. I did not get the impression that other people were not being contacted by other ET or the Pleiades.

Take with grain of salt because I've barely read probably <1% of what's available.

Am I making a supportive comment about Meier? rolleyes

Maybe mahigitam will jump in.
« Last Edit: Jan 7th, 2013, 4:53pm by MysterEd » User IP Logged

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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #86 on: Jan 7th, 2013, 9:13pm »

on Jan 7th, 2013, 4:13pm, Dolf wrote:
In fact I know it the other way, that Meir himself claims to be the only one in the World real contactee, and that all the others are... fakes/hoaxes/misenterpretations... whatever. I know what FIGU is, but never did real research on them, so wouldn't know if they claim the same (but I guess it's most probable, as after all FIGU is Meier's organization smiley ).


This is the only factor on the whole Meier's story that when I found about it, that's when I started considering his whole story suspicious. From here I added a few other details (that I knew already, but weren't really discarded, on a kind of "stand by" status) and... IDK.
I've read and seen credible stuff, but that claim ruined it all for me...



Cheers!

Dolf



Yep..the fact he claims this nails it for me that he's a major trickster.
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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #87 on: Jan 7th, 2013, 9:15pm »

on Jan 7th, 2013, 4:53pm, MysterEd wrote:
I'm not so sure of that. I may be wrong but I believe the Pleiades say there are other ET visitors on earth. I recall something in some contact conversations about other contactee's and some possibly being fake. I did not get the impression that other people were not being contacted by other ET or the Pleiades.

Take with grain of salt because I've barely read probably <1% of what's available.

Am I making a supportive comment about Meier? rolleyes

Maybe mahigitam will jump in.


Dolf is correct in that Meier has said he's the only genuine contactee. I don't know if he still claims that.
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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #88 on: Jan 8th, 2013, 07:23am »

Here's a site that briefly mentions that claim on the Who is Meier Page.

http://billymeierufocase.org/index.html

I'll be searching to find the specifics because it is so hard to tell what gets taken out of context in a lot of this - from both sides. I don't really doubt he may have said it but I'd like to see the exact sources.

What was most interesting in the site above is the explanation and demonstration of the strange UFO noise recordings. Resonating horizontal fishing lines in the wind. undecided I've really got to try that and suggest others do it as well to see if it works. Be sure to do it it in isolation so you are not questioned by the police! grin

I'm sure there is some counter argument as to why this is not true or not a duplication because it does not match 100% the frequency spectrum of Meier's sounds.
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xx Re: Interesting Billy Meier related blog..
« Reply #89 on: Jan 8th, 2013, 08:00am »

Dolf, here's text from the Who is Meier Page: (critical of Meier site)

Meier claims that he is the only person who has been contacted by extra-terrestrials on Earth. He also claims to be the seventh incarnation of the ďprophetĒ connecting Earth to the Plejaren. The first incarnation was Henoch around 11,000 years ago followed by Elijah around 2,800 years ago, then Isiah, Jeremiah, and Jmmanuel (aka Jesus Christ) around 2,000 years ago, and then Mohammed around 1,400 years ago. Yes, Billy Meier claims to be the reincarnation of both Jesus Christ and Mohammed. For more information regarding the Plejarenís history of the universe please watch this video which includes information such as that the Earth started to be formed 646 Billion years ago and that there were originally 40,353,607 different human races in 343 different skin colors and that apes actually descended from human beings.

That sure is a mouthful and many of these claims are countered on the Meier support sites. It's like a ping pong game!
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