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Board Announcements & News >> The Drone Mystery, Isaac's Account >> #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Truth
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#6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Truth
Post by Merlin on Oct 6th, 2007, 04:16am

Please continue with your discussions regards the Drones here.



Merlin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by wreckage on Oct 6th, 2007, 04:59am

OK.. What do we have so far?

[disclaimer: I have zero expertise other than 'common sense', and I'm very comfortable with
that.]

We have some very clear pictures http://www.coasttocoastam.com/gen/page2022.html?theme=light
that two people associated with MUFON...

"Mr. Steve Neil who has and continues to do computer generated images for the History channels
television program 'UFO Files'. The other effects person is a Mr. Marc D' Antonio. He owns and
operates a business in Connecticut named FX Models. http://www.fxmodels.com/"

...claim...;

"They both independently state this object is clearly a CG fake."

http://ufocasebook.conforums.com/index.cgi?board=drone&num=1185472608&action=display&start=315

You can see the dates and the images they studied yourselves.

To throw some kindling onto the fire, I have never seen any forumers either at OpenMinds or here
(at UFOCasebook) actively discussing the points these two gentlemen made. If any of you know of
somewhere where I can see some critical disection of their points, I would be grateful.

(ammendment... ok.. since I started this, I've seen some posts where some of you have looked for
these 'anomolies'. Verdict? ... still inconclusive, apparently).

Now... we have many other self-professed CG experts (some of whom have proven their credentials
by offering some fabulous creations) who, after their investigations, have claimed the opposite.
(that the photos are real) It is also known, and I hope accepted among the 'true believers', that
with enough funding, imagination and knowledge, creating these images on computers is entirely
possible, albeit time-consuming and fairly expensive.

Of course, the probability that the drone images were faked remains high. I only say this because
of the 'silliness' factor. Occam's razor. If it looks unreal, it probably is.

It appears 'though, after intense study, that these images are 'good'. By that I mean that so far,
apart from the MUFON people, the general concensus seems to be that these submitted photographs are
of an extremely high standard if they are fake. In other words, they look 'real'. I have looked at
other forums and sources from other countries which contain other contributions from other 'experts'
who claim that if these images are CG, then they're 'the best they've ever seen'. Please don't ask me
for citations. The 'web is a huge place and I'm sure you all have checked UK and other forums, and I
am by no means qualified to endorse or take issue with any of their comments.

Other photos appear (Rajman, Ty, etc.) All photos so far have been processed in some way, such that
any useful 'exif' data has been either purposely removed, or altered during the copying\re-sizing\scanning
processes. This not unusual. That this would happen is plausable. There is no reason to expect
the 'average Joe/Joanne' to think that this data is important. There is also reason to expect that
if a hoax was perpetrated, that the people responsible would be aware that such data could be useful
in assisting in determining authenticity.

It wholly depends on one's sense of what to expect from the technology that we use - and let's face it -
my job is computers, and I cannot possibly keep up with the progress of computer technology. If I tried,
I would not be able to go to work because I'd be reading all day about what's 'new'.... and I'm a computer
techie.

<unavoidable personal opinion follows> One would expect, however, that an 'investigative journalist'
such as Linda Moulton-Howe, would be acutely aware of such details. She is a busy woman, and I will
say no more other than this: http://www.ufowatchdog.com/hall5.html .

My thoughts are that if I saw something like the drones, I would be yelling and screaming and
telling everybody I could about it. I would not be 'scared of public exposure', and I would be so
incredibly, xxxxed curious that nothing would stop me trying to find and talk to others who have
seen a similar phenomenon. But that is NOT what would happen at all. Of course, this is hugely
dependant on the scale of 'what exactly one thinks one has witnessed, and what would my friends/
family think if I told them?'. Frankly, one can always attain more truthful testimony from those
who have little or nothing to lose.

I have had two anomolous sightings. One at night and one in daylight. Both were extremely
high-altitude 'lights-in-the-sky' affairs, and both changed direction - RADICALLY. Now that I
think about it, I haven't even told my wife about either event. What does that say?

Where were we? I was attempting to offer some sort of general overview, but I can see now that
I have started, it's a larger task than I thought, and one, unfortunately, that I do not have the
time to complete, so I'll just post what I have so far purely because otherwise I would have written
it for no reason.. smiley (oh, and the ingestion of bourbon prevents me from being as accurate as I
would have liked.. )

'Isaac' communicates with Coast to Coast and creates a website on Fortunecity:
http://isaaccaret.fortunecity.com/ and we 'dronies' go nuts. Don't get me wrong.. I remember the
adrenalin I felt when I first saw it, too. Think about that. Think about the mind(s) that may have
created this (probable - again, personal opinion creeps in) huge hoax, and how clever they would have
to be to have the foresight to know that they would elicit those feelings in us, purely by placing that
'information' on a website - or not. Perhaps a sociological experiment on a largish scale is happening
here - perhaps not so large, and instituted by one clever person writing a thesis for a degree....

This is not a great leap, especially when you consider how basically trusting we humans tend to be -
We generally absorb what we are told by others as being genuine. It is our nature. It is also dependent
on our prior conceptions of the source. If no prior experience of the source exists, then we have no
option other than to award the source with a reasonable degree of believeability. Also, think of
the purpose and implications of 'Isaac' being genuine.

Perhaps I should expand on the above first... The situations of 'trust' vary greatly. For example, if
a panic-stricken person ran up to me in the street yelling "my house is on fire.. please help..!" I
would tend to award it a much higher believeability factor than if someone ran up to me in the street and
yelled, "my one-legged pet baboon has just been sucked into a time vortex behind your car!! Help me!!"

As for 'Isaac' being genuine, I'm still of two minds. The first says 'Wow! - This dude or dudette knows
his/her stuff and is either a sociopath or (as above), running some sort of intellectual experiment.
The second says 'he's/she's genuinely nearing the end of his/her life and knows no other way of publicising
their account of how they've spent that life. I sicerely doubt the latter. If reams of paperwork/scans
etc., cannot be forwarded, with evidential backup, to some authoritative body, but rather merely posted onto
a website, then credibilty factors have to be realistically reduced.

I'll still opt for the first, I'm afraid. Maybe, like John Titor, the perpetrator(s) get their jollies
from complete anonymity. </ rant>















Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by RoH on Oct 6th, 2007, 05:10am

Music decoded from the primer! cool

User Image


This is from the member 45letters on OM forum:

Quote:

Ok i finished up my first shot at it...

these are all off of the rotary junction (i think this is what its named) on p121 of the caret docs.

looking at the key i figured it goes counterclockwise from the outside in.

the notes are primary 1/16 for the small ones, and increase with width up to 1/4 notes. the note itself is the length of the bar. i started at the second smallest note at #C7.

also i noticed if the tempo is sped up it works better as a waveform. so if you notice a change in the beat pattern to 1/32 this is why. i addition to this, because there are 3 rings of this bizarre illegible sheet music, i thought perhaps each ring was a separate channel, so i overlayed it about where it should be. but then i realized, given the radius is different, the tempo and pitch might change with each radii. i will play with more down the road.

http://www.4shared.com/file/25773061/dd2a7ef9/fxRiot_introvertsia_25a_-_linguistia_solo.html
http://www.4shared.com/file/25773058/8fdb959e/fxRiot_introvertsia_25b_-_linguistia_dub_fxriot_rmx.html

the first one is a clean copy derived only from the primer..
the second one i remixed with a little beat to make it more enjoyable for us humans to listen to.

enjoy!




Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by nekitamo on Oct 6th, 2007, 07:50am

on Oct 6th, 2007, 04:59am, wreckage wrote:
OK.. What do we have so far?

...

Well, give or take a baboon - you speak my mind!
Great summary, exactly where I stand with this case.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by interocitor on Oct 6th, 2007, 10:06am

Quote:
Now a lesson in manners from the great Lev.
Clever game you and your Salad friend play.
In the end you'll be the first to go.
Only a short time and relief will be mine
The drones are fake and so are you



Nope. Surfer dude. Please stay on topic. The Drones are as real as you. You are right about the short time.
Who is this Leviathan? Is it Biblical?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by interocitor on Oct 6th, 2007, 10:15am

Be very careful: A NON-SALAD APPROVED GRAPHIC FOLLOWS

User Image

Now this is a fake. Do we understand this? This is a real FAKE. OK!!!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 6th, 2007, 10:18am

My mistake...please forgive me.

I apologize to you and all the members here for that post of mine.

My actions are inexcusable.

I am not qualified to comment further

Andy Murray
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by interocitor on Oct 6th, 2007, 10:25am

Who is Andy Murray? Is it Biblical?

NON-SALAD APPROVE GRAFIC FOLLOWS:
User Image

Lets all say it togeather: "THE SHADOWS ARE WRONG"

Now this is a Fake. OK!!!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Merlin on Oct 6th, 2007, 10:34am

Ok enough, i have just killed interwhatever please keep on topic and please respect other members.


Merlin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by onthefence55 on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:06am

on Oct 6th, 2007, 10:34am, Merlin wrote:
Ok enough, i have just killed interwhatever please keep on topic and please respect other members.


Merlin


I for one, welcomed our interocitor overlord.

His representation of ideas is so far out there that you can only be forced to think differently or refuse altogether.

Maybe he could have been given or started a thread to submit his artwork and ideas, instead, with only one thread here the tone is forced into homogeneity.

As part of the Drone enigma and our global search for the truth, we shouldn't narrow playing field to specific lines of thought.

Kris has elevated himself to the top in this game, it is only expected that there will be detractors just as there is with any high ranking official. Maybe this isn't the place for such open expression.

PS. MarkM come back.
PPS. Interocitor come back
PPPS. Vonstern come back
PPPS. ufocatcher come back
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Merlin on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:24am

on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:06am, onthefence55 wrote:
I for one, welcomed our interocitor overlord.

His representation of ideas is so far out there that you can only be forced to think differently or refuse altogether.

Maybe he could have been given or started a thread to submit his artwork and ideas, instead, with only one thread here the tone is forced into homogeneity.

As part of the Drone enigma and our global search for the truth, we shouldn't narrow playing field to specific lines of thought.

Kris has elevated himself to the top in this game, it is only expected that there will be detractors just as there is with any high ranking official. Maybe this isn't the place for such open expression.

PS. MarkM come back.
PPS. Interocitor come back
PPPS. Vonstern come back
PPPS. ufocatcher come back


Interocitor wasn't banned for his beliefs he was banned for breaking the rules which he/she agreed to when first registered. He/She was continally disrespectful to people who had different ideas you only have to read the 2 posts above to see that. This is the end of this discussion please return to the drones topic.


Regards

Merlin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:35am

on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:06am, onthefence55 wrote:
I for one, welcomed our interocitor overlord.

His representation of ideas is so far out there that you can only be forced to think differently or refuse altogether.

Maybe he could have been given or started a thread to submit his artwork and ideas, instead, with only one thread here the tone is forced into homogeneity.

As part of the Drone enigma and our global search for the truth, we shouldn't narrow playing field to specific lines of thought.

Kris has elevated himself to the top in this game, it is only expected that there will be detractors just as there is with any high ranking official. Maybe this isn't the place for such open expression.

PS. MarkM come back.
PPS. Interocitor come back
PPPS. Vonstern come back
PPPS. ufocatcher come back


I agree. If Salad can make cgi drones why can't Lev? I only wish Lev would take the high road and label his creations properly like we have asked Salad to do. I see nothing wrong with creating cgi drones as long as they are not used to perpetuate a hoax or further an agenda.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:46am

on Oct 6th, 2007, 04:16am, Merlin wrote:
Please continue with your discussions regards the Drones here.

Merlin

Quote:
Re: #5 THE DRONE ENIGMA
Reply #1529 on: Today at 05:17:27

Due to the size of this thread I have now created a new thread to continue this very interesting topic.

A link from the last post on #5 thread to the first post of this thread (#6) would be nice, thanks old fruit. wink

(Not for me but so other newer members don't get lost!!)


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by creolelady on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:53am

As soon as anyone clicks into the drone area of the forum, they might get overwhelmed but not so lost. It is all pretty well labeled.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:55am

Elephant wrote:
Quote:
Here's Dr Jon Sherwood's analysis of the drone fin and the meaning of one aspect of the glyphs
http://www.cropcirclexplorer.com/html/design_programming.html


Quote:
This is a fin of a ceramic dynamic scan probe used as a genetic imprinter for research it is primarily used to scan life forms genetic structure and surveillance of subjects. It uses a modulated shape geo program using dynamic energy compiled by a process of atomic geometric shape algorithms. The program is made of of multiple modules so it has continuous energy supply unless the main conversion system is halted then the whole thing falls apart. Each section is part of the unit and the program that makes it up. How do I know all this? Lets just say I have friends in High Places


I apologize for missing it but there was some discussion about this website. I think it would be good to investigate this further. Elephant, first, I'm not absolutely sure the crop circle indicated is the same symbol on the Chad/Raj drones. It looks close. Can you get Dr Sherwood to come here to discuss this? I'd be curious to hear what else he has heard from his "friends in high places".
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by onthefence55 on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:57am

A tribute to a long lost friend, ufocatcher:

User Image


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:58am

on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:46am, DrDil wrote:
A link from the last post on #5 thread to the first post of this thread (#6) would be nice, thanks old fruit. wink

(Not for me but so other newer members don't get lost!!)


on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:53am, creolelady wrote:
As soon as anyone clicks into the drone area of the forum, they might get overwhelmed but not so lost. It is all pretty well labeled.

No problem, I was just trying to help, sorry and it wont happen again. undecided
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by creolelady on Oct 6th, 2007, 12:00pm

That wasn't a put down, if you want a link posted we can do that. I just can't imagine anyone getting lost, but when I click into the drone section, the sheer volume is overwhelming.
I thought they were marked well with the numbering of the thread...that's all I was indicating...sorry if you took offense to that.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 6th, 2007, 12:47pm

on Oct 6th, 2007, 04:59am, wreckage wrote:


"Mr. Steve Neil who has and continues to do computer generated images for the History channels
television program 'UFO Files'. The other effects person is a Mr. Marc D' Antonio. He owns and
operates a business in Connecticut named FX Models. http://www.fxmodels.com/"

...claim...;

"They both independently state this object is clearly a CG fake."

http://ufocasebook.conforums.com/index.cgi?board=drone&num=1185472608&action=display&start=315

You can see the dates and the images they studied yourselves.

To throw some kindling onto the fire, I have never seen any forumers either at OpenMinds or here
(at UFOCasebook) actively discussing the points these two gentlemen made. If any of you know of
somewhere where I can see some critical disection of their points, I would be grateful.


Let's do it!

Maybe I'm dense but this whole thing you bring up is like a puzzle. Who said what? You bring up Steve Neil but what was his part in this? I see no quotes attributable to him. It seems to me that Reichman was deliberately vague but one theme is constant, !!!HOAX!!! He really only wants that one point to come across and does not want anybody to scrutinize his "findings". First, we must establish one thing. Are you Reichman or any of the other players?

Let's start by breaking down the Mufon correspondence. Would you take the lead and properly organize what was said and by who? I'd like to see a point by point breakdown with illustrations. What photos did the Mufon photo experts use?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Merlin on Oct 6th, 2007, 1:57pm

on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:46am, DrDil wrote:
A link from the last post on #5 thread to the first post of this thread (#6) would be nice, thanks old fruit. wink

(Not for me but so other newer members don't get lost!!)

No problem, I have now included a link at the end of the #5 thread smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by TeachersPet on Oct 6th, 2007, 3:05pm

wreckage we seem to have a meeting of the minds..and I do think it is a largish group. This actually lends itself for other groups not intended to either cash in or conduct their own studies..like vultures on a dying carcus..It attempts, if If it is a new type of crop circle event it is succeeding as take a look at this site cashing in..some of the inside info is very interesting.
http://www.cropcirclexplorer.com/html/design_programming.html

then scroll down to rajon.com (hmm Rajman?)the maker
and it is a publishing company
http://www.rajon.com/

the whole industry really needs a boost right now..as roswell is about as interesting as the sinking of the maine..and the witnesses all dead..except the daughter of the black preacher that presided allegedly over one of the ebes..She said he never told her anything..
that kind of really put the lights out for me, but his duty and loyalty are remarkable..I don't believe he mentioned it his services either, or became a changed man.

so we need a new roswell..this fits it just nicelly..coverup, disinfo,conspracy. hidden messages, peace love and harmony, we are the world..we are the children (try to sing allong withat ..I love it)

yes..its the new roswell 21 century style

Sys

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by raska on Oct 6th, 2007, 8:25pm

Even though i don't post here often, i read the Drone thread and i enjoy every member's post.
I want to join in asking MarkM to come back. Mark, as you yourself said so often in such nice ways, lets agree to disagree about Saladfinger's motivations, and leave it at that.It's not worth your leaving this place !
Maybe Von Stern/epsilon left also because of the same misunderstandings since he left shortly after speaking his mind about the subject.
It's a shame 2 highly valued members such as the two of you are leaving because of opinions , and maybe more that i don't know about.

It'll be real nice to read your appreciated comments again , i hope.
Whatever your decision, i wish you both the best. smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Truether on Oct 6th, 2007, 9:58pm

While looking at this site as a guest a couple of hours ago Isaw this site mentioned:www.livyatan.blagspot.com.Then in a matter of minutes it was gone! What is this place?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by elephant on Oct 7th, 2007, 02:23am

on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:55am, Latitude wrote:
Elephant wrote:




I apologize for missing it but there was some discussion about this website. I think it would be good to investigate this further. Elephant, first, I'm not absolutely sure the crop circle indicated is the same symbol on the Chad/Raj drones. It looks close. Can you get Dr Sherwood to come here to discuss this? I'd be curious to hear what else he has heard from his "friends in high places".

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 7th, 2007, 02:44am

User Image

on Oct 6th, 2007, 9:58pm, Truether wrote:
While looking at this site as a guest a couple of hours ago Isaw this site mentioned: www.livyatan. Then in a matter of minutes it was gone! What is this place?


Mark 5:9:
"And he asked him, What is thy name? And he answered, saying, I am Legion: for we are many."

Leviathan has become synonymous with any large sea monster or creature

Interocitor is a fictitious multi-functional device featured in the 1955 science fiction film This Island Earth.

User Image
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by elephant on Oct 7th, 2007, 02:51am

Thanks for your interest Latitude it takes courage to step out from the pack. I have forwarded your query to Dr Sherwood
I am curious to know what the other glyphs on the underside mean of the fin mean and how they function to the whole.
Don't hold back with your questions.There is no area of science or technology he does not have a command of and I believe he believes Isaac,the manuscripts and the apparitions are all authentic.
So take the gloves off and pitch him your best shot!

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 7th, 2007, 11:40am

Quote:
I agree. If Salad can make cgi drones why can't Lev? I only wish Lev would take the high road and label his creations properly like we have asked Salad to do. I see nothing wrong with creating cgi drones as long as they are not used to perpetuate a hoax or further an agenda.


Yes but salad's work is outstanding and lev's work is obviously amateur cgi. I've seen better graphics on hand held games. He does not need to label them their amateur quality speak for itself. It's obvious lev is trying to inject himself into the drone phenomena.

Quote:
This is a fin of a ceramic dynamic scan probe used as a genetic imprinter for research it is primarily used to scan life forms genetic structure and surveillance of subjects. It uses a modulated shape geo program using dynamic energy compiled by a process of atomic geometric shape algorithms. The program is made of of multiple modules so it has continuous energy supply unless the main conversion system is halted then the whole thing false apart. Each section is part of the unit and the program that makes it up. How do I know all this? Lets just say I have friends in High Places!


This sounds nuttier than a snickers bar. I actually thought he started off well with a breakdown of a seven part symbol, then I hit this technobable and he lost me. When I came across this site, I was impressed by the amount of well though out research and lack of whacky technobable. I think we need to return to the hard investigative focus that everyone had, verse the soap opera personal bickering and whacky technobable that this important topic has been hijacked towards. Everyday I used to check this site hoping for more ideas and revelations. Now I hope that I'm not going to see a drone Jerry springer exchange or some crazy technobable from some techie in a basment with a tinfoil hat.

Please let's as the moderator said, get back on the drone topic.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 7th, 2007, 12:09pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 11:40am, danblast wrote:
Yes but salad's work is outstanding and lev's work is obviously amateur cgi. I've seen better graphics on hand held games. He does not need to label them their amateur quality speak for itself. It's obvious lev is trying to inject himself into the drone phenomena.

So Salad makes better cgi so he's perfectly OK? Lev's cgi is inferior so he should be insulted and ridiculed? Not that I want to stick up for Lev. If you ask me he should be banned forever for perpetuating a hoax. Remember this?
User Image
Yeah that was Lev and his inferior cgi that fooled so many.

Quote:
This sounds nuttier than a snickers bar. I actually thought he started off well with a breakdown of a seven part symbol, then I hit this technobable and he lost me. When I came across this site, I was impressed by the amount of well though out research and lack of whacky technobable.

Please let's as the moderator said, get back on the drone topic.

I don't understand a lot of what you call "technobabble" either but let's give Dr Sherwood a chance to explain. I for one am willing to be educated. I look forward to hearing what he has to say. It's definitely on topic too.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 7th, 2007, 12:15pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 02:51am, elephant wrote:
Thanks for your interest Latitude it takes courage to step out from the pack. I have forwarded your query to Dr Sherwood
I am curious to know what the other glyphs on the underside mean of the fin mean and how they function to the whole.
Don't hold back with your questions.There is no area of science or technology he does not have a command of and I believe he believes Isaac,the manuscripts and the apparitions are all authentic.
So take the gloves off and pitch him your best shot!


As Danblast has bluntly said, the description of the Raj drone is a little over our heads. Could he explain it in more basic layman's terms? Does he have any info on the Big Basin drone? What is the cage part at the bottom for?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 7th, 2007, 12:18pm

on Oct 6th, 2007, 9:58pm, Truether wrote:
While looking at this site as a guest a couple of hours ago Isaw this site mentioned: www.livyatan.blogspot.com. Then in a matter of minutes it was gone! What is this place?


The link is working for me no worries Thruether Thanks for link.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by nekitamo on Oct 7th, 2007, 1:08pm

Quote:
This is a fin of a ceramic dynamic scan probe used as a genetic imprinter for research it is primarily used to scan life forms genetic structure and surveillance of subjects. It uses a modulated shape geo program using dynamic energy compiled by a process of atomic geometric shape algorithms. The program is made of of multiple modules so it has continuous energy supply unless the main conversion system is halted then the whole thing false apart. Each section is part of the unit and the program that makes it up. How do I know all this? Lets just say I have friends in High Places!

I'm sorry, but I don't buy this. This is pure nonsense if you ask me. In fact, this sentence: "It uses a modulated shape geo program using dynamic energy compiled by a process of atomic geometric shape algorithms." makes as much sense as colourless green ideas sleep furiously.

'Ceramic dynamic', 'atomic geometric'... yeah, right. This guy is having fun.
Compare this with Isaac's documents and tell me they are talking about the same thing.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 7th, 2007, 2:11pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 1:08pm, RoH wrote:
User Image




on Oct 7th, 2007, 1:08pm, Marvin wrote:
I swear the below belongs in there.

User Image




We caught that back in 8/24/2007 (but so much for the debate on real vs. CGI).


To my sadness, this hoax photo is still posted on the Casebook.

http://www.ufocasebook.com/anonymousstrangecraft.html


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 7th, 2007, 2:24pm

I know we slam Saladfingers for his position, but a least (to the best of my knowledge), he has not posted any hoax photos on this site.

I find Leviathans actions inexcusable, unforgivable and indefensible. Leviathan is a Hoaxer. Saladfingers worst crime is that he believes the drones are CGI and has used his skill to demonstrate his position. Whether he is right or wrong, at least he is not a hoaxer that pulled one over the UFO Casebook. And in the sense of some photos, he has been correct.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 7th, 2007, 2:30pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 2:11pm, Marvin wrote:
We caught that back in 8/24/2007 (but so much for the debate on real vs. CGI).

Quote:
castles4me wrote:from onthefence from OMF --
The appendage hanging down from the bottom of the "drone" is reminiscent of the Yosemite sighting sketch from 2006...

DrDil wrote: As well as being almost exclusively the, Hoax Of Choice for all things Leviathan

User Image

wink grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 7th, 2007, 2:35pm

Is that the original VonStern?!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 7th, 2007, 2:40pm

Yes, DrDil...Much much more will follow..

No one of you "residents" in here were to blame for my "fast" exit, and I'm sorry if it has caused trouble.

I'll be posting more in a short while, so pay attention! cool

Thanks all, for wanting me to join in again...

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 7th, 2007, 2:55pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 2:40pm, VonStern wrote:
Yes, DrDil...Much much more will follow..

No one of you "residents" in here were to blame for my "fast" exit, and I'm sorry if it has caused trouble.

I'll be posting more in a short while, so pay attention! cool

Thanks all, for wanting me to join in again...

--VonStern


For everyone I very much enjoy reading Von Stern posts much more than some other people and if anyone causes him any further heartaches I will ask the other mods to help me examine whether we really want you posting here any further in the future. Von Stern has my total support in anything he wishs to share.

Its ok to disagree with him but do it nicely and give him the same respect you require.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by raska on Oct 7th, 2007, 2:57pm

Wow! Von Stern: thanks for the quick return for everyone's benefit ! smiley smiley laugh cheesy
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 7th, 2007, 3:10pm

I have to set a few rules in here regarding myself, if you want me to stay in here:

I will NOT respond to personal harassment, as I'm sure no one in here want's that.

PLEASE stay on topic, and what derives from that - that be antigravity, cloaking, picture analysis, video analysis and other similar things.

I trust the Global Moderators to exclude unwanted promotion and provocative posts.

--End rules

You guy's and girls in here represent a vast intellect, if worked right, it is probably the best amateur "Brain Tank" working this particular issue. If this is lost, ie scattered all over the Internet, and not hold together here, we all have suffered a great loss.

So, let us wait, if not "Isaac" comes back in a short while by himself, it is OUR DUTY to either make him do so, OR investigate this issue until infinity, or at least until it is proved in full understandable and tolerable terms this whole enigma is indeed a hoax.

I strongly advise all of you, to get your skills at work, this case is far from solved, as many see it is.

Let's show them, pick the best evidence you have, bring it on, post it!

At best, we'll "scrutinize" it all of us...and joke about it..but never, ever let it be personal again...(You know what I mean).

Well, that pretty much rounds it up, I'll leave my mail open this time, and all of you is invited to PM me.

What more can I say? Glad to be back!

--VonStern


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 7th, 2007, 4:13pm

I was able to run this particular photo through by a very large computer pixellating it and then resizing it:

User Image

Can you find evidence in here? Pro et contra?

http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff210/VonStern/Detaljer8.png

--VonStern

Ps: I do not have the original outcome to post. It was 40,2 Gb in size!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 7th, 2007, 4:27pm

Ok looks like you are back in the swing
Thanks Von Stern use my personal email if anyone causes you heartaches and I will come suspend them so they will have to appeal to the Admins to continue on here if they dont play Nicely. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 7th, 2007, 4:36pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 4:13pm, VonStern wrote:
I was able to run this particular photo through by a very large computer pixellating it and then resizing it:

User Image

Can you find evidence in here? Pro et contra?

http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff210/VonStern/Detaljer8.png

--VonStern

Ps: I do not have the original outcome to post. It was 40,2 Gb in size!



Welcome back!

What are your thoughts about this photo? What are you seeing?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 7th, 2007, 4:43pm

Thanks Marvin!

Actually, this is not in my area, I just asked a friend to produce this. He said to me, that it had no visible flaws in the pixel "spectrogram", whatever that is??

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by nekitamo on Oct 7th, 2007, 4:44pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 2:11pm, Marvin wrote:
To my sadness, this hoax photo is still posted on the Casebook.

http://www.ufocasebook.com/anonymousstrangecraft.html

As it is, UFO Casebook seems to be about quantity, not quality. IMO, what is missing is some way to link each case with its forum topic (or to create one, if it doesn't exist), and also some kind of 'gauge' to indicate the intensity/progress of forum discussion. And when there is enough consensus among forum members (measured by some kind of poll to be used only once, when they reach their verdict), it should somehow reflect back to the case tagging it as 'solved', 'unsolved', 'hoax', etc.

But I'm day dreaming, sorry. smiley

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:00pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 4:43pm, VonStern wrote:
Thanks Marvin!

Actually, this is not in my area, I just asked a friend to produce this. He said to me, that it had no visible flaws in the pixel "spectrogram", whatever that is??

--VonStern


He spoke of turning the picture into "signal waves" , and then I was lost in that conversation.... grin

I did not even know that it actually was possible to transfer pictures into "Waves"....

Maybe it is time to bring up the sound theory once more?

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:00pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 4:44pm, nekitamo wrote:
As it is, UFO Casebook seems to be about quantity, not quality. IMO, what is missing is some way to link each case with its forum topic (or to create one, if it doesn't exist), and also some kind of 'gauge' to indicate the intensity/progress of forum discussion. And when there is enough consensus among forum members (measured by some kind of poll to be used only once, when they reach their verdict), it should somehow reflect back to the case tagging it as 'solved', 'unsolved', 'hoax', etc.

But I'm day dreaming, sorry. smiley


Nekitamo sometimes Quanity is the only quality do you have any suggestions how we might be able to accomplish your proposal I would value your opinion.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:15pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:00pm, Razor wrote:
Nekitamo sometimes Quanity is the only quality do you have any suggestions how we might be able to accomplish your proposal I would value your opinion.

Maybes three or four mods could monitor the UFOCasebook Main Page (I do!!) and every time a story is discussed in the forum, ask BJ to provide a backlink, this would certainly prove beneficial for PageRank and driving visitors to the forum as well as hits to the main site (from the forums.)

I think far and above the most important aspect is one which is unattainable, and that is once an image or report is satisfactorily, Debunked ask BJ to edit the respective article to reflect that, but as I say it isnt going to happen..

I feel that would be the only way to, Police the website but ultimately means BJ relinquishing far too much control over the site and if you look at it from BJs point of view, If it aint broke then dont try to fix it!!

Plus I feel that Casebook is more of a research tool than a factual medium, this also works quite well (in my opinion) because if every hoax was weeded out instantaneously there would be none for comparative examination, but I agree that some comment should be placed on known hoaxes, but then, what constitutes a hoax and who is in the position to definitively and conclusively call it?

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:17pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:00pm, Razor wrote:
Nekitamo sometimes Quanity is the only quality do you have any suggestions how we might be able to accomplish your proposal I would value your opinion.


The board has its own personality which is the collective intelligence of its members, in which, you are a part of Mekitamo any suggestions from you would be welcome.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:30pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 4:44pm, nekitamo wrote:
As it is, UFO Casebook seems to be about quantity, not quality. IMO, what is missing is some way to link each case with its forum topic (or to create one, if it doesn't exist), and also some kind of 'gauge' to indicate the intensity/progress of forum discussion. And when there is enough consensus among forum members (measured by some kind of poll to be used only once, when they reach their verdict), it should somehow reflect back to the case tagging it as 'solved', 'unsolved', 'hoax', etc.

But I'm day dreaming, sorry. smiley


This post got me thinking that all the hard work that has been done needs to be better organized.

One thread for photo analysis, another thread for language and so on and so forth....much of the work that has been done already, might have been forgotten. By compartmentalizing the work, it might be more efficient.....I dont know if it could be done, by one of the mods or another member cutting and pasting to actually re-organize the old posts into new threads for their corresponding subject.

The chit-chat or off topic posts would not need to be included

We might even find out we had overlooked something.

With all of us looking at the info again, this would be bound to happen.

It is up to us, we cant count on LHM, or Isaac...we can do this.

Just a thought
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:31pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:00pm, VonStern wrote:
He spoke of turning the picture into "signal waves" , and then I was lost in that conversation.... grin

I did not even know that it actually was possible to transfer pictures into "Waves"....

Maybe it is time to bring up the sound theory once more?

--VonStern


It would imply to me microwave transmission the same as Sateliite tv or cell phone pictures Von Stern but I am not a total expert in that area either.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:34pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:30pm, murnut wrote:
This post got me thinking that all the hard work that has been done needs to be better organized.

One thread for photo analysis, another thread for language and so on and so forth....much of the work that has been done already, might have been forgotten. By compartmentalizing the work, it might be more efficient.....I dont know if it could be done, by one of the mods or another member cutting and pasting to actually re-organize the old posts into new threads for their corresponding subject.

The chit-chat or off topic posts would not need to be included

We might even find out we had overlooked something.

With all of us looking at the info again, this would be bound to happen.

It is up to us, we cant count on LHM, or Isaac...we can do this.

Just a thought


Murnut do we think this would segregate the members too much or allow them to better concentrate on their interest area without distraction?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:40pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:31pm, Razor wrote:
It would imply to me microwave transmission the same as Sateliite tv or cell phone pictures Von Stern but I am not a total expert in that area either.


As stated earlier, it's not really my field, but your input somehow makes it! You're definately onto something here! cheesy

Let's say, that the "barcodes" of the Primer isn't that of sound, as spoken of in here earlier, and presented in a very nice musical way, but of PICTURES!

Now, that should bring out a question for all! How to determine that?

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:46pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:40pm, VonStern wrote:
As stated earlier, it's not really my field, but your input somehow makes it! You're definately onto something here! cheesy

Let's say, that the "barcodes" of the Primer isn't that of sound, as spoken of in here earlier, and presented in a very nice musical way, but of PICTURES!

Now, that should bring out a question for all! How to determine that?

--VonStern


Yep you are 100% Von Stern another thing that crossed my mind is if the bar codes are alogrithams that parameters the commands to the drones..I cant say but I am sure at some point an expert in this particular area will step forth and tell us.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:55pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:46pm, Razor wrote:
Yep you are 100% Von Stern another thing that crossed my mind is if the bar codes are alogrithams that parameters the commands to the drones..I cant say but I am sure at some point an expert in this particular area will step forth and tell us.


Similar to what, Elephant was saying?

It uses a modulated shape geo program using dynamic energy compiled by a process of atomic geometric shape algorithms.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 7th, 2007, 6:17pm

Actually now that I think about it I read that post and that may be where I heard that/ LOL sorry elephant!!!

Another thing I wanted to point out is I beleive Ashiana as well as myself believe that there are higher wave frequencies that can be transmitted on that are unkown or understood by a mere moratal such as myself. If that helps any guys.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by nekitamo on Oct 7th, 2007, 7:02pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 5:00pm, Razor wrote:
Nekitamo sometimes Quanity is the only quality do you have any suggestions how we might be able to accomplish your proposal I would value your opinion.

Sure. There are free, modular and highly customizable CMS solutions with which you can achieve almost anything these days. For example, check what guys at OM are using for their new site - it's Joomla, one of the most stable and mature CMS solutions available nowadays, customizable through hundreds of extensions and templates. IMO, a good choice, though they are using it in its very basic, 'generic' form. It is also used at the infamous isaaccaret.com with somewhat customised template and an additional Fireboard forum extension.

In fact, I'm quite familiar with Joomla so I can describe precisely how the enhancements I proposed could be implemented - but they were just some simple quick remarks, not fully developed and thought out. Much more thinking would have to be done about them before actual realisation takes place.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 7th, 2007, 7:32pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 7:02pm, nekitamo wrote:
Sure. There are free, modular and highly customizable CMS solutions with which you can achieve almost anything these days. For example, check what guys at OM are using for their new site - it's Joomla, one of the most stable and mature CMS solutions available nowadays, customizable through hundreds of extensions and templates. IMO, a good choice, though they are using it in its very basic, 'generic' form. It is also used at the infamous isaaccaret.com with somewhat customised template and an additional Fireboard forum extension.

In fact, I'm quite familiar with Joomla so I can describe precisely how the enhancements I proposed could be implemented - but they were just some simple quick remarks, not fully developed and thought out. Much more thinking would have to be done about them before actual realisation takes place.


Thank You Nekitamo I will show your post to the admins as a suggestion for furture development.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Oct 7th, 2007, 7:44pm

on Oct 7th, 2007, 2:40pm, VonStern wrote:
Yes, DrDil...Much much more will follow..

No one of you "residents" in here were to blame for my "fast" exit, and I'm sorry if it has caused trouble.

I'll be posting more in a short while, so pay attention! cool

Thanks all, for wanting me to join in again...

--VonStern


Welcome back, friend!!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by rcakron on Oct 7th, 2007, 7:48pm

RE: sub discussion about investigative process & earlier comment: "This post got me thinking that all the hard work that has been done needs to be better organized."

I used to spend a lot a time on the Mu site... but there just didn't seem to be good feedback loop & discussion, and the promise of any investigations seemed lost.

I like this site due to the fact ideas and concepts do flow freely, allowing us to help formulate our on concepts of understanding.

But this does yield a Typical Good News / bad news scenerio.
- we get a LOT more input. Some redundant. Some thoroughly flogged with little or no decissive output.
- some missed details worthy of a bit more time / discussion.

While a call for organization is understandable though, I think we should better understand what, if any, investigative organization(s) is(are) available to better research any given topic.

If there were an investigative group that the web forum would consider the focal point, then there would be an opportunity to direct a more organized investigation.

Unfortunately, this concept yields a couple of negatives as well.
1. over control, which stiffles random input.
2. profiteering, which hords data for that next book of enlightenment, which misses the strength of this forum.

A lot of words to basically say: I'm not quite sure what the answer is... but it is basically a function of resources, feet on the ground, and ultimately some cash to support research, lab work, etc.

But two ideas that comes to mind,

One:
more effort to keeping topic focused, moving topic wanderings, like this one smiley & the ones I'm responding too smiley in check

Two:
if key resources (ie a Video or CGI experts) could be identified, then the upper forum hierarchy could prioritize work for review, and allow some level of "authentic expert ruling" to be posted and recognized. And if an item / topic is deemed a hoax for instance, then a moderator could then be allowed to freeze the topic.

But it would also be a responsibility of the moderators to filter the access to the "expert", so he/she is not overwhelmed with random requests...

just my 2 cents

keep up the effort everyone. disclosure someday!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 7th, 2007, 7:58pm

rcakron I think its a great idea but as I ask in a previous post does anyone think it would segregate the researchers to Much ?

Hey UFOcatcher it is great to see you someone was asking me about you earlier!!!!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 7th, 2007, 8:46pm

Quote:
Murnut do we think this would segregate the members too much or allow them to better concentrate on their interest area without distraction?


There could be the main disscusion here where all the members get together and the free following ideas happen.

And then when something that comes that relates to the language, it could get copied and pasted in to that there for further analysis. Like wise for any other particular area of this truly multi-faceted case. Unfortunately, I have no area of expertise, but in my profession, I need to be organized, and I need access to the information quickly.

Anyone of us could check in daily with the progress in the photo section or the language section and so on.
Re-organizing or copying these older posts might have a positive effect. These new threads of the older posts should be locked until we are caught up.
Everyday we would be looking at the posts as if new.

This would be a difficult task for the person who takes it on if any body else besides me thinks so.

I cant do it, I already spend too much time at work, and not enough with my wife and kids...but i do see value in organization.

Glad to see you back VonStern, you are a great asset here.
Unfortunately for me you are so smart that I really dont follow your most recent post just above. Please do not take offense, because none was meant. I cant even spell algorythms..hehehe

My intention is not to divide but multiply our efforts


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 7th, 2007, 8:59pm

Murnut dont be afraid to talk with Von Stern I can assure you if you dont understand something He would be the first just as myself to try to help you Understand My freind.
An alogrithim is a computer program (or set of programs) that is designed to systematically solve a certain kind of problem. Or define an instruction to something say like a drone. wink

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Oct 8th, 2007, 12:18am

Hello to all. I have been researching UFO's for over 30 years now with many interesting bits of anecdotal evidence accumulating all the while and the Drone/Strange Craft events are extremly intriguing on so many levels. I have been reading this forum's threads on the subject for a good while. Time to participate. I have seen some Drone photos from Germany that I think may be fakes. I have done a rudimentary analysis of them and will gladly share my opinions here. I want to upload them here for a look by others. Can someone tell me how to get them into this thread. They are currently housed at 4Shared.com.
Hoax or not, let's get to the truth based on logic and reason....but let's stay outside the box....that's where all the fun is....and maybe even the TRUTH. Ciao for now. Never be afraid to be wrong wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by bonjody on Oct 8th, 2007, 12:28am

Someone mentioned "Technobabble" earlier...

What are you people smoking?

I have never read more BULLS**T in my life!!!

Most of what has been posted lately is completely unintelligible.
(Cogent1's post above excepted...was posted while I was writing this one)
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 8th, 2007, 12:47am

Bonjody Ace ole buddy ya think they are smoking some good stuff see my post about computers above you will love that one freind. Read and have your eyes opened to the real truth.The Hopi Legends and their oracles are upon you ROFL. And you are helping it along by throwing out all those negative waves..
Edumecation is great skeptics read and learn these people here are historically right in their opinions if you use the net as the bots wish you to then you will learn, all you skeptics.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:03am

Bonjody you are responsible for the revelation of that computer post do you have a reply.Or do you wish to eat a cookie and wake up tommorrow in ignorance if you do I can assure you she will be right as rain . No worries.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by bonjody on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:04am

on Oct 8th, 2007, 12:47am, Razor wrote:
Bonjody Ace ole buddy ya think they are smoking some good stuff see my post about computers above you will love that one freind. Read and have your eyes opened to the real truth.The Hopi Legends and their oracles are upon you ROFL. And you are helping it along by throwing out all those negative waves..
Edumecation is great skeptics read and learn these people here are historically right in their opinions if you use the net as the bots wish you to then you will learn, all you skeptics.


This(quoted post above) is exactly what I mean... I defy anyone to make sense of it.
If you can, explain it to me...PLEASE!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:07am

I would be pleased to try my freind as you can see there are people who take this research very seriously where shall we begin?

Try that scientist fear computers first and tell me what you think.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by elephant on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:09am

on Oct 6th, 2007, 11:55am, Latitude wrote:
Elephant wrote:




I apologize for missing it but there was some discussion about this website. I think it would be good to investigate this further. Elephant, first, I'm not absolutely sure the crop circle indicated is the same symbol on the Chad/Raj drones. It looks close. Can you get Dr Sherwood to come here to discuss this? I'd be curious to hear what else he has heard from his "friends in high places".>>>

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:13am

on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:04am, bonjody wrote:
This(quoted post above) is exactly what I mean... I defy anyone to make sense of it.
If you can, explain it to me...PLEASE!


BonJody read that scientist fear computers and I iwll come and talk with you tommorrow i AM GETTING TIRED AND NEED SLEEP. sorry about caps. I iwll like to hear what you ahve to say and will have the most respect for you opinion. I promise wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:21am

Night Bonjody I look forward to having some nice discussions with you. You seem to be a fairly good Joe. Cussing aside we have younger people here that research as well wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by bonjody on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:32am

on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:07am, Razor wrote:
I would be pleased to try my freind as you can see there are people who take this research very seriously where shall we begin?

Try that scientist fear computers first and tell me what you think.


First explain what you mean in each line in your post above...then we can move on to " scientist fearing computers", "Hopi legends and oracles, "negative waves, "Edumecation (whatever that is)" and then whatever computer post you are referring to.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by bonjody on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:45am

Sorry, I got back too late for you to continue.

I'll sign off too...I think I have made my point that

"the inmates are running the asylum!"

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by elephant on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:58am

:' (Sorry but unfortunately could not encourage Sherwood to come on this forum.Says he is too busy.
But I think the fact that he has been badly ignored by the Establishment is another factor.
I know for example when the drone story broke he sent an email to Linda Moulton Howe who he already was well acquainted with through their contact during the Crop Circle season,indicating he had various information to reveal about the subject and she was really patronising and asked him to reveal certain aspects about his background from the military(New Zealand Navy,where he worked in the Medical Branch and then ran a Recieving Station) but as he is under the Secret Service Act and had a high level of clearance he simply could not give her details of projects he was involved in.Anyway after that she kind of fobbed him off.
Bad move he bases all of his working relationships on mutual trust and respect.When people find out EXACTLY what he knows she will have to work hard to get him in her court. Sherwood thinks she has covered no new ground since the revealations and post all the evidence for the drone enigma.
Plus he has looked at this forum and considers it consists of 95% pure speculation and harnesses no REAL facts against Isaac,the manuscripts and the witnesses photos.He believes the American public will deny the truth through fear.
Why he asks has the military stayed utterly tight-lipped about all this (and remember he is ex-military and also dealt with the US Navy ships that passed through to highly classified projects like the US Antarctic Base etc.)
He believes it is because they have no point of refute.
Anyways this is my last post on this site.You guys are the think-tank on this thing and I am sure you are sick of my random interruptions.
Don't forget to check the new forum on Sherwood's crop circle explorer site.I intend to ask about the drone glyphs there.Whether he chooses to answer my questions is another question.
Ciao all!
Elephant-out
PS.
I am only a gopher to Sherwood ,not on any payroll,just a labour of admiration for the genius he exudes.He has developed an artificial energy vortex system for example which controls weather patterns(not unlike what the HARP program has achieved but to a greater level of control), an entire branch of alternative medical science he has developed over a 20 year period,(which defies belief with what it can do with it plus the blueprints to achieve the technology to do the same),a harmonic mathematical table which shows the relationship not only between the crop circles,and ancient sites like the pyramids, but can also be used to accurately predict earthtquakes ( to the day and location),etc,etc,etc.
When I first emailed Dr John with your Drone story and sent him the amazing photos your team had posted he was busy rapidly downloading the documents as I spoke to him on the phone and at the same time I heard him utter "Part of it's missing!". Then he cryptically said Andreas Three !
Sherwood does not tolerate fools gladly and I do not ask many questions .

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:58am

on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:45am, bonjody wrote:
Sorry, I got back too late for you to continue.

I'll sign off too...I think I have made my point that

"the inmates are running the asylum!"


Would love to lets take it to general discusion so we dont flake up this thread.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 02:17am

on Oct 8th, 2007, 01:58am, elephant wrote:

Plus he has looked at this forum and considers it consists of 95% pure speculation and harnesses no REAL facts against Isaac,the manuscripts and the witnesses photos.He believes the American public will deny the truth through fear.


If one looks at any of the forums one could see a lot of bad. How easy is it to have your view spoiled by a few bad apples. There is some good scientific research going on amongst the noise. I know it's a hard thing to do but if the good doctor were to search through the hundreds of pages devoted to the drones he would probably see his own conclusions have already been posted.

Elephant,
Are you reading all posts? I posted a couple of questions for you to pass on to the doctor. Did you see them? If the doctor would like his ideas to become public this forum is a good starting point. From here news spreads to other forums and then to the rest of the internet.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 02:34am

on Oct 7th, 2007, 2:11pm, Marvin wrote:
We caught that back in 8/24/2007 (but so much for the debate on real vs. CGI).

I disagree, Marvin. Lev's drone was way too small, distant and low rez (purposely) to be properly analyzed. It was not even close to what came from Chad, Raj, Steven and Ty. I for one never claimed Lev's drone as real. Most people can't tell the difference any way. To them anything unbelievable is automatically cgi.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 02:48am

on Oct 8th, 2007, 12:18am, Cogent1 wrote:
Hello to all. I have been researching UFO's for over 30 years now with many interesting bits of anecdotal evidence accumulating all the while and the Drone/Strange Craft events are extremly intriguing on so many levels. I have been reading this forum's threads on the subject for a good while. Time to participate. I have seen some Drone photos from Germany that I think may be fakes. I have done a rudimentary analysis of them and will gladly share my opinions here. I want to upload them here for a look by others. Can someone tell me how to get them into this thread. They are currently housed at 4Shared.com.
Hoax or not, let's get to the truth based on logic and reason....but let's stay outside the box....that's where all the fun is....and maybe even the TRUTH. Ciao for now. Never be afraid to be wrong wink


Hi Cogent1,

How about you simply post links to the media you want to show us? Up over the smileys, click on the picture of the world with a paper in front of it (Insert Hyperlink) and paste in the link.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Luvey on Oct 8th, 2007, 03:18am

Bonjody I find your posts offensive You have just come in here and your first post is belittling other members. The bottom line is if you don't like it here..LEAVE.

Luvey

Quote:
Someone mentioned "Technobabble" earlier...

What are you people smoking?

I have never read more BULLS**T in my life!!!

Most of what has been posted lately is completely unintelligible.
(Cogent1's post above excepted...was posted while I was writing this one)

Sorry, I got back too late for you to continue.

I'll sign off too...I think I have made my point that

"the inmates are running the asylum!"

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by ZETAR on Oct 8th, 2007, 03:47am

YES INDEEDY,
I MUST JOIN IN WITH MY DISTINGUISHED FRIEND LUVEY AND RAZOR AND QUESTION WHETHER BONJODY LEFT THE BARN DOOR OPEN ON THE WAY IN OR OUT.
I'M NOT SURE IF YOU ARE ACCUMSTOMMED TO INSULTING PEOPLE WHEN YOU VISIT...BUT IT MAY BE IN YOUR DAILY LIFE THAT YOUR SOCIAL ETIQUITTE IS SIMILAR.IF THAT IS THE CASE SOMEONE DROPPED THE BALL SOMEWHERE ALONG THE LINE.
WELL ALL THE ABOVE IS OUT OF MY CHARACTER BUT IF THE INMATES ARE RUNNING THE ASYLUM THEN MIGHT I ASK IF YOUR ARE SPEAKING FROM THE VOICE OF EXPERIENCE TO DRAW SUCH A CONCLUSION?
IF YOU ARE HERE JUST TO GET ATTENTION...WHY DON'T YOU TRY TO ADD TO THE THREAD RATHER REVEAL TO ALL THAT CIVILITY IS NOT YOUR HIGH CARD grin
SHALOM...ZETAR
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 8th, 2007, 05:33am

--o0o--

http://www.esotericscience.com/Antigravity.aspx#explanation

"4D waves, Rotation, Magnetism and Antigravity"

"According to the aether model presented here rotation generates an aether vortex into the
4th dimension (see Inertia). Given that gravity according to this model is essentially a 4D
wave phenomenon it suggests that left/right spin difference is a 4th dimensional effect."

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 8th, 2007, 07:47am

on Oct 8th, 2007, 02:34am, Latitude wrote:
I disagree, Marvin. Lev's drone was way too small, distant and low rez (purposely) to be properly analyzed. It was not even close to what came from Chad, Raj, Steven and Ty. I for one never claimed Lev's drone as real. Most people can't tell the difference any way. To them anything unbelievable is automatically cgi.


I do not understand what there is to disagree?

User Image

Photo from RoHs post.

User Image

Leviathans Hoax.

I can not post a quote from that thread, but I caught and posted the photo as being Leviathan made back on 8/24/2007. Here is the header

Re: #4 THE DRONE ENIGMA A GLOBAL SEARCH FOR THE T
Reply #1578 on: 08/24/2007 at 17:00:47

On Thread #4, Page 106

At the time, I did not need the photo to be analyzed I spotted it as the same fake drone as the others that were publish by Leviathan, as shown by the good work of RoH. I suggest this should be the end of the it is impossible drones are CGI debate. I am not saying all of the drones are CGI, I am just saying the people that claim they can easily spot the difference between real and CGI, failed the Leviathan test. If we are to have any credibility, then I believe we should not be stuck in the same place every day.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by GForce on Oct 8th, 2007, 08:50am

VonStern welcome back my friend! I for one value your thoughts and opinions. Dan
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 10:35am

on Oct 8th, 2007, 07:47am, Marvin wrote:
I am just saying the people that claim they can easily spot the difference between real and CGI, failed the Leviathan test.


Name one person who did that. Maybe you can think of one maybe two. But to paint everbody with that broad of a brush is not fair. Like I said. Most people can't tell. But how many came out saying the Lev drone was real?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 8th, 2007, 11:05am

is the dorne a type of stargate that transport?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 11:40am

on Oct 8th, 2007, 11:05am, jugement wrote:
is the drone a type of stargate that transport?

I'm definately open to that possibility for the Big Basin drone. Maybe one day we will know.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 8th, 2007, 11:58am

on Oct 8th, 2007, 11:40am, Latitude wrote:
I'm definately open to that possibility for the Big Basin drone. Maybe one day we will know.
the reason that I asked that question,is s1 and on stargate sg1 look at the languastic primers by Isaac and on the circle around the cage, and you can see the simalarities of the scifi movies stargate that the actors travel thru.thank you latitude. cool
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 12:33pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 11:58am, jugement wrote:
the reason that I asked that question,is s1 and on stargate sg1 look at the languastic primers by Isaac and on the circle around the cage, and you can see the simalarities of the scifi movies stargate that the actors travel thru.thank you latitude. cool


I don't know about Stargate SG1 (I have never watched the show, but I did enjoy the original movie). What bothers me is the blacked out portions of the PACL documents, especially page 3 of the quarterly report . That 4th item was evidently too sensitive even for PACL eyes. It is possible it described some sort of transporter.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 8th, 2007, 12:54pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 10:35am, Latitude wrote:
Name one person who did that. Maybe you can think of one maybe two. But to paint everybody with that broad of a brush is not fair. Like I said. Most people can't tell. But how many came out saying the Lev drone was real?


Latitude, ease back from the trigger my friend. I am not trying to make this a personal issue. And to name people would be to do so and would totally miss the point.

My point is to level the playing field and point out the obvious.

1. It is not easy to always spot a hoax photo especially if it is a digital photo and we are not in possession of the original. To base ones opinion on this type of poor data is fine, but for some people (I am not saying you) to lead others on, that none of these photos can be fake is just not being truthful. The Leviathan photo should more than demonstrate that point. While you are correct, there was not a bandwagon full of people saying the Leviathan photo was legitimate beyond doubt, on the other hand, where was the bandwagon of experts pointing out this was an obvious hoax? As of August, I believe RoH and I were the only ones doing so. Those who are in the dark on the real vs. CGI, were left to believe it was real or possibly real (when it is a fake).

2. Leviathan posted a hoax photo that resides on the UFO Casebook. To the best of my knowledge, Saladfingers has not done such a thing. Yet, people condemn Saladfingers (because he believes the drones may be CGI) and support Leviathan (who is a hoaxer). I am totally puzzled by this logic. We need good trustworthy CGI folks for their input we do not have to agree with them, but we are silly if we bury our head in the sand (or chase them off) when they speak. Personally, I will hold the CGI folks to the same standard of proof as I would anyone else and please explain things in simple terms for my simple mind.

3. I have not heard that Leviathan has claimed responsibility for the hoax photo. If one wants to understand a hoax, this would make a good study. For those who are interested, see if you can figure out what makes these guys tick. The photo was supposed to have been taken on the 29th of June (2007) and supplied anonymously (that should have been a red flag). It looks like these folks do not need to come forward for their accolades.
http://www.ufocasebook.com/anonymousstrangecraft.html

4. We should not get too tied up in if drones are real or a hoax. The adventure is in the discovery, wherever it leads us. If the evidence proves a drone is real, then that is awesome. If not, then (for me) thats okay too. At least we will know the truth.

Latitude, do you remember what I said on MUFON? I meant every word of it. We are not that far apart you and I, and we seek the same thing our paths may be different, but I hope to arrive at the same place. We just need to work together to weed out the un-drones like this one to get there. wink

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 1:24pm

[quote author=Marvin link=board=drone&num=1191662183&start=88#5 date=1191866094]

Absolutely Marvin. I have always considered you as a friend. Please don't misconstrue my rough way of posting to be a slight at you because it is not meant to be that way. I try my best to relate what I'm am feeling but something always gets lost in that translation. So please remember this, whatever I post in response to you is not meant as an offense. I may from time to time disagree with what you say and you will likely do the same to me. I believe we can disagree and still be friends. (It would be boring if we always agreed wink ).

It was Fore from OMF who found out the drone photo was hoaxed by Lev over a month ago. I for the most part remained quiet about it. Just recently Lev has put up a blog admitting to the hoaxing. So the cat is out of the bag now and that is why I bring it up. With Fore we had a good suspicion. Now Lev admits it so it can now be posted.

Good for you and RoH for making the correct decision. What evidence did you use to make that determination? I did not make that claim because I felt there was not enough to go on at the time. So I had that pic in my grey basket so to speak. I never took a side about it real or fake.

My point is the Chad, Raj, Steven and Ty pics are different. They are much easier to make a determination on. Do you agree?

As for CGI people, I normally do not like their attitude. They are closed minded and arrogant for the most part. They are often so far into their craft that they think it's the be all and end all to anything unusual. Salad started out that way. He has since softened his stance because after all his creations he has realized they do not duplicate the realism of the original photos. Every now and then you will get a cgi guy who is willing to think outside the box (CGI software box?). LMH has a report from just such an individual on her website.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 8th, 2007, 2:18pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 12:54pm, Marvin wrote:
I have not heard that Leviathan has claimed responsibility for the hoax photo.

That was probably my fault, I adopted Levs, Style of post to announce it!! undecided

on Oct 6th, 2007, 9:58pm, Truether wrote:
While looking at this site as a guest a couple of hours ago Isaw this site mentioned: www.livyatan. Then in a matter of minutes it was gone! What is this place?


on Oct 7th, 2007, 02:44am, DrDil wrote:
User Image

Mark 5:9:
"And he asked him, What is thy name? And he answered, saying, I am Legion: for we are many."

Leviathan has become synonymous with any large sea monster or creature

Interocitor is a fictitious multi-functional device featured in the 1955 science fiction film This Island Earth.

User Image

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Oct 8th, 2007, 2:38pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 02:48am, Latitude wrote:
Hi Cogent1,

How about you simply post links to the media you want to show us? Up over the smileys, click on the picture of the world with a paper in front of it (Insert Hyperlink) and paste in the link.


Thanks for the info Latitude. I will do that, but I actually wanted to know how to post the images directly in the thread so they were visible in the post. I will link for now, until someone can tell me how. I'll be very interested to see how many others have seen these supposed Drone images and where they saw them. After I have the link up, I will post some more later on my analysis. Thanks again for the help Lat smiley

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd303/perrphotobucket/drone_viewed_germany_1.jpg
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 8th, 2007, 2:38pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 2:38pm, Cogent1 wrote:
Thanks for the info Latitude. I will do that, but I actually wanted to know how to post the images directly in the thread so they were visible in the post. I will link for now, until someone can tell me how. I'll be very interested to see how many others have seen these supposed Drone images and where they saw them. After I have the link up, I will post some more later on my analysis. Thanks again for the help Lat smiley

User Image

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 8th, 2007, 2:41pm

Place "img" in front of it and "/img" at the end of it. But substitute " for [

Or highlight the web address of the picture and click on the little image icon at the top of the message box. (User Image)

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 8th, 2007, 2:45pm

Or visit this link for further information.

DOWNLOADING & UPLOADING PICTURES TO POST
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 3:00pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 2:38pm, Cogent1 wrote:
I'll be very interested to see how many others have seen these supposed Drone images and where they saw them. After I have the link up, I will post some more later on my analysis. Thanks again for the help Lat smiley

http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd303/perrphotobucket/drone_viewed_germany_1.jpg


The top image is a bad fake. You can clearly see where a square image was pasted in. The bottom image I can't immediately tell because the res is so bad but if the first is fake we can logically assume the second is fake too. Sorry but don't let that stop you. Post more if you have them.
\
The more I look at the bottom, it too looks pasted in. I can see a vague square around it.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Oct 8th, 2007, 3:02pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 2:45pm, DrDil wrote:
Or visit this link for further information.

DOWNLOADING & UPLOADING PICTURES TO POST


Thanks for the options DrDil! I had just put them on photobucket a few minutes ago, I never used it before.
My short analysis to follow. I will also post an analysis done by a high-level photo analyst that I am not allowed to name, they had some interesting comments after only a quick look at two different Drone images. I am not a cgi expert by any means, but rather a conceptual philospher with other varied skills....seeking the truth about this and other related matters encompassed within my ever-evolving "Theory of Everything".

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Oct 8th, 2007, 3:21pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 3:00pm, Latitude wrote:
The top image is a bad fake. You can clearly see where a square image was pasted in. The bottom image I can't immediately tell because the res is so bad but if the first is fake we can logically assume the second is fake too. Sorry but don't let that stop you. Post more if you have them.
\
The more I look at the bottom, it too looks pasted in. I can see a vague square around it.


Geez....Lat, thanks for stealing my thunder (more like a small burp in this case).....Here is my analysis as promised: The top image is obvously a fake, in fact if you look at the image properties it tells you it is an embedded image. I looked at both images in Corel 12 PhotoPaint under various filters and as Lat stated , you can clearly see the inset lines on either side of the Drone image inset into the rest of the scene. You get similar irregularities when veiwed under many other filters as well. As to the second image, it was mostly inconclusive due to the poor resolution and density of tree branches in the vacinity of the image boudaries. Hard to tell, but as they appear to come from the same source, I would feel pretty certain they are both fakes, agreed. I just had not seen these posted anywhere else. These are the only 2 images from the location that I have seen. I'll be back with the other analysis on two well known Drone photos as promised in a bit. Ciao for now.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 8th, 2007, 3:51pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 1:24pm, Latitude wrote:
[quote author=Marvin link=board=drone&num=1191662183&start=88#5 date=1191866094]

Absolutely Marvin. I have always considered you as a friend. Please don't misconstrue my rough way of posting to be a slight at you because it is not meant to be that way. I try my best to relate what I'm am feeling but something always gets lost in that translation. So please remember this, whatever I post in response to you is not meant as an offense. I may from time to time disagree with what you say and you will likely do the same to me. I believe we can disagree and still be friends. (It would be boring if we always agreed wink ).

It was Fore from OMF who found out the drone photo was hoaxed by Lev over a month ago. I for the most part remained quiet about it. Just recently Lev has put up a blog admitting to the hoaxing. So the cat is out of the bag now and that is why I bring it up. With Fore we had a good suspicion. Now Lev admits it so it can now be posted.

Good for you and RoH for making the correct decision. What evidence did you use to make that determination? I did not make that claim because I felt there was not enough to go on at the time. So I had that pic in my grey basket so to speak. I never took a side about it real or fake.

My point is the Chad, Raj, Steven and Ty pics are different. They are much easier to make a determination on. Do you agree?

As for CGI people, I normally do not like their attitude. They are closed minded and arrogant for the most part. They are often so far into their craft that they think it's the be all and end all to anything unusual. Salad started out that way. He has since softened his stance because after all his creations he has realized they do not duplicate the realism of the original photos. Every now and then you will get a cgi guy who is willing to think outside the box (CGI software box?). LMH has a report from just such an individual on her website.



I did not take offence. wink

I was not aware that Fore exposed this (this is why we need each other on this forum, to stay informed). So Leviathan could not stay quiet? Oh well. Nothing surprises me anymore. You just got to wonder why these folks think it is a good idea to do this stuff. I guess that is why we have the story about the boy who cried wolf (but there is a moral to the story, which they may be over looking they have no credibility or leadership now).

I have been shown some issues with the other drone photos. I will give you a hint, it has to do with the "feelers." In CGI, there is an inherent signature with thin curved lines on bright backgrounds... but I am having difficulty determining if it is due to being CGI or it is due to the resolution. A wise man once told me "A camera can not show what it does not see."

So here is a key as you pointed out earlier, and that I have pointed out earlier. Take a very high resolution photo and down size it, you can hide many evils that way, including if it is CGI added to a real photo.

With all of the noise in these photos, it is impossible for me to be 100% certain. We need the original photos or we are just chasing phantoms in circles.

While it may sound like I am defending Saladfingers, I am not here to speak for him or defend his position. As I recall, a gantlet was tossed at him from many directions, and as he stated, he only came to defend himself. I had a number of PM with Kris explaining my point of view... that this fighting was a waste of time and leads no where, except to more fighting. I think Kris realized the truth of it and that not everyone on the forum was out to get him (some forums can be a lonely place, no?). I think he did become less defensive before he left. If Kris has some positive things to contribute to the thread, I look forward to seeing them. I look forward to seeing all sides of the debates. How else shall we learn?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 4:28pm

Marvin,

When you analyze the photos be sure to take into account that the Chad photos and the Ty photos are scans, and the Ty photos were scanned from small 4x6 prints. The Raj (hi rez) and Steven photos are direct from digicam.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Oct 8th, 2007, 4:42pm

Here are the images the quick "expert" analysis refers to:


User Image

User Image

This is what the expert had to say on a quick look:

"As you might imagine, I receive many requests to analyze images and typically charge a fee for my time. I have taken a quick look at the images you sent. The second image, in particular, is most likely a fake -- note that the sky is completely saturated suggesting a long exposure and/or large aperture. The object shown, however, is not at all saturated and the light/dark regions are perfectly resolved. It is hard to see how this could have realistically happened.
In addition, a look at the image metadata and JPEG quantization tables shows that these images have not come directly from a camera, but have been passed through some sort of photo-editing software."


This being said, I just realized something. I don't think these are the original "Hi-Res" images that LMH has in her possession. I think I now recall that the above images were enhanced highly to gain greater contrast and clarity. As I look at them again, this seems to be the case. Am I right about this? This would have obviously caused a different outcome (incorrect conclusion) on the analysis ( perhaps still fake, but maybe for different reasons....or perhaps...)
Does anyone have copies of the non-manipulated High res version of the above images? If I can get a copy, I will send it for another "quick look" if my expert has the time. Thanks for the help.
One of the things that I don't understand is where some of the forum members are getting the hi-res images I have seen posted? Most of the ones I have downloaded are such low resolution as to be fairly worthless as far as photo analysis goes. My hat's off to those with the expertise and sources to be able to reach empirical conclusions based on most of the low-grade photographic evidence I have seen web-wide.
And the quest continues.... grin BTW, some very cool stuff from RoH.....stay way outside the box cool

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 8th, 2007, 6:41pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 4:42pm, Cogent1 wrote:
This being said, I just realized something. I don't think these are the original "Hi-Res" images that LMH has in her possession. I think I now recall that the above images were enhanced highly to gain greater contrast and clarity.

Does anyone have copies of the non-manipulated High res version of the above images? If I can get a copy, I will send it for another "quick look" if my expert has the time. Thanks for the help.
One of the things that I don't understand is where some of the forum members are getting the hi-res images I have seen posted?

Its a long story but theres only been one true hi-res image released, its one of the 12 TY/BB images and can be downloaded here:

http://www.divshare.com/image/1315375-9ce

But even this is merely a scan of the original.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 6:53pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 4:42pm, Cogent1 wrote:
This is what the expert had to say on a quick look:

"As you might imagine, I receive many requests to analyze images and typically charge a fee for my time. I have taken a quick look at the images you sent. The second image, in particular, is most likely a fake -- note that the sky is completely saturated suggesting a long exposure and/or large aperture. The object shown, however, is not at all saturated and the light/dark regions are perfectly resolved. It is hard to see how this could have realistically happened.
In addition, a look at the image metadata and JPEG quantization tables shows that these images have not come directly from a camera, but have been passed through some sort of photo-editing software."



Cogent1,

I am disappointed in your expert. Does he believe in the possibility of ETs? I think not, hence his knee jerk label of fake. Some of us have been here since the beginning and have already heard these same arguments. But I'm going to stick it out with you because you seem like a sincere fellow.

The photo editing software does not indicate a fake. It may indicate the photos has been re-sized or the brightness adjusted or any number of things. Some people use photoshop simply to get their pictures out of their camera and into their computer.

Do a search in the forum for "white sky". Remember that the Ty photos are 4x6 prints that were scanned and enhanced by LMH. Ty most likely used a cheap instamatic camera. You also have to take into account the weather that day. Here is the Steven sighting which happened the same day, taken from a different vantage point (he could have been photographing the object simultaneously as Ty was). Check out the sky.

http://www.ufocasebook.com/bigbasin.html

Be sure to click on the images to get the full size.

I'll look around to see who's hosting the higher res pics and post back.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by elephant on Oct 8th, 2007, 7:19pm

One more thing Latitude and anyone else who is interested in the truth about this topic seen this?
http://cropcirclexplorer.com/yabb/YaBB .pl?num=1191744843
I suggest the naysayers so confident in their understanding of science or technology rip into him OR
keep on's mouth shut!
Regards
E!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by hjdelight on Oct 8th, 2007, 7:32pm

Link not working elephant.

HJ
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 7:42pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 7:32pm, hjdelight wrote:
Link not working elephant.

HJ


Here it is. http://cropcirclexplorer.com/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1191744843
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 8th, 2007, 8:05pm

Let the show begin. shocked
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 8th, 2007, 8:05pm

I don't know what to make of that. It again sounds like techobable. Honestly it seems like the author enjoys throwing weird scientific jargon around instead of clearly stating his point. The whole thing sounds weird pyramids, ceramic dynamic thingamabobs. I would imagine a trained scientist would have trouble following any of this. I am suspicious of this fellows input.

I firmly believe the original drones are a real phenomena, but sadly many cooky people seem to be jumping on the bandwagon and muddying the water.

Whatever happened to sending Linda more Issac questions? He responded to some of the critics, has that e-mail been sent and if so when? and also has someone simply and politely asked linda if she is writing a book on the drones? At least we'd have something to look forward to, if not then we could ask her if she would release the high res pics for members of her site. I for one would join just to get the pics.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 8:17pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 8:05pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
Let the show begin. shocked


He's baaaack!

How's it going, Catcher? Have you seen anything strange up in your neck of the woods lately?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 8th, 2007, 8:25pm

Not lately, but a few weeks back I was looking at the moon through the telescope and as I was adjusting it. I seen to bright lights in the sky going very slow. then one turned off like a light bulb. then the one that was flying chase vanished in the same area as the first. I was not the only one that could not explain what we seen that clear night. net was not ready for action LOL. tongue
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 8:30pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 8:05pm, danblast wrote:
Whatever happened to sending Linda more Issac questions? He responded to some of the critics, has that e-mail been sent and if so when? and also has someone simply and politely asked linda if she is writing a book on the drones? At least we'd have something to look forward to, if not then we could ask her if she would release the high res pics for members of her site. I for one would join just to get the pics.



No response as far as I know. I have asked about the book and she did not respond to that question. She's a very suspicious lady. As soon as I aligned myself too heavily with these forums she clammed up. I think you should send her an email. But be forewarned. She won't reply to you if you take an attitude like you have done with Dr Sherwood. I got to tell you, I have been around some physicists and they sometimes sound like they are not speaking English. I must take what they say very slowly and analyze each word. Let's at least hear what the Dr has to say before slamming the door shut. I'm very interested. Oh, don't tell LMH you frequent any of these forums.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 8:32pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 8:25pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
net was not ready for action LOL. tongue

ROTFLMAO grin grin grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 8th, 2007, 8:37pm

Glad you get a laugh out of it. I love being known for the net. It gave me a funny appeal to people here and many other forms. But most of all how have you and the many other friends here been doing. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 8th, 2007, 9:22pm

on Oct 8th, 2007, 8:37pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
Glad you get a laugh out of it. I love being known for the net. It gave me a funny appeal to people here and many other forms. But most of all how have you and the many other friends here been doing. wink


We are still hanging in there. Still fighting out the drone topic. I still have not seen a drone but I thought I heard one once. I felt a low rumble and heard cracking noise and went outside but saw nothing. Maybe it was only a car with a big stereo going by.

In case you want to know it was I who put OTF up to making that cartoon. He has a talent for doing those and I suggested he do one in your honor! I think he might even have another one in the works, so stay tuned. I'm glad you can see the humor in it. That says a lot about your character. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 8th, 2007, 9:29pm

He let me in on it. I thought it was alert 5 using a different screen name LOL. But truly thanks for thinking about me I just havn,t the time anymore to come here often. but I promise I will still put a laugh or two your guys way. UFOCATCHER......
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Oct 9th, 2007, 12:46am

on Oct 8th, 2007, 6:41pm, DrDil wrote:
Its a long story but theres only been one true hi-res image released, its one of the 12 TY/BB images and can be downloaded here:

http://www.divshare.com/image/1315375-9ce

But even this is merely a scan of the original.


DD, thanks for the link. It is unfortunate we always seem to be working from copies....usually from a digital source...which is so much easier to manipulate that film negatives. I think it is time we use another technology to try and bag a Drone!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Oct 9th, 2007, 01:31am

on Oct 8th, 2007, 6:53pm, Latitude wrote:
Cogent1,

I am disappointed in your expert. Does he believe in the possibility of ETs? I think not, hence his knee jerk label of fake. Some of us have been here since the beginning and have already heard these same arguments. But I'm going to stick it out with you because you seem like a sincere fellow.

The photo editing software does not indicate a fake. It may indicate the photos has been re-sized or the brightness adjusted or any number of things. Some people use photoshop simply to get their pictures out of their camera and into their computer.

Do a search in the forum for "white sky". Remember that the Ty photos are 4x6 prints that were scanned and enhanced by LMH. Ty most likely used a cheap instamatic camera. You also have to take into account the weather that day. Here is the Steven sighting which happened the same day, taken from a different vantage point (he could have been photographing the object simultaneously as Ty was). Check out the sky.

http://www.ufocasebook.com/bigbasin.html

Be sure to click on the images to get the full size.

I'll look around to see who's hosting the higher res pics and post back.



Lat, thanks for the input.....but let's not judge my expert too quickly. wink They looked at these images for all of 10 minutes or so, as I could not afford a full analysis at $350.00/hour (2-40 hours required depending on depth of analysis). They do work for many world governments, DoD, NSA, Museums, etc.....The methods used include computer modeled algorithmic optical computational still image and video techniques (too many to post here). These are academic world players. Granted, they operate within the current narrow scientific paradigm....so they probably aren't going to be inviting ET's to their next symposium. A moot point anyway. The main point they make is simply this: if the sky is long/over exposed and the craft is under the same lighting conditions, the craft should be similarly washed out, but it is not....perhaps a field distortion of some sort...could be, but could also be due to digital manipulation (perhaps innocently), but there is an inconsistency from a photographic point of view. That's all they were getting at. They said also that it would take much more analysis to reach a solid conclusion.
Were the TY prints from a digital or film camera? Digital manipulation could have ocurred prior to printing depending on who made the prints.
We need to get some images of one of these Drones with something other than optical instruments. I am quite sure if these are actual craft, they must have several different "unique" signatures that would be quite singular in nature. Lat, we must not give up, no matter where the truth leads us. A valid conclusion or proof of concept is worth the effort. Even if this turns out to be an unprovable case....there are many others out there if we can just use the right tools/methods to capture the data. Ahhh, the fun of the chase!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 9th, 2007, 05:32am

--o0o--

I was looking up "StarGateSg1"(Science-fiction movie/TVseries).
Notice the "barcode" in the inner circle (For best performance view fullsized picture):

http://www.wallpaperlinks.be/img/mes_wall/stargate02-1024x768.jpg

It has parallels to the ones on the "Isaac Primer", only prensented in
another way.

Whether or not this is coincidence I'll let it be up to you. I find it interesting, yet strange somehow.
--o0o--

I find this interesting too, talking about barcodes:

http://www.technoriversoft.com/CircularBarcode.html

--o0o--

--VonStern

--o0o--
Thanks, Dan smiley
--o0o--
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 9th, 2007, 06:47am

on Oct 9th, 2007, 05:32am, VonStern wrote:
--o0o--

I was looking up "StarGateSg1"(Science-fiction movie/TVseries).
Notice the "barcode" in the inner circle (For best performance view fullsized picture):

http://www.wallpaperlinks.be/img/mes_wall/stargate02-1024x768.jpg

It has parallels to the ones on the "Isaac Primer", only prensented in
another way.

Whether or not this is coincidence I'll let it be up to you. I find it interesting, yet strange somehow.
--o0o--

I find this interesting too, talking about barcodes:

http://www.technoriversoft.com/CircularBarcode.html

--o0o--

--VonStern

--o0o--
Thanks, Dan smiley
--o0o--


Hi Von Stern,
Your Bar code theory is very good I find it being used in several areas of technology including Physiology which could explain some contact from a previous research effort I studied.

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=523874

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:zosJ9QwAHQoJ:www.engr.uconn.edu/~ion/FILES/pub/iwbra05b.ps+algorithms+expressed+a+barcodes&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=6&gl=us

This link shows info about Castles4me ASC II theory alogaritims along with a sample barcode that shows how they look.

http://www.neodynamic.com/barcodes/DataMatrix_Barcode.aspx

And finally wink barcode of the Cosmos.

http://passporttoknowledge.com/sun/educators/cosmos.html

With the witnesess testimony of an earlier post of a Park Ranger that thought drones where just a normal thing around his part of the woods.

Maybe the drones that we are all so interested in are doing what I had an earlier thought testing the enviorment for dangerous stuff, looking at battle damage, following airplanes. LOL ETC. Just a thought on my part..
Some better searcher here can find that post about the park Ranger thinking the drones are just normal cause I just gave up ROFL I am researched out lately.

Von Stern to be simple spoken I think You and Castles4me are on to something good. Thanks
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 9th, 2007, 09:49am

I am new, I have tried to read as many posts as I can but there are so many! 500 pages or more. So it is possible, indeed almost certain that I am repeating points made earlier. Notwithstanding, as regards the Isaac Caret document:

1) As to antigravity: The Wikapedia article on this states most physicists doubt it exists. If it does, then if my understanding of the article is correct, it is linked to antimatter (as I would expect), and it has not yet been possible to create antimatter long enough to observe a gravitational effect. If the Caret lab had observed anything to do with antigravity it would have leaked out into the scientific community by now, this would be a tremendous scientific breakthough which could not be suppressed for long. The stated purpose of the lab was to commercialize this technology.

2) Symbolic intelligence wa (sorry just returned from Japan), each symbol would have to be an object, and have the necessary coding behind it (not necessarily conventional coding). Then the objects could be represented and processed much more flexibly in the usual way in a computer. This conception of Isaac's appears to be a romantic throughback to the days of analogue computing, and for its legitimacy draws on the formal symbolic calculus of Russell, Turing et al. Thus it seems plausible on first read, while you are "suspending disbelief" as you read a good story. After that, well we aren't here to be unkind to Isaac ...

3) Putting together four bits of memory gives more than four times the effect wa: It's called synergy, networks are good for that, so lets stick it in. How could they operate the alien device to make such an observation? If they did, it would have to be a massive line of research in itself. This purportedly top level summary would, in the real world, reference such work along the lines of "Kuhn and Tuckerman, doc:EC-192, have investigated the operating characteristics of the system and have concluded... ".

Others have made many similar points. If this were genuine, or even plausible, it would have attracted attention from mainstream media. Thus, reject Caret documentation.
Fine, so what? The real problem is, I realized that the Caret document is a poisoned well which deprecates the whole drone thing. The Stephen and Ty sightings incorporate the symbol diagrams, so they are almost certainly (like 99.99%) linked to something I have rejected. As to the pre-Caret sightings, the situation is more complex. They are also suspect because they feature the font. I have thought about this and I don't think it would be possible for the Caret document to be created in the short interval between Rajman and Caret, or even the longer interval between Chad and Caret. A lot of detailed work has gone into it. What is more, the font is not something tacked on afterwards. It is central not only to the diagrams, but to the very concepts expressed (the symbolic manipulation). 'Saladfingers' took somewhat longer to create his video, which is about the same level of complexity, a bit less if anything. Don't take my word for it, ask Saladfingers.

So it seems 99% probable, on issues quite apart from the images themselves, that the drone thing - at least so far as the good pics go - is a hoax. I would be 100% certain, and not bother to post at all, were it not for Linda Moulton Howe's rather impressive list of drone sightings, and the fact she has verified the independent existence of Chad, Rajman and Ty. As the months pass by, the promised interviews with Chad, Rajman and Ty have not appeared. Furthermore, Ms Howe has herself gone very quiet on the topic. Possibly she has drawn the same conclusions as me?

Turning now to the little stories accompanying each sighting, they each look plausible, but we have already established that Isaac is a gifted writer. Most people cannot do it, probably only 5% of the population have the ability to write an account which looks prima facie plausible. Note that no account accompanied the Lev drone photo. However, if *I* had witnessed the story of the millenium and taken high quality photos of it, I would be rushing to get my 5 minutes of fame, and cash in as well probably. Call me attention seeking if you will, but of the 20 people or so who who are supposed to have witnessed the drone in the high quality photo sightings, not one seems to want to come forward.
Chad: Chad and his neighbours, 5 say
Lake Tahoe Lady: 2
Rajman: 4
Stephen: 1 (incidentally, does anyone remember Chad- the dark half?)
Ty: 8
Total: 20
Particularly the cycling case is odd: eight hearty lads, oxygenated after a day's healthy exercise, see the drone not once, not twice, not even three times, but FOUR times, take excellent photos of it from every angle, and do nothing about it! Despite the fact there are eight of them to testify! I don't know what cyclists are like in America, but in Australia they are a pretty coc-ky bunch (did I tell you we won 6 gold medals in cycling at the last Olympics) - it wouldn't happen here. (Your editor rejects it when I write coc-ky, what is wrong with xxxxy? So I put it in two bits for you.)

It does not follow that drones themselves do not exist, and possibly if this is a hoax it is inspired by the hoaxers' genuine experience with drones. There are better validated sightings, including the Kentucky video and the bloke who gave his full name and occupation. I will make a second post with some more positive thoughts on the subject.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 9th, 2007, 10:38am

whats up ufocatcher;Latitude did you see vonsterns post on page 8,just what i was talking about.web news today;nobel physics prize goes to german and frenchman.lol cool cool.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 9th, 2007, 10:46am

Now a question I have for you: surely many members of this forum live in California. So why haven't some of you gone to Lake Tahoe to find out if Lake Tahoe Lady's dwelling actually exists? Plenty of information in the photos, couple of beams of different sizes, two trees, satellite dish. Can't be too many places like that. Looks pretty budget, not an expensive place locked away in an estate. How many houses are there around Lake Tahoe... 10,000? I know from letterboxing you can do 1,000 houses in a day, walking. Five blokes should be able to do the whole thing in one day, cycling. ( Who knows, you might come across Ty and his mates out on another run, and then you'll see heaps of drones yourselves, joining that elite club of people who know the truth about this.) (Take a camera would be my advice.)

Then when you find the house, it is a rental according to the story, so ask the current tenants who the agent is. Find the agent and explain the situation, ask them to verify if a married couple stayed there Sat 5th - Sun 6th May. If so, take them down the pub and after a couple of ales they might be tell you even more.

Similarly, there is surely enough information in that first mobile phone photograph of Chad's to find the actual spot where it was taken around Bakersfield. If a fraction of the time spent speculating online went into practical detective work, we would have the answer in no time.

On a different level, it would be very exciting indeed if these drones actually exist and have the cloaking ability ascribed to them. They would have been around for thousands of years, and presumably keeping a record of everything they see. One day our new found alien friends might present us with a video record of our own history. We might yet find out what St Paul the apostle looked like in real life! I suppose it would open up a new area of historical inquiry, trying to decide who was who in the videos.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 9th, 2007, 10:51am

on Oct 9th, 2007, 09:49am, turkoman wrote:
Turning now to the little stories accompanying each sighting, they each look plausible, but we have already established that Isaac is a gifted writer. Most people cannot do it, probably only 5% of the population have the ability to write an account which looks prima facie plausible. Note that no account accompanied the Lev drone photo. However, if *I* had witnessed the story of the millenium and taken high quality photos of it, I would be rushing to get my 5 minutes of fame, and cash in as well probably. Call me attention seeking if you will, but of the 20 people or so who who are supposed to have witnessed the drone in the high quality photo sightings, not one seems to want to come forward.
Chad: Chad and his neighbours, 5 say
Lake Tahoe Lady: 2
Rajman: 4
Stephen: 1 (incidentally, does anyone remember Chad- the dark half?)
Ty: 8
Total: 20
Particularly the cycling case is odd: eight hearty lads, oxygenated after a day's healthy exercise, see the drone not once, not twice, not even three times, but FOUR times, take excellent photos of it from every angle, and do nothing about it! Despite the fact there are eight of them to testify! I don't know what cyclists are like in America, but in Australia they are a pretty coc-ky bunch (did I tell you we won 6 gold medals in cycling at the last Olympics) - it wouldn't happen here. (Your editor rejects it when I write coc-ky, what is wrong with xxxxy? So I put it in two bits for you.)

It's weirder than that. Ty was a dronie! He was excited to be not only working with LMH but also to be a key player. Then all of the sudden silence.

What do you mean Chad the half dark?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 9th, 2007, 11:11am

"The language" quote=Isaac,(essentially individual particles can function independently; well last night about 3:00 in the mornin a green looking allien head showed me that how the symbols moved is like how blood flows thru the blood stream yet as symbols allmost like thick liquid or like looking thru a microscope at a bactera this is what Isaac ment about takink our alphabet and spell fox in your head and go on spelling a new word without using the 3 letters that you have already use and on.the best that I can exsplain what I was seeing last night it was like the letter L and other symbols that turned and flowed with a liquid which helped them flow tru the drones like or vesciles in our body.take it for what its worth.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 9th, 2007, 11:41am

To Latitude:

Did Ty post to this forum and if so, where? Or do you know him through another forum or privately?

I am wondering if 'alien' is politically correct enough considering that they may have been taping our history for us. It has xenophobic connotations. Maybe we should start referring to them as the 'separately evolved'.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 9th, 2007, 12:00pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 10:46am, turkoman wrote:
Now a question I have for you: surely many members of this forum live in California. So why haven't some of you gone to Lake Tahoe to find out if Lake Tahoe Lady's dwelling actually exists? Plenty of information in the photos, couple of beams of different sizes, two trees, satellite dish. Can't be too many places like that. Looks pretty budget, not an expensive place locked away in an estate. How many houses are there around Lake Tahoe... 10,000? I know from letterboxing you can do 1,000 houses in a day, walking. Five blokes should be able to do the whole thing in one day, cycling. ( Who knows, you might come across Ty and his mates out on another run, and then you'll see heaps of drones yourselves, joining that elite club of people who know the truth about this.) (Take a camera would be my advice.)

Then when you find the house, it is a rental according to the story, so ask the current tenants who the agent is. Find the agent and explain the situation, ask them to verify if a married couple stayed there Sat 5th - Sun 6th May. If so, take them down the pub and after a couple of ales they might be tell you even more.

Similarly, there is surely enough information in that first mobile phone photograph of Chad's to find the actual spot where it was taken around Bakersfield. If a fraction of the time spent speculating online went into practical detective work, we would have the answer in no time.



I think Tahoe is a bit larger than a two day search... there is 114 km (71 miles) of shore line alone. Probably up to 100,000 folks scattered around the area... and a lot is hidden by pine forest too. It may be closer to a Walkabout than a two day affair. wink

Bakersfield is about 1/6 the size of Adelaide, but has about 800,000 folks living there (compared to Adelaide's 1,100,000). But it is a daunting task to go into the surrounding countryside and find the exact same spot, no? It would depend on the definition of "Bakersfield"... which may have been a loosely used term at best.

Anything is possible with enough time, warm bodies and money.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 9th, 2007, 12:28pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 11:41am, turkoman wrote:
To Latitude:

Did Ty post to this forum and if so, where? Or do you know him through another forum or privately?


No. Ty never posted here as far as I know. Read the second paragraph of Ty's letter to LMH here:
http://www.earthfiles.com/news.php?ID=1270&category=Environment

Raj did post twice to OMF. He answered all my questions!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 9th, 2007, 12:30pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 12:00pm, Marvin wrote:
I think Tahoe is a bit larger than a two day search... there is 114 km (71 miles) of shore line alone. Probably up to 100,000 folks scattered around the area... and a lot is hidden by pine forest too. It may be closer to a Walkabout than a two day affair. wink


Yeah that's very much correct. Good luck trying to track down Tahoe Wife_Mufon submitter 7013. They may have only been renting the cabin at Tahoe. I have done this myself a few times.

Edit to add:
Oops. I see it was already identified as a rental.

Also, there is no terrain like the Chad photos around Bakersfield. I don't believe Chad was from Bakersfield. Where did that Bakersfield idea come from?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 9th, 2007, 1:52pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 12:00pm, Marvin wrote:
It would depend on the definition of "Bakersfield"... which may have been a loosely used term at best.


To quote myself. grin grin grin



But here is the source:

http://ufocasebook.conforums.com/index.cgi?board=drone&action=display&num=1185472540


PREVIOUS DRONE ACCOUNTS

Chronological Order

Bakersfield California May 6, 2007 - Chad and multiple witnesses
http://www.ufocasebook.com/strangecraftphotos.html
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 9th, 2007, 2:39pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 06:47am, Razor wrote:
Some better searcher here can find that post about the park Ranger thinking the drones are just normal cause I just gave up ROFL I am researched out lately.

Shirley, Retired California Department of Developmental Services Mental Health Technician, Central Valley, California: It was around May of 2005. And we had gotten lost about what road to take out of the Sequoias to get back on the right road heading home. I told my dad (now deceased), Pull over. Im going to talk with the Park Ranger and see if he can help us.

Came over talking to this ranger. And while talking, this weird thing flew overhead. Never seen anything like it in my whole life!

I asked the Park Ranger, What is that? And he very casually just went, Oh, yeah, Im told its some kind of communications device. Its supposed to help the Park Service to monitor any possible problems like fires and such. That was pretty much his total explanation of what it was.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by raska on Oct 9th, 2007, 3:30pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 11:41am, turkoman wrote:
To Latitude:

Did Ty post to this forum and if so, where? Or do you know him through another forum or privately?

I am wondering if 'alien' is politically correct enough considering that they may have been taping our history for us. It has xenophobic connotations. Maybe we should start referring to them as the 'separately evolved'.

This link gets you to Raj's answers on OMF
HERE

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by oljack666 on Oct 9th, 2007, 3:44pm

I sort of wish interocitor was allowed to come back. A lot of this was because of his comments he made on his artwork about another whose name I won't mention. But, at the same time, that someone started it on his own artwork using interocitor's aka. Interocitor was just responding the only way he knew how.

Even though OMF is not the UFO Casebook, many of you post in both each day. So what is it, are you expected to read certain thing said about you over there and when you come here you're expected to bite your tongue toward those same individuals or are you not wearing residual from OMF. Then again, you read things here about so and so and then have to bite your tongue over there depending on whether or not the mods and admin are on good terms with that person. The real sad thing is that admin over there doesn't do anything about it and instead go after him too.

The majority of the moderators here didn't know the big picture at OMF and only see what's happening here and I do not think read much if any of what was personally directed at interociter's aka, which I believe caused him to be banned here.

It's unfortunate because just for example there's a 15 page thread in OMF alone, which is nothing but an attack on one person and that person is Interocitor's aka.

Now who would ever allow such in this forum. Absolutely nobody but they allowed it in OMF. As a matter of fact, the mods and admin in OMF even posted in that thread accordingly. They all attacked him when they should have deleted the thread from the beginning. It was a blatant and lengthy 15 page attack on one person.

In this country it's called gang warfare. Who is going to kill who first?

In the end, who was made to feel like a piece of crap because of such? Only Interocitor's aka. What is the normal course that one takes after being blasted such as he was after more then 15 pages of posts? Well, that's quite obvious, in his case it was retaliation.

His feelings were very hurt and he used the Casebook to vent in and to pay certain people back for hurting him (emotionally) and that's all it was. I saw the big picture. I read all the posts over there.

It's an unfair world.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 9th, 2007, 3:52pm

He can come back for all I care but I am not gonna explain myself anymore to anyone but he should know I am not the guy who deleted him and his comments about Casebook and myself on his website where totally bogus so he needs to apoligize to me if he comes back. I understand his hardship and appreciate his work but I just dont care one way or the other, one Iota what he does.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by oljack666 on Oct 9th, 2007, 3:56pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 3:52pm, Razor wrote:
He can come back for all I care but I am not gonna explain myself anymore to anyone but he should know I am not the guy who deleted him and his comments about Casebook and myself on his website where totally bogus so he needs to apologize to me if he comes back. I understand his hardship and appreciate his work but I just dont care one way or the other, one Iota what he does.


He knows who banned him. The mod even stated who he was in the thread Razor.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Merlin on Oct 9th, 2007, 4:00pm

Yes it was me the point being?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by oljack666 on Oct 9th, 2007, 4:24pm



And OnTheFence I know you've had a change of heart since too so sorry about the 15 page thingy. I forgot that you were the originator. lol grin


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 9th, 2007, 4:52pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 3:44pm, alien_contactee wrote:
I sort of wish interocitor was allowed to come back.

If in fact Interocitor was Lev, you can bet he will be back under a different name.

Mark was correct that Interocitor kept trying to make snide comments about Salad. Is that a ban-able offense? I don't know. Maybe a mod can answer that. I see nothing wrong with making cgi drones as long as they are clearly labeled as recreations.

As to Lev. He did try to hoax UFOcasebook and imo (be that as it may) should be grounds for permanent banning. If Lev did come back as Interocitor does that mean he is clear of the hoaxer status? Another one for the mods I guess.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:02pm

Latitude it is my understanding that flaming someone is not a ban_able offense but after a few warnings a person can be deleted from membership for that.

Banning someone takes a little more effort than that I believe, and is usually done with the general welfare of all UFOcasebook members of the board in mind.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:13pm

I for one do not care who posts here, but I do tire of the fighting and insults that get hurled. I do not think I am alone in these thoughts.

I joined to read, learn, and share about UFOs (Drones in this case), not to read about personal attacks, insults and end fighting.

If this is going to be allowed, maybe one might think about starting a no holds bar, let'em duke it out type thread (in WWF style), so we won't be distracted here. Just a thought. rolleyes



Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:19pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:13pm, Marvin wrote:
I for one do not care who posts here, but I do tire of the fighting and insults that get hurled. I do not think I am alone in these thoughts.

I joined to read, learn, and share about UFOs (Drones in this case), not to read about personal attacks, insults and end fighting.

If this is going to be allowed, maybe one might think about starting a no holds bar, let'em duke it out type thread (in WWF style), so we won't be distracted here. Just a thought. rolleyes




Thats actually a great idea Marvin one board I belonged to once had forum on it called The Fight Club where people could go and argue to their little hearts content worked out nicely I remember.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by oljack666 on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:24pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:13pm, Marvin wrote:
If this is going to be allowed, maybe one might think about starting a no holds bar, let'em duke it out type thread (in WWF style), so we won't be distracted here. Just a thought. rolleyes


That's a good idea but you would have to stay out of it and not read it based on your comment. I bet you wouldn't though. eek eek grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:39pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:24pm, alien_contactee wrote:
That's a good idea but you would have to stay out of it and not read it based on your comment. I bet you wouldn't though. eek eek grin


I'm a lover, not a fighter. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by oljack666 on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:51pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:39pm, Marvin wrote:
I'm a lover, not a fighter. wink


Well that's easy then Marvin. We'll just throw around the Crisco when you're present. lol grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:55pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 10:38am, jugement wrote:
whats up ufocatcher;Latitude did you see vonsterns post on page 8,just what i was talking about.web news today;nobel physics prize goes to german and frenchman.lol cool cool.
How are ya Jugement? I'm glad to see everyone still gets along here LOL... I cant believe how big this topic is. It would take a year to read everything here. shocked
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 9th, 2007, 6:00pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:55pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
I'm glad to see everyone still gets along here LOL...

One big happy (dysfunctional) family!!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 9th, 2007, 6:02pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:55pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
How are ya Jugement? I'm glad to see everyone still gets along here LOL... I cant believe how big this topic is. It would take a year to read everything here. shocked
just fine,good to know you are okay,you best get a bigger net.lol grin.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 9th, 2007, 6:09pm

LOL. Dont worry the wheels already in motion. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 9th, 2007, 7:25pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 5:51pm, alien_contactee wrote:
Well that's easy then Marvin. We'll just throw around the Crisco when you're present. lol grin


Okay AC, then I'll be careful where I step. rolleyes grin grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by oljack666 on Oct 9th, 2007, 9:46pm

on Oct 9th, 2007, 6:09pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
LOL. Dont worry the wheels already in motion. wink


YO! UFOCATCHER! We missed you. It's not been the same around here.

Here ya go UFOCATCHER, the drones might not see this one until it's too late. lol Might be able to design a bazooka type of weapon that shoots it up into the air. lolgrin

Yea, I know. I should quit while I'm ahead. I always get silly at this hour.

User Image
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by newtothis on Oct 10th, 2007, 01:24am

on Oct 9th, 2007, 4:52pm, Latitude wrote:
As to Lev. He did try to hoax UFOcasebook and imo (be that as it may) should be grounds for permanent banning. If Lev did come back as Interocitor does that mean he is clear of the hoaxer status?


If Lev = Interocitor, then perma-ban is the ONLY solution, imho... And is it a coincidence that a new account(Truether) was made to post a link to the Lev group as soon as Interocitor was booted? rolleyes
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 10th, 2007, 03:58am

on Oct 9th, 2007, 06:47am, Razor wrote:
Hi Von Stern,
Your Bar code theory is very good I find it being used in several areas of technology including Physiology which could explain some contact from a previous research effort I studied.

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=523874

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:zosJ9QwAHQoJ:www.engr.uconn.edu/~ion/FILES/pub/iwbra05b.ps+algorithms+expressed+a+barcodes&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=6&gl=us

This link shows info about Castles4me ASC II theory alogaritims along with a sample barcode that shows how they look.

http://www.neodynamic.com/barcodes/DataMatrix_Barcode.aspx

And finally wink barcode of the Cosmos.

http://passporttoknowledge.com/sun/educators/cosmos.html

With the witnesess testimony of an earlier post of a Park Ranger that thought drones where just a normal thing around his part of the woods.

Maybe the drones that we are all so interested in are doing what I had an earlier thought testing the enviorment for dangerous stuff, looking at battle damage, following airplanes. LOL ETC. Just a thought on my part..
Some better searcher here can find that post about the park Ranger thinking the drones are just normal cause I just gave up ROFL I am researched out lately.

Von Stern to be simple spoken I think You and Castles4me are on to something good. Thanks


Thanks, I am certain there is some greater answers in this coding. As I am higly strung by work these days, I will return later when I have looked deeper into this.

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 11:42am

on Oct 9th, 2007, 9:46pm, alien_contactee wrote:
YO! UFOCATCHER! We missed you. It's not been the same around here.

Here ya go UFOCATCHER, the drones might not see this one until it's too late. lol Might be able to design a bazooka type of weapon that shoots it up into the air. lolgrin

Yea, I know. I should quit while I'm ahead. I always get silly at this hour.

User Image
Lmao That is a good idea hand held net launchers HUM.... Wheres spiderman when you need him LOL. I knew eventually people would see things my way. Capture the drone and part it out on eBay i,m sure their is big money in it. glad to hear from ya AC. hope I have time to catch up on the drone topic shocked
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 10th, 2007, 1:31pm

I'm seeing more hoax drone photos lately.
http://s201.photobucket.com/albums/aa238/Chr15t05/AsiaSighting.jpg

I guess they can mock this issue all they want. My favorite reason for wanting disclosure is because I want to see these people soiling themselves. angry
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 10th, 2007, 2:07pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 1:31pm, Latitude wrote:
I'm seeing more hoax drone photos lately.
http://s201.photobucket.com/albums/aa238/Chr15t05/AsiaSighting.jpg

I guess they can mock this issue all they want. My favorite reason for wanting disclosure is because I want to see these people soiling themselves. angry

Thats not that bad a hoax you know, cant see any obvious manipulation, the pixels that are highlighted around the Drone are also around every object.

Its also a new image, did you notice the configuration is incorrect?

Have a look at the two smaller circles, on the bottom image if you imagine the rotation continuing then it would place them on a different side to the new image.

User Image
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by RoH on Oct 10th, 2007, 2:12pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 1:31pm, Latitude wrote:
I'm seeing more hoax drone photos lately.
http://s201.photobucket.com/albums/aa238/Chr15t05/AsiaSighting.jpg

I guess they can mock this issue all they want. My favorite reason for wanting disclosure is because I want to see these people soiling themselves. angry


It's the Stephen drone flipped horizontal! wink

User Image
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 2:24pm

ich nur vorsichtig betrachten oft shauenin zu erklaren dieser bose. Die Mglichkeit dieses Dings, das ein echter ufo ist, ist sehr absonderlich, um zu glauben. Sehend, dass es, s im breiten Tageslicht berall in der Westkste fliegt. Bringt mich dazu, anderes kluges zu glauben. lassen Sie mich wissen, ob Ihr fr einen Mann das Ufo-Verfangen machte. angry
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 10th, 2007, 2:45pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 2:12pm, RoH wrote:
It's the Stephen drone flipped horizontal! wink

User Image

Good catch Roh, I only checked the Ty images.. rolleyes

Looks like it was dropped into the image as a layer than the transparency levels lowered, perhaps would account for that washed out look?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 10th, 2007, 2:52pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 2:24pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
ich nur vorsichtig betrachten oft shauenin zu erklaren dieser bose. Die Mglichkeit dieses Dings, das ein echter ufo ist, ist sehr absonderlich, um zu glauben. Sehend, dass es, s im breiten Tageslicht berall in der Westkste fliegt. Bringt mich dazu, anderes kluges zu glauben. lassen Sie mich wissen, ob Ihr fr einen Mann das Ufo-Verfangen machte. angry


Sprichst du ber das UFO ber deinem Pfosten?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 3:18pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 2:52pm, Razor wrote:
Sprichst du ber das UFO ber deinem Pfosten?
Ja die Tahoe-Drohne. Sein gewesen zu lange fr dieses Ding, unbekannt zu wandern. Wir mssen etwas darber tun. cool
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 3:26pm

где этот гул был замечен последний? Я хотел бы захватить красоту. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 10th, 2007, 3:28pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 3:18pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
Ja die Tahoe-Drohne. Sein gewesen zu lange fr dieses Ding, unbekannt zu wandern. Wir mssen etwas darber tun. cool


Ja sehr gut das Tahoe Drohne.
Ich habe einen Blick.

Bester Wishs Dank
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 10th, 2007, 3:31pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 3:26pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
? . wink



, !!!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 3:31pm

Sie derselbe Dank cheesy
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 3:36pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 3:31pm, Razor wrote:
, !!!
что не делает Вы понимаете о ip, я не могу быть прослежен
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 10th, 2007, 3:53pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 3:36pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
что не делает Вы понимаете о ip, я не могу быть прослежен



Никогда не беспокойтесь обо мне, я увидел свое сообщение и думаю, что было интересно, я люблю всех и все на планете Земля просто пытаются приветствовать Вас в обсуждении. wink

Nie um mich mich sich sorgen Sge dein Pfosten und gedacht ihm war interessant, liebe ich jeder und alles auf der Planet Masse war gerechtes Versuchen, dich zurck zu der Diskussion zu begren.wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 3:56pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 3:53pm, Razor wrote:
Никогда не беспокойтесь обо мне, я увидел свое сообщение и думаю, что было интересно, я люблю всех и все на планете Земля просто пытаются приветствовать Вас в обсуждении. wink

Nie um mich mich sich sorgen Sge dein Pfosten und gedacht ihm war interessant, liebe ich jeder und alles auf der Planet Masse war gerechtes Versuchen, dich zurck zu der Diskussion zu begren.wink
Я люблю все к, но был мой ip игра игр снова я уверенный wasnt, что Вы подразумевали. cheesy
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:00pm

Actually if you look back over my posts you will see my humorous posts and respect for everyone everywhere.

If you post something fun like that I will always play smiley

Best Wishs Ufocatcher welcome back to the discussion.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:04pm

thank you, I just wanted to see how much German and Russian fluent people where in here. lol peace and happiness to your family smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:05pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 2:07pm, DrDil wrote:
Thats not that bad a hoax you know, cant see any obvious manipulation, the pixels that are highlighted around the Drone are also around every object.


The lighting of the object is terrible and screams !!!FAKE!!! because it does not fit with other background objects.

But I'm sure I don't need to tell you this, Dr Dill. You are the man who, as far as I know, first exposed the Haiti video hoax and for that will always deserve special recognition as a skilled hoax detector.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:10pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:04pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
thank you, I just wanted to see how much German and Russian fluent people where in here. lol peace and happiness to your family smiley



Love and Peace to you my freind and he he wink

- . , humor.I , . , UFO

If I ever make mistakes with my language's please correct me I am not always perfect. But I never have any bad intentions, so no worries. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:20pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:10pm, Razor wrote:
Love and Peace to you my freind and he he wink

- . , humor.I , . , UFO

If I ever make mistakes with my language's please correct me I am not always perfect. But I never have any bad intentions, so no worries. wink
спасибо Im, довольный видеть другие заинтересовал на других языках это истинно, является удивительным. Интересно, сколько других здесь знает то, что мы имеем грустный. Хорошо спасибо за манипулирование было здорово. cheesy
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:24pm

Кто записал (ищутwink неправильно в глобальном поиске. Только случившийся, чтобы видеть это на вашем посту, сумасшедшем я не видел это скорее. LOL laugh
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:38pm

Catcher,

Do you speak German and Russian?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:41pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:38pm, Latitude wrote:
Catcher,

Do you speak German and Russian?
I try to not the best at it my grandparents where from germany.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:43pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:20pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
Im, , . , , . . cheesy



? .
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:46pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:43pm, Razor wrote:
? .
Неделя, что было Вами обращающийся к Im не к уверенному, я говорил Вам о поиске с орфографической ошибкой в глобальном поиске. tongue
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:49pm

Но большое иметь друзей в других странах. жизни полностью отличны отсюда. Бог благословляет Америку wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:53pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:46pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
, Im , . tongue


, , , . wink

No worries not sure wink It is an interesting theory though. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:00pm

God Bless you too UFOcatcher you are an most excellent person.wink Sorry if my language is not 100% correct all the time.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by ABCStore on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:01pm

Guys, please don't pretend you're speaking Russian, cuz you're are not... If you wanna know how bad online translation is just translate it back into English.

Any word from LMH yet?

ABC
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:03pm

Я пошел, чтобы цитировать Вас и где smiley's разоблачил это, имел слово, мигают для своего рода лица smiley через меня прочь, я думал, что Вы написали, мигают , который я только любил бы поймать гул для всех, чтобы видеть cheesy
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:03pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:01pm, ABCStore wrote:
Guys, please don't pretend you're speaking Russian, cuz you're are not... If you wanna know how bad online translation is just translate it back into English.

Any word from LMH yet?

ABC


LOL no word from LMH I really dont think she is gonna answer us. It i s ery nice to see you by the way My russkie hasnt been perfect here LOL wink But I think UFOcatcher is a most excellent person wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:04pm

Я пошел, чтобы цитировать Вас и где разоблачил это, имел слово, мигают для своего рода лица через меня прочь, я думал, что Вы написали, мигают , который я только любил бы поймать гул для всех, чтобы видеть
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:10pm

cant say we don't try lol
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by darin44 on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:26pm

Who's in charge here? This is drifting and there are matters to be discussed!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by creolelady on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:34pm

If there is something you want to discuss, then just step right in and join the conversation.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Farmboy on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:39pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:34pm, creolelady wrote:
If there is something you want to discuss, then just step right in and join the conversation.


I seem to have been blocked out until recently. What is the problem? Seems we can get on with this. The just released Hoagland book raises issues implied/specified that mirror some of the earier doscussions in this thread --- specifically, alien presence, corporate involvement, alien life forms.

LMH dropping the ball is expected. The LMH is a fictional factotum, a dependency trap, a red herring to be pulled away on a string as a trigger (DISAPPEARED) to discourage further discussion whenever talk is near the truth. Let us forget the LMH factor for now and continue in our pursuit of Truth.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Merlin on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:44pm

Farmboy you and darin have the same IP address what gives ?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:48pm

on Oct 10th, 2007, 4:05pm, Latitude wrote:
The lighting of the object is terrible and screams !!!FAKE!!! because it does not fit with other background objects.

Thanks, Lat. When I said, Its not that bad I thought it was an original composition as Id checked the Ty images and there was no rotation or flipping possible that would suggest it was one of them, (until Roh posted the flipped Stephen image.)

I even went back and checked as I didnt think that there were any that showed the rings as clearly, more revision needed I guess!!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 10th, 2007, 6:37pm


AKA Darin44 Quote-Who's in charge here? This is drifting and there are matters to be discussed!

Absolutely, farm boy the show must go on. What do you think about this discussion of the drone? pretty spectacular wouldn't you agree? I have spent many tiresome days trying to find truth in these matters and have came to the same dead ends yourself and others have occurred. But please relax, you must always make time for fun when you work as hard as the folks here on the site do. Sorry if I have offended you by my drifting. lipsrsealed
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by matlivo on Oct 11th, 2007, 08:53am

Quote:
..Well, give or take a baboon - you speak my mind..
..My actions are inexcusable
..Who is Andy Murray? Is it Biblical?..
.. i have just killed interwhatever ..
.. I for one, welcomed our interocitor overlord
..im gonna git me one of dem varmints..
..trying to help, sorry and it wont happen again
..try to sing allong with that
..from some techie in a basment with a tinfoil hat
..Colourless green ideas sleep furiously
..you naughty earth specimens!..
..for and against


all gold
and Im only up to page 5.
And to think, this is the first time I have ever read this thread.
(..For shame.)

As for
Quote:
..To my sadness, this hoax photo is still posted on the Casebook
..somehow reflect back to the case tagging it as 'solved', 'unsolved', 'hoax', etc.. But I'm day dreaming, sorry
..once an image or report is satisfactorily, Debunked ask BJ to edit the respective article to reflect that
...If it aint broke then dont try to fix it!!..


( ..but it is a little broken!)
*******

now I must bid you adieu,
(..for even 'layman technobabble' goes well over my head)

************




ps: have just been nominated for 'Most off-topic post'.
(wish me luck!!!)










Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 11th, 2007, 10:47am

on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:39pm, Farmboy wrote:
I seem to have been blocked out until recently. What is the problem? Seems we can get on with this. The just released Hoagland book raises issues implied/specified that mirror some of the earier doscussions in this thread --- specifically, alien presence, corporate involvement, alien life forms.

LMH dropping the ball is expected. The LMH is a fictional factotum, a dependency trap, a red herring to be pulled away on a string as a trigger (DISAPPEARED) to discourage further discussion whenever talk is near the truth. Let us forget the LMH factor for now and continue in our pursuit of Truth.


Wow Hi Farmboy A friend here I was talking with about a question I have told me you are our resident expert in a certain field and she quite simply said ask you. I iwish to speak with you but dont want to take your time if you are busy but I have a freind who doesnt have time to discuss with me right now, a very good paper he wrote and I want to show it to you, but the catch is I have to email it. I have been here a long time and I am very surprised I have never met you in the past, so you dont know me but I have emailed this to a another freind here and as far as I know she hasnt had any problems with it. I think she would vouch for me if you need That. If you have no time for it no worries, it is a pleasure just to know what field you are expert in.
Best Wishs Razor wink

Oh and by the way post more often I had a really hard time to find you wink took me most of the morning and a couple of messages to my freinds ROFL wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Nodnunk on Oct 11th, 2007, 10:55am

on Oct 10th, 2007, 5:34pm, creolelady wrote:
If there is something you want to discuss, then just step right in and join the conversation.


Has anybody noticed this before?
The arrangement of the spikes in Chad's cell phone photo matches the arrangement in the other photos only when the cell photo is flipped horizontally. We know that the two photo sessions were on different days, so the difference could mean:
1. Chad's drone can reconfigure itself.
2. The drone spikes did not change, but the cell phone photo was flipped horizontally before it was posted.
3. They are different drones.
4. Something else?

Chad's cell phone photo (grey scaled, made negative, flipped horizontally)

User Image


One of Chad's other images for comparison (grey scaled and made negative)

User Image


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 11th, 2007, 11:08am

How do people do that thing where they copy previous remarks, it is so useful.

Re above: tahoeLady's shots show the drone reconfiguring in a matter of seconds, strut goes from left to right. She says the object was moving and revolving. We are asked to believe that drones can do this. I say 'asked to belief' because any report which correlates to the Caret report is suspect in my opinion, given the drivel in that report (great graphics though)

A Tahoe newspaper reported another, non-drone UFO sighting and they ran the famous Chad drone photo. That shows how easy it would have been for any one of the five good sightings to get a run in the media, if they wanted to. We have the five most reticent people in America, otherwise a nation of celebrities!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 11th, 2007, 11:17am

Here is the link:
http://www.tahoedailytribune.com/article/20070706/REGION/107060071

I have to admit the tahoeLady drone may have just rotated, I thought one strut was wider than the other but you couldn't be definite about that from the photos.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 11th, 2007, 11:48am

on Oct 11th, 2007, 10:55am, Nodnunk wrote:
Has anybody noticed this before?
The arrangement of the spikes in Chad's cell phone photo matches the arrangement in the other photos only when the cell photo is flipped horizontally. We know that the two photo sessions were on different days, so the difference could mean:
1. Chad's drone can reconfigure itself.
2. The drone spikes did not change, but the cell phone photo was flipped horizontally before it was posted.
3. They are different drones.
4. Something else?

Chad's cell phone photo (grey scaled, made negative, flipped horizontally)

User Image


One of Chad's other images for comparison (grey scaled and made negative)

User Image



User Image

If you class the segmented paddle as the front of the craft then travel clockwise you would come to the first of the three paddles that are bunched together.

Another way of looking at it could be if you move from the front to the rear in a clockwise motion then you will pass two paddles.

This appears the same in both images doesnt it?

Or have I missed something? undecided

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Nodnunk on Oct 11th, 2007, 12:23pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 11:48am, DrDil wrote:
User Image

If you class the segmented paddle as the front of the craft then travel clockwise you would come to the first of the three paddles that are bunched together.

Another way of looking at it could be if you move from the front to the rear in a clockwise motion then you will pass two paddles.

This appears the same in both images doesnt it?

Or have I missed something? undecided


From my seat, they are different.
Viewing the bottom looking up at the object.
Using the large segmented paddle as reference at zero degrees.
Cell photo:
Rotating clockwise as in your cell-phone inset, the spikes are at 90, 135, 180, 270 degrees.
Your comparison photo:
Rotating clockwise, the spikes are at 90, 180, 225, 270 degrees.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 11th, 2007, 12:42pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 11:48am, DrDil wrote:
User Image

If you class the segmented paddle as the front of the craft then travel clockwise you would come to the first of the three paddles that are bunched together.

Another way of looking at it could be if you move from the front to the rear in a clockwise motion then you will pass two paddles.

This appears the same in both images doesnt it?

Or have I missed something? undecided



on Oct 11th, 2007, 12:23pm, Nodnunk wrote:
From my seat, they are different.
Viewing the bottom looking up at the object.
Using the large segmented paddle as reference at zero degrees.
Cell photo:
Rotating clockwise as in your cell-phone inset, the spikes are at 90, 135, 180, 270 degrees.
Your comparison photo:
Rotating clockwise, the spikes are at 90, 180, 225, 270 degrees.



I agree Nodnunk. The drones appear to be mirrored images of each other.

I may be saying the same thing here...

On Chad's high quality photo, clockwise from the long paddle takes you to the lone spike side.

On the Chads cell phone photo, clockwise takes you to the triple spike side.

Nice catch. Something to talk about.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 11th, 2007, 12:47pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 12:42pm, Marvin wrote:
I agree Nodnunk. The drones appear to be mirrored images of each other.

I may be saying the same thing here...

On Chad's high quality photo, clockwise from the long paddle takes you to the lone spike side.

On the Chads cell phone photo, clockwise takes you to the triple spike side.

Nice catch. Something to talk about.


No. This is an old one and has been explained long ago. Also the Turkoman point has also been explained. I don't have the time right now to go through it but suffice it to say, after all these months do you really think you could be the first to point out these possible discrepancies? Kind of reminds me of the time I thought I discovered major problems in Einstein's SR. I actually thought to myself, "am I the first in history to notice this?" Laughable laugh

I'll be back later to explain unless somebody else wants to.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 11th, 2007, 12:49pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 12:23pm, Nodnunk wrote:
From my seat, they are different.
Viewing the bottom looking up at the object.
Using the large segmented paddle as reference at zero degrees.
Cell photo:
Rotating clockwise as in your cell-phone inset, the spikes are at 90, 135, 180, 270 degrees.
Your comparison photo:
Rotating clockwise, the spikes are at 90, 180, 225, 270 degrees.

Probably just me then!!! grin

User Image



Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 11th, 2007, 2:43pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 12:47pm, Latitude wrote:
No. This is an old one and has been explained long ago. Also the Turkoman point has also been explained. I don't have the time right now to go through it but suffice it to say, after all these months do you really think you could be the first to point out these possible discrepancies? Kind of reminds me of the time I thought I discovered major problems in Einstein's SR. I actually thought to myself, "am I the first in history to notice this?" Laughable laugh

I'll be back later to explain unless somebody else wants to.



I guess we must have missed that discussion. Maybe someone will find some time to fill us in. Besides, there is nothing else shaking.

Hey Latitude, I did not know you dabbled in theoretical physics. As for me... I always thought pi are round, cornbread are squared. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by TeachersPet on Oct 11th, 2007, 2:55pm

nice guys I had not heard that either..there is nothing wrong with going back to the seen of the "crime"
it may take several trips..in this case there is no such thing as a done deal..I say move on it. I liked the break down in degrees..and we have yet to come full circle..they have made it circles within circles ..remember the old scifi tv series where the alien probe was a giant Iq test..to record where intelligent life lay..another film was a probe that would explode like a supernova..if intelligent species succesfully decoded the answers..possibilties are endless..with unknown probes..one could be a welcome..the other a goodbye..
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 11th, 2007, 3:48pm

This has to do with the "Isaac Primer".

As I've been going through endless perceptions of barcode, I would like you to actually count the number of bars in the primer. (regardless of the length of the bars, as it will be in 2 cond tense or more)

As all of you probably have noticed by now, there has not been given numeric equals in the "primer", exept for the one's hidden in the "Barcode"? Right? It's all "language" and symbols.

If any symbol represent a whole, (this is NOT technobabble) there has to be guidiance levels of tuning the instrument, so to speak.

This is probably made by the "barcodes". They contain numbers.

As to read them, for us to understand, is a whole other matter.

If we know the numbers of the "barcode" and the interleave between the three circles....we might be able to determine if this is a hoax or not.

Follow my drift...if it equals out..we know the origin!

Happy excavating!

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 11th, 2007, 5:20pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 2:43pm, Marvin wrote:
I guess we must have missed that discussion. Maybe someone will find some time to fill us in. Besides, there is nothing else shaking.

Hey Latitude, I did not know you dabbled in theoretical physics. As for me... I always thought pi are round, cornbread are squared. wink


Hi Marvin,

Dabbling in physics may be overstating it. I have little formal training in the subject. Like many other things I am self taught. Once I read enough about SR to get a basic understanding it occurred to me that much of it was jumping to odd conclusions based on unfounded previous conclusions. I seemed to me that all his problems stemmed from once mistake, discounting the existence of the aether. That one stumble lead to a snowball effect culminating in all sorts of weird theories.


Here is the explanation of the Chad drone appearing to be mirrored. It may look that way but it all depends on how you see the cell phone pic.

User Image

The drone in the cell phone pic is not coming toward the camera, it's going away.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 11th, 2007, 5:56pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 5:20pm, Latitude wrote:
It may look that way but it all depends on how you see the cell phone pic.

User Image

The drone in the cell phone pic is not coming toward the camera, it's going away.

Thats the conclusion I arrived at (Ive never seen it discussed though) thats why I posted the image of an optical illusion that shows two different images based on the perception of the person who views it.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 11th, 2007, 6:02pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 11:08am, turkoman wrote:
Re above: tahoeLady's shots show the drone reconfiguring in a matter of seconds, strut goes from left to right. She says the object was moving and revolving. We are asked to believe that drones can do this. I say 'asked to belief' because any report which correlates to the Caret report is suspect in my opinion, given the drivel in that report (great graphics though)


Drivel? Hardly. Also every witness has stated the drones rotate as they move and Raj said the rotation appeared to be independent of the movement.

Post May 16 on another forum:

Quote:
http://www.ufocasebook.com/strangecraftlaketahoe.html
Still examining the Tahoe pics and story. I was puzzled by the location of the arms on the object. But now I've come to the conclusion that this Tahoe object is definately not the same one that Chad saw. Chad's object had one large arm and four small. This object has two large arms and two small. It has been reported that the second Tahoe photo looks to be reversed. I have determined it was not. It most likely has rotated about 100 degrees counter-clockwise in 5 seconds.

User Image

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 11th, 2007, 6:03pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 5:20pm, Latitude wrote:
Hi Marvin,

User Image

The drone in the cell phone pic is not coming toward the camera, it's going away.




Actually, for this to work, the long paddle would have to coming toward us and to our right (dipping down so that you would not see the bottom). If you do that, then the clockwise spike count will go lone spike first.

If the long paddle is going away from us to our right, then the clockwise spike count will go three spikes first. But if this is true, you should see the bottom of the drone.



User Image


As you can see from the enlargement, the long paddle appears to be going away and to the right... since we can see the bottom of the drone (that black circular area). It is below the three o'clock position. If this were coming toward us, it should reside above the three o'clock position. This makes the clockwise spike count go three spikes first.

That makes this drone a different configuration and a mirrored image of the clearer photo version.

I guess they missed that on the last discussion.

Great catch and call Nodnunk.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 11th, 2007, 6:14pm

Marvin, excuse me when I said coming and going away that was a mistake. I can make no determination what direction the object is travelling. I guess I was visualizing the long arm as the tail. embarassed See what happens when you let terrestrial thinking bog you down?

The Chad cell phone pic is the top of the drone with the long arm closer to the camera.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 11th, 2007, 6:22pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 6:14pm, Latitude wrote:
Marvin, excuse me when I said coming and going away that was a mistake. I can make no determination what direction the object is travelling. I guess I was visualizing the long arm as the tail. embarassed See what happens when you let terrestrial thinking bog you down?

The Chad cell phone pic is the top of the drone with the long arm closer to the camera.



No worrys about coming and going.

Take another look, it is physically impossible for the long paddle to be between us and the drone.

To do that and see the bottom of the drone, the long paddle would have to be above the 3 o'clock position.

The photo and facts do not back that up.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 11th, 2007, 6:25pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 6:22pm, Marvin wrote:
No worrys about coming and going.

Take another look, it is physically impossible for the long paddle to be between us and the drone.

To do that and see the bottom of the drone, the long paddle would have to be above the 3 o'clock position.

The photo and facts do not back that up.


You are NOT looking at the bottom of the drone. You are looking at the top side.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 11th, 2007, 6:37pm

From MarkM.....Personally, I think the effects of Saladfingers art projects have been highly over rated. I also happen to think that the video, if anything, presented the drones as a question without offering an answer. As to CGI in general, every UFO report these days that makes it to the Discovery or History Channel has a very realistic CGI re-enactment that goes with it.

Here I thought I was the only one here that can see. Far too many people have given this guy way too much credit, he's only close with the general shape of the object after that it's over. He hasn't shown me that it could be CGI, he's shown me that even making a copy is impossible. Don't believe me.......overlay his with pics taken and take a look. If you can't see then I am sorry, not for me, I'm happy that the work I've done over the years has given me a discerning eye.
I hope everyone has noticed that he has left alone the Capitola Drone for the most part, there are people "saying" it's a CGI, but to date there hasn't been a duplicate made to prove such a charge.
To all those that do.....don't just sing it, bring it !!!!!!!
I'm not saying it's real or it isn't, but it isn't CGI so far, it's the most real looking of the whole bunch of pics. I had motion picture cameramen, technicians, and 2 of my friends that are ASC members in good standing for over 25 years, they said it's CGI, I asked show me where it's shows such a thing. I was told the picture ( Capitola) is really good and no flaws can be found, but the craft couldn't possibly be real, so it's CGI or a model, but since no there's no evidence of any propulsion it's CGI.
Before parting they also said if it turns out to be real please let them know how the hell it flies.
I showed the the CARET documents to them, the first words were "why would someone go to such trouble to do all of this ?"
So, it's CGI because it can't be real, there are no flaws that can be detected in the pictures to support CGI.
So, the only reasons I was given for CGI was that it can't be real, but upon seeing a picture of a Salad Drone they stated CGI without question, they see what I see in them also when put side by side.
The dimensions and textures are waaaaaaay off.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 11th, 2007, 6:38pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 6:25pm, Latitude wrote:
You are NOT looking at the bottom of the drone. You are looking at the top side.



That is an interesting idea.

I was basing my idea, that we were looking at the bottom, based on the dark shadowing...

User Image

Like the above, the inside of the ring shows darker,

User Image

It looked like the bottom to me.


Tell me how you are seeing it is the top.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by hjdelight on Oct 11th, 2007, 7:29pm

Hi Marvin!
From my view...how could we be looking at the bottom if we know the paddles and spikes are level with the plane of the inner circle? The paddle jutting off to the right would be at an upward angle if we were looking at the bottom. It is downward so the view must be slightly above and that is the upper portion of the drone in sight. Unless I can be corrected that is. grin

HJ
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by RoH on Oct 11th, 2007, 9:35pm

Hope this helps some of you to see it better! wink

User Image

Optical illusion links:
http://www.cropcircleconnector.com/2007/sugarhill/sugarhill2007.html
http://www.yorku.ca/eye/necker.htm
http://www.colorcube.com/illusions/illusion.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necker_cube
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 11th, 2007, 9:39pm

that fixs that ;good roh.cool cool.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by newtothis on Oct 11th, 2007, 10:05pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 5:20pm, Latitude wrote:
Hi Marvin,

Dabbling in physics may be overstating it. I have little formal training in the subject. Like many other things I am self taught. Once I read enough about SR to get a basic understanding it occurred to me that much of it was jumping to odd conclusions based on unfounded previous conclusions. I seemed to me that all his problems stemmed from once mistake, discounting the existence of the aether. That one stumble lead to a snowball effect culminating in all sorts of weird theories.


Here is the explanation of the Chad drone appearing to be mirrored. It may look that way but it all depends on how you see the cell phone pic.

User Image

The drone in the cell phone pic is not coming toward the camera, it's going away.



That is the correct port and starboard Lat has pointed out...

@Marvin, for the spokes to show through on top of the drone, it would have to be the top that we see...

User Image

Newt!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by newtothis on Oct 11th, 2007, 10:08pm

Doh! What RoH said! grin LOL Took me 15 minutes to do my work of art cry

RoH, very nice illustration!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by RoH on Oct 11th, 2007, 11:44pm

5... 6... 7... and some enhanced pictures of the TY Drone: (click image for full size)

User Image User Image
User Image User Image
User Image User Image
User Image User Image
User Image User Image
(click image for full size)

While we wait for LMH to release the high-res pictures! rolleyes
I want to know what's going on in the jj picture! take a look in the cage... (nr. 4)

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 12th, 2007, 12:09am

on Oct 11th, 2007, 11:44pm, RoH wrote:
While we wait for LMH to release the high-res pictures! rolleyes
I want to know what's going on in the jj picture! take a look in the cage... (nr. 4)


RoH, I've been saying it for months now. I still don't like the looks of the bottom cage. I know many members thought I was nuts. That cage is creeping me out.
User Image
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Nodnunk on Oct 12th, 2007, 07:32am

on Oct 11th, 2007, 9:35pm, RoH wrote:
Hope this helps some of you to see it better! wink

User Image

Optical illusion links:
http://www.cropcircleconnector.com/2007/sugarhill/sugarhill2007.html
http://www.yorku.ca/eye/necker.htm
http://www.colorcube.com/illusions/illusion.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necker_cube


I never considered that we were seeing the top of the drone. It is in the sky and the photographer is on the ground, my bias was and is that we are seeing the bottom. And the long fin is pointing away. If we are seeing the top, then the drone must be tilted with the near part down and the far part up with the long fin to the right.

So the illusions show that it is a matter of perception whether we are seeing the top or bottom. We can never get agreement with such a fuzzy photo.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Nodnunk on Oct 12th, 2007, 07:37am

on Oct 12th, 2007, 12:09am, Latitude wrote:
RoH, I've been saying it for months now. I still don't like the looks of the bottom cage. I know many members thought I was nuts. That cage is creeping me out.
User Image


This is another case of a fuzzy photo and individual perception.
Consider the Saladfingers video, he seems to have figured it out.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 12th, 2007, 07:38am

User Image

Roh, while using this method could you still determine if any part of the image was CGI IF the image had been printed and scanned back into the computer?

Also would it show up as different if it was a CGI item placed on a CGI background?

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 12th, 2007, 09:35am

on Oct 12th, 2007, 12:09am, Latitude wrote:
RoH, I've been saying it for months now. I still don't like the looks of the bottom cage. I know many members thought I was nuts. That cage is creeping me out.
User Image

A lightbulb fitting? grin

User Image
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by hjdelight on Oct 12th, 2007, 11:14am

Egads! laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh

HJ
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 12th, 2007, 11:16am

on Oct 12th, 2007, 07:37am, Nodnunk wrote:
This is another case of a fuzzy photo and individual perception.
Consider the Saladfingers video, he seems to have figured it out.


Maybe it is perception but only that one photo has the bulge in it. Why don't I see a bulge in all of them?

How is the Saladfingers video relevant?

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by RoH on Oct 12th, 2007, 11:27am

on Oct 11th, 2007, 9:39pm, jugement wrote:
that fixs that ;good roh.cool cool.


Thanks jugement, I appreciatie your inputs! hey, what's that phrase again? mine your soul... cool

on Oct 12th, 2007, 12:09am, Latitude wrote:
RoH, I've been saying it for months now. I still don't like the looks of the bottom cage. I know many members thought I was nuts. That cage is creeping me out.


Yeah, there's something sinister looking with the cage structure, what purpose could it have? It's so alien, we can only imagine.
If you look at the different picture animations done of the BB drone, you'll see that there looks to be some kind of configuration going on in the cage.
And we know that there is other parts of the drone that have changed to a new configuration, from picture to picture, so this drone is alive! cool

Latitude, do you think it could be the smaller rings, from the other side of the BB drone, that we see?

on Oct 12th, 2007, 07:32am, Nodnunk wrote:
I never considered that we were seeing the top of the drone. It is in the sky and the photographer is on the ground, my bias was and is that we are seeing the bottom. And the long fin is pointing away. If we are seeing the top, then the drone must be tilted with the near part down and the far part up with the long fin to the right.

So the illusions show that it is a matter of perception whether we are seeing the top or bottom. We can never get agreement with such a fuzzy photo.


To me it looks like the photographer is standing on higher ground. And the photo is clear enough that we can see the spokes, look at the post from newtothis.

on Oct 12th, 2007, 07:37am, Nodnunk wrote:
This is another case of a fuzzy photo and individual perception.
Consider the Saladfingers video, he seems to have figured it out.


Looks like saladfingers perception, is that there are moving parts on the BB drone... but if they where moving/spinning like that, don't you think the people photographing it, would have mention it?

on Oct 12th, 2007, 07:38am, DrDil wrote:
Roh, while using this method could you still determine if any part of the image was CGI IF the image had been printed and scanned back into the computer?


I'll forward your questions to this PS expert I know, and I'll come back to you on this! but it looks like it could take some time, It's autumn vacation here now.

Quote:
Also would it show up as different if it was a CGI item placed on a CGI background?


I think so, if the two pictures have been saved/compressed sepretlly and then put together again, there will be a difference in the jpg structure/pattern, or thats what I've been told.
Hey, I'm no expert, but I know of one, and I hope he will take the time to explain this better for me, and I'll post it in the forum when he do.


Take a look at this video report on the drone case, that's more like it wink
(It's from July 24, 2007, so most of you have probably seen it)

Youtube link:
Strange Drone Craft... UFO







Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Nodnunk on Oct 12th, 2007, 12:36pm

on Oct 12th, 2007, 11:16am, Latitude wrote:
Maybe it is perception but only that one photo has the bulge in it. Why don't I see a bulge in all of them?

How is the Saladfingers video relevant?


Photoshopped image from the Ty High Resolution photo provided by LMH.
Negative greyscale image, with high pass filtering. There seems to be extra stuff present not related to the eight curved prongs or to the central plum bob thing.

How is the Saladfingers video relevant? It's not. I retract the comment.

User Image


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 12th, 2007, 1:07pm

on Oct 12th, 2007, 11:27am, RoH wrote:
Latitude, do you think it could be the smaller rings, from the other side of the BB drone, that we see?

Good job, RoH. That is the most likely explanation. The size does seem to match. Most likely a combination of the outer small ring and inner cage parts.

Quote:
To me it looks like the photographer is standing on higher ground. And the photo is clear enough that we can see the spokes, look at the post from newtothis.

Yes to me it looks like the photographer is standing on a hilltop or ridge. The drone is also tilted (other pics such as the Raj pics do show the drone tilts quite a bit. Remember the drone is not a terrestrial aircraft)

Quote:
Looks like saladfingers perception, is that there are moving parts on the BB drone... but if they where moving/spinning like that, don't you think the people photographing it, would have mention it?


That's the only thing I don't like about the Saladfingers video. He took too much artistic license and basically turned it into a fantasy with things like a fighter jet shooting down a drone. If only he would have did more homework and depicted the drone more as it actually would be. Salad is very talented with cgi but my opinion is he never quite understood the nature of the drones or was able to accurately assemble an overall picture of them in his mind. I would have done the video quite a bit differently. I think my version would show a more alien acting drone.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 12th, 2007, 2:10pm

Roh;Mind Your Mind For The Jewels Of Your Soul.I see that you know the good jewels of your soul,and do not have to do any digging for those jewels. grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Oct 12th, 2007, 2:13pm

At the bottom of the cage is a ring. Each of the eight legs is attached to this ring with a hinge. If you look closely you can actually see several of these hinges from the inside of the lower ring.

The eight cage legs are not attached at the top of the cage.

The inside components hold the legs in place when they are lowered. These parts also act as a holder for the lower ring.

The eight legs are able to be lowered down by their individual hinges to act as a 'stand' for the drone to sit on when it is in storage aboard the mothership.

IMO
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 12th, 2007, 2:30pm

on Oct 12th, 2007, 2:10pm, jugement wrote:

Mind Your Mind For The Jewels Of Your Soul.

User Image
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Oct 12th, 2007, 2:44pm

I don't know if this is salient or not.

*********
Dragonfly or Insect Spy? Scientists at Work on Robobugs.

By Rick Weiss
Washington Post Staff Writer
Tuesday, October 9, 2007; A03



Vanessa Alarcon saw them while working at an antiwar rally in Lafayette Square last month.

"I heard someone say, 'Oh my god, look at those,' " the college senior from New York recalled. "I look up and I'm like, 'What the hell is that?' They looked kind of like dragonflies or little helicopters. But I mean, those are not insects."

Out in the crowd, Bernard Crane saw them, too.

"I'd never seen anything like it in my life," the Washington lawyer said. "They were large for dragonflies. I thought, 'Is that mechanical, or is that alive?' "

That is just one of the questions hovering over a handful of similar sightings at political events in Washington and New York. Some suspect the insectlike drones are high-tech surveillance tools, perhaps deployed by the Department of Homeland Security.

Others think they are, well, dragonflies -- an ancient order of insects that even biologists concede look about as robotic as a living creature can look.

No agency admits to having deployed insect-size spy drones. But a number of U.S. government and private entities acknowledge they are trying. Some federally funded teams are even growing live insects with computer chips in them, with the goal of mounting spyware on their bodies and controlling their flight muscles remotely.

The robobugs could follow suspects, guide missiles to targets or navigate the crannies of collapsed buildings to find survivors.

The technical challenges of creating robotic insects are daunting, and most experts doubt that fully working models exist yet.

"If you find something, let me know," said Gary Anderson of the Defense Department's Rapid Reaction Technology Office.

But the CIA secretly developed a simple dragonfly snooper as long ago as the 1970s. And given recent advances, even skeptics say there is always a chance that some agency has quietly managed to make something operational.

"America can be pretty sneaky," said Tom Ehrhard, a retired Air Force colonel and expert in unmanned aerial vehicles who is now at the Center for Strategic and Budgetary Assessments, a nonprofit Washington-based research institute.

Robotic fliers have been used by the military since World War II, but in the past decade their numbers and level of sophistication have increased enormously. Defense Department documents describe nearly 100 different models in use today, some as tiny as birds, and some the size of small planes.

All told, the nation's fleet of flying robots logged more than 160,000 flight hours last year -- a more than fourfold increase since 2003. A recent report by the U.S. Army Command and General Staff College warned that if traffic rules are not clarified soon, the glut of unmanned vehicles "could render military airspace chaotic and potentially dangerous."

But getting from bird size to bug size is not a simple matter of making everything smaller.

"You can't make a conventional robot of metal and ball bearings and just shrink the design down," said Ronald Fearing, a roboticist at the University of California at Berkeley. For one thing, the rules of aerodynamics change at very tiny scales and require wings that flap in precise ways -- a huge engineering challenge.

Only recently have scientists come to understand how insects fly -- a biomechanical feat that, despite the evidence before scientists' eyes, was for decades deemed "theoretically impossible." Just last month, researchers at Cornell University published a physics paper clarifying how dragonflies adjust the relative motions of their front and rear wings to save energy while hovering.

That kind of finding is important to roboticists because flapping fliers tend to be energy hogs, and batteries are heavy.

The CIA was among the earliest to tackle the problem. The "insectothopter," developed by the agency's Office of Research and Development 30 years ago, looked just like a dragonfly and contained a tiny gasoline engine to make the four wings flap. It flew but was ultimately declared a failure because it could not handle crosswinds.

Agency spokesman George Little said he could not talk about what the CIA may have done since then. The Office of the Director of National Intelligence, the Department of Homeland Security and the Secret Service also declined to discuss the topic.

Only the FBI offered a declarative denial. "We don't have anything like that," a spokesman said.

The Defense Department is trying, though.

In one approach, researchers funded by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA) are inserting computer chips into moth pupae -- the intermediate stage between a caterpillar and a flying adult -- and hatching them into healthy "cyborg moths."

The Hybrid Insect Micro-Electro-Mechanical Systems project aims to create literal shutterbugs -- camera-toting insects whose nerves have grown into their internal silicon chip so that wranglers can control their activities. DARPA researchers are also raising cyborg beetles with power for various instruments to be generated by their muscles.

"You might recall that Gandalf the friendly wizard in the recent classic 'Lord of the Rings' used a moth to call in air support," DARPA program manager Amit Lal said at a symposium in August. Today, he said, "this science fiction vision is within the realm of reality."

A DARPA spokeswoman denied a reporter's request to interview Lal or others on the project.

The cyborg insect project has its share of doubters.

"I'll be seriously dead before that program deploys," said vice admiral Joe Dyer, former commander of the Naval Air Systems Command, now at iRobot in Burlington, Mass., which makes household and military robots.

By contrast, fully mechanical micro-fliers are advancing quickly.

Researchers at the California Institute of Technology have made a "microbat ornithopter" that flies freely and fits in the palm of one's hand. A Vanderbilt University team has made a similar device.

With their sail-like wings, neither of those would be mistaken for insects. In July, however, a Harvard University team got a truly fly-like robot airborne, its synthetic wings buzzing at 120 beats per second.

"It showed that we can manufacture the articulated, high-speed structures that you need to re-create the complex wing motions that insects produce," said team leader Robert Wood.

The fly's vanishingly thin materials were machined with lasers, then folded into three-dimensional form "like a micro-origami," he said. Alternating electric fields make the wings flap. The whole thing weighs just 65 milligrams, or a little more than the plastic head of a push pin.

Still, it can fly only while attached to a threadlike tether that supplies power, evidence that significant hurdles remain.

In August, at the International Symposium on Flying Insects and Robots, held in Switzerland, Japanese researchers introduced radio-controlled fliers with four-inch wingspans that resemble hawk moths. Those who watch them fly, its creator wrote in the program, "feel something of 'living souls.' "

Others, taking a tip from the CIA, are making fliers that run on chemical fuels instead of batteries. The "entomopter," in early stages of development at the Georgia Institute of Technology and resembling a toy plane more than a bug, converts liquid fuel into a hot gas, which powers four flapping wings and ancillary equipment.

"You can get more energy out of a drop of gasoline than out of a battery the size of a drop of gasoline," said team leader Robert Michelson.

Even if the technical hurdles are overcome, insect-size fliers will always be risky investments.

"They can get eaten by a bird, they can get caught in a spider web," said Fearing of Berkeley. "No matter how smart you are -- you can put a Pentium in there -- if a bird comes at you at 30 miles per hour there's nothing you can do about it."

Protesters might even nab one with a net -- one of many reasons why Ehrhard, the former Air Force colonel, and other experts said they doubted that the hovering bugs spotted in Washington were spies.

So what was seen by Crane, Alarcon and a handful of others at the D.C. march -- and as far back as 2004, during the Republican National Convention in New York, when one observant but perhaps paranoid peace-march participant described on the Web "a jet-black dragonfly hovering about 10 feet off the ground, precisely in the middle of 7th avenue . . . watching us"?

They probably saw dragonflies, said Jerry Louton, an entomologist at the National Museum of Natural History. Washington is home to some large, spectacularly adorned dragonflies that "can knock your socks off," he said.

At the same time, he added, some details do not make sense. Three people at the D.C. event independently described a row of spheres, the size of small berries, attached along the tails of the big dragonflies -- an accoutrement that Louton could not explain. And all reported seeing at least three maneuvering in unison.

"Dragonflies never fly in a pack," he said.

Mara Verheyden-Hilliard of the Partnership for Civil Justice said her group is investigating witness reports and has filed Freedom of Information Act requests with several federal agencies. If such devices are being used to spy on political activists, she said, "it would be a significant violation of people's civil rights."

For many roboticists still struggling to get off the ground, however, that concern -- and their technology's potential role -- seems superfluous.

"I don't want people to get paranoid, but what can I say?" Fearing said. "Cellphone cameras are already everywhere. It's not that much different."

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by hjdelight on Oct 12th, 2007, 3:26pm

Why go to all the trouble when you could just have your drone hover over the crowd or chase the suspect or whatever. Invisibility trumps camo everytime. That's why I think the drones are here because ET is running them. I think we humans may be interferring with the invisible part though.

HJ
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by TeachersPet on Oct 12th, 2007, 5:54pm

Whether Salads video can be seen creative as it not so important as whether or not it acted as an appeal a sort of draw for the lowest comment denominator. the majority.people who would say..yes..it was a fake all along. Reinstilling treatment of the the topic as a fanciful flight into fiction...obscuring the fact that it could be very real..or was at one time.."was at one time is importan"t..for if it was based on something real..then one would have to obscure the truth in a way that would not actually point to them to do that one would emply a group(s) to recreate..perhaps something similar..as Isaac had still retained contact with other members..they could he could "reconstruct" from old raw data what it would look like..or tie in what he had to the original pictures..you could then hide the Truth..in a "lie".. Yes..like a truck full of manure..the average person would say heck no.and walk home...the wise one would shovel it off..and ride away in a free pickup..
which would bring you all in..the persistent seeker.The ones with the shovels...the detail analysts..never giving up..removing the layers..one by one. finding from the info in the documents..plus developments such as Vonstern pointed you at in his works..and past works of others..,
as the coral castle builders, the dicynanin phenomena, the electromagnet drives, the crop circles.exotic concepts that are not so exiotic and that the PTB have already .the message being ..we have been visited..and we are among you..you do not have to look far and we are bringing changes to the Earth ..Pay attention to your Earth and your minds..and those that would enslave or destroy both., for they too tagged a ride on this bandwagon, this grand haywagon, actually quite a few in fact, clouding issues, confusing and demoralizing. no not fun and games, look past that ..join us , we are not Gods, but need you to help those helping it and the free minds that see ,..and you can be part of a new dawn
and hope for your planet.
As I see it in IMHO you are well on the way to doing that
so long as we look past the the little flea circuses that pop up along the way.

Carry on my Brothers and Sisters Carry on Keep shoveloping the layers off The cat is out of the bag and no one can stop us.
TeachersPet
Sys_config
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 12th, 2007, 6:44pm

on Oct 11th, 2007, 9:35pm, RoH wrote:
Hope this helps some of you to see it better! wink

User Image




I see what you are saying RoH. Great example as always! wink

Here is where I was going "wrong."

User Image

The camera position is elevated, on the top or side of a hill, since there is a "valley" below.

The drone is in the upper half of the photo, making it possible the drone is above the camera level. The drone is above the tree line... adding to the probability it is above the camera level.

User Image

When you look at the rest of the Chad images, the drones appear to be level (no tilting). In the above, the drone appears to be facing in the opposite direction of the photo in question. One can see the bottom of the drone and the shadow caused by the "inside ring."

User Image

This is a close up of the photo in question, you can compare it to the photo above it.

User Image

This is the area in question (at least in my mind), the odd shadow or dark area.

User Image

I did not see the "feelers" go through this area. Therefore, assuming I am looking at the bottom of a level flight drone... that is not tilting (this would be the only Chad drone photo to do so)... it appears to have a mirrored image. But it is a very fuzzy picture after all.



If this is not a shadow from the bottom... what is this dark area on the sun lit top?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 12th, 2007, 6:50pm

Hey Roh,

What are those three mouse pointers doing in there? Are you trying to stir something up? wink grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 12th, 2007, 7:53pm

Ahhhhhh, they are ahhhh... three leaning snow covered trees? shocked grin

How ya get three in there?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by AmberPheonix on Oct 12th, 2007, 8:11pm

I don't know if this has been mentioned or even thought about. It might be a bit silly, but. Did anyone ever consider that the cage might be shifting shapes in several photos is because it might be organic or something close to it?

Feel free to say no, it's just a slight bit of speculation.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 12th, 2007, 10:14pm

on Oct 12th, 2007, 2:30pm, DrDil wrote:
User Image
hi dr dil,I was going to put you and latitudes name in their with Rohs name,cause you guys have jewels that are automatic,and readly accesiable for use prcise and right on point,amazing.some of us like my self whom is not good in grammer or writing,I understand quite well the way when you guys put something down ,about the drones.well apriciated trust me friends. keep, minding your minds for the jewels of your soul ,and you will give us answers about the drones we all can be comfortible with,one thing other a bout you three that is very unque ,you dont force an answer or respond without thinking . take care evey one. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Gyvor on Oct 12th, 2007, 11:55pm

http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hall/1805/ion.html
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by hjdelight on Oct 13th, 2007, 12:18am

As I began reading, I thought...no way.This can't be related to the Drones. But the more I read, the more it does look related. The crackling sound, the tilting, the smooth gliding and darting maneuvers. Very interesting article. Thank you.

HJ
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 13th, 2007, 03:54am

on Oct 12th, 2007, 11:55pm, Gyvor wrote:
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hall/1805/ion.html

Thats a great find Gyvor!!

IT WAS DOWNRIGHT SPOOKY. Without a sound, the peculiar, spiky contraption rose straight up, hovered awhile, climbed higher. Then it did a few graceful turns, stopped again, and just sat there silently in midair.

User Image

More information at the address Gyvor supplied, (http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hall/1805/ion.html)


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 13th, 2007, 04:41am

Something else that may interest Castles & VonStern, I found this a little while ago, its an, Acoustic levitation chamber.

By applying a continuous resonant (600Hertz) sound wave, and by adjusting the amplitude and phase relationship amongst the 3 speakers; I was able to control levitation and movement in all 3 (x,y,z) axis of the ambient space.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 13th, 2007, 05:54am

OK this is what we got:

Caret documentation is obvious hoax: it talks about antigravity and the scientific status of antigravity is unknown and a current topic of (hugely expensive) research. If they had known anything about antigravity it would be known by the mainstream scientific community by now. The stated aim of Caret was to commercialize technology. In any case, the document is not written properly, nothing is well defined. Anyone familiar with professional literature would immediately reject it, as of course they have.

Stephen and Ty use Caret diagram. Therefore cannot be genuine. (In any case the images don't look real and Ty's story is implausible.) It is important to realize that only here is invisibility mentioned. Probably a couple of university students. Since it mentions invisibility, could be deliberate red herring.

Raj: Uses the Caret font, so cannot be extraterrestial. Saladfingers has shown in another place that the image is artificial. (In any case, sheen on the structure is just a little too even, doesn't look real).

Chad and TahoeLady: Stories plausible. Chad's use of mobile phone for first picture is the kind of quirky detail that hoaxers don't think of. Chad drone cannot be extraterrestial because uses Caret font. TahoeLady correlates to Chad drone so cannot be extraterrestial. But tahoeLady photos are not very clear, they do not fit the normal pattern of a hoax: which is that it would be irrefutable evidence if it were true. Noone would have paid any attention to tahoeLady if these photos had appeared in isolation. Just another blurry case. They haven't paid much attention to them as it is.

New development: ion drive appears to be plausible and discovered in 60s. Structure of drone is entirely consistent with ion drive.

Conclusion: Definitely not extraterrestial. Looking increasing like a new type of military drone, probably intended for use in Iraq and Afghanistan.
Caret is disinformation, to send any sighters chasing after bogies. Raj drone is deliberate disinformation because it uses the Caret font, which Raj couldn't have known about were he not part of it. (The font is too deeply embedded into Caret to have been inserted into Caret after the Raj drone appeared.) Note the knobs on the struts of the Raj drone look like a bad copy of the knobs on the Chad drone, ie a CGI copy of real knobs.

Confirming arguments:
>Ms Howe has identified many other sightings. These need more attention. All are consistent with military drone. Birmingham drone appears to be an earlier more primitive model. Note the description of the two large vans in the neighbourhood. Has anyone properly studied this photo?

> Isaac hoax is not trivial, some serious effort has gone into it costing serious money. (They could have hired a better writer for the Caret document part.) For what, if not a military program.

> There were similar sightings before stealth aircraft were finally unveiled - it has happened before.

For action:
Following confirmation that ion drive is plausible, surely someone can serve FoI documents on military, as per the micro drones described above.

For anyone military reading this: you are going to have the cost factor down before you deploy this, it does not appear cost effective compared to existing drone technology. Too fragile. Too large a target.





Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 13th, 2007, 07:27am

Here's a video of the ion lifter
http://www.americanantigravity.com/video/Nov7-Outdoor2-WinMedia.wmv

Here's the site with instructions and details on how to make your own.
http://www.americanantigravity.com/index.shtml
Lifters are real.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 13th, 2007, 08:04am

on Oct 13th, 2007, 07:27am, danblast wrote:
Here's a video of the ion lifter
http://www.americanantigravity.com/video/Nov7-Outdoor2-WinMedia.wmv

Here's the site with instructions and details on how to make your own.
http://www.americanantigravity.com/index.shtml
Lifters are real.

Thanks for the information Dan!! That sites changed quite a bit since I was last there.
Theres also a great PDF available called, The Evolution of Lifter Technology.
(However the general consensus appears to be something other than, Ion Wind is responsible for the levitation)
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by RoH on Oct 13th, 2007, 09:44am

on Oct 12th, 2007, 2:10pm, jugement wrote:
Roh;Mind Your Mind For The Jewels Of Your Soul.I see that you know the good jewels of your soul,and do not have to do any digging for those jewels. grin


Concentrated on the relationship between the mind and the soul wink

on Oct 12th, 2007, 2:13pm, urantia606 wrote:
At the bottom of the cage is a ring. Each of the eight legs is attached to this ring with a hinge. If you look closely you can actually see several of these hinges from the inside of the lower ring.

The eight cage legs are not attached at the top of the cage.

The inside components hold the legs in place when they are lowered. These parts also act as a holder for the lower ring.

The eight legs are able to be lowered down by their individual hinges to act as a 'stand' for the drone to sit on when it is in storage aboard the mothership.

IMO


Urantia, you bring up a very suggestive question!
May the drones land on the ground at all, or do they need some kind of support structure?
I see your idea that the eight legs on the BB drone could be for just that, and the mothership are in space with no gravity, or? what happens to the drone when it's deactivated?
When we look at how the "Personal" Antigravity Generator works when it's activated, the I-beams will place themself in a "locked position" (IMO) in coherence with the PAG. When we look at SF's video on his perception about this, I think it's misleading, the I-beams should be placed horizontal in relationship to the PAG, like we see in the picture. But then again, it's JUST a music video with a drone theme.
The drones are held together with a force, but do this force have unlimited power, Is it connected to the vacum in a way... sorry for drifting, lol
Ok, back to the question, how are this drones stored?

on Oct 12th, 2007, 6:50pm, Latitude wrote:
Hey Roh,

What are those three mouse pointers doing in there? Are you trying to stir something up? wink grin


shocked you are right!
Bill Hicks: did you see that... did everyone see that...
Reply: ...quit talking about it, let it go! ...It's a long time ago ...just forget about it. ...OK!

It's just an illusion, it's the sky... can't you see that? laugh grin

It's a prank, and it's saturday!

cheersgrin
RoH










Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 13th, 2007, 10:57am

Yes, RoH, it's saturday! cool

And therefore it's safe to say, that what I asked you all (And Castles4me in particular!) to count the barcodes on the "Isaac primer" must go into that category! It's not possible...unless we own the originals.. grin

There is some valid thinking in this though, if possible it will determine whether or not this is terrestrial or not.

Calculations on the 3 rings should provide a result that correspond with Einsteins theory.

Talking of this, every theory ANYONE here can come up with, is just as plausible if presented right as that of doctors and professors! If you have a theory, please post it....we'll all do our best to defy it! grin

And that is the best way trying to learn how we relate to the universal laws...ask Isaac....Newton!

He had theories!! That only WAS theories at the time!

So, come forward, you might just think in the lines of this....

VonStern

PS. I think, DrDil, that "DeltaEpsilon" linked to that Levitation by sound clip! grin (Good of you to bring it up again, though!)

PPS.: My november issue of my Magazine will be that of sound and the unseen wonders of just that! (In leyman's terms, so that everybody can participate)

PPPS: I apologize for my "Hollywood English"... cool
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by RoH on Oct 13th, 2007, 11:17am

on Oct 13th, 2007, 10:57am, VonStern wrote:
Yes, RoH, it's saturday! cool

PPPS: I apologize for my "Hollywood English"... cool


That's just all the 'exotic matter' you have consumed laugh
...and I did remember to buy it today, the fridge is full!
Looking forward for your article, VonStern cool

So Dr.dil, sorry, the picture analysis has to wait, or els
I could end up with something out of this world, lol laugh

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Oct 13th, 2007, 11:50am

on Oct 13th, 2007, 05:54am, turkoman wrote:
OK this is what we got:

Caret documentation is obvious hoax:




Hi Turkoman:

We took a copy of your post to lunch with us today. We had great sandwiches and dill pickles. We ate our lunch and forgot all about your post [which is clever and obvious disinformation] and enjoyed our sunny breaktime al fresco.

On the way back from lunch we talked about my trip to Australia back in 1989. I stayed a month and had a great time. then I went back in 1998 for another month but the newness had rubbed off a bit. Australia is a great place to visit. BTW, I have read about several Drone sightings downunder.

Take care and post again,

Dougster.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 13th, 2007, 12:03pm

on Oct 13th, 2007, 11:17am, RoH wrote:
So Dr.dil, sorry, the picture analysis has to wait, or els
I could end up with something out of this world, lol laugh

No problem. smiley

Ive just uploaded a 30 second clip that should be right up your street!!

Thats if youre up to the challenge.. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by RoH on Oct 13th, 2007, 12:35pm

on Oct 13th, 2007, 12:03pm, DrDil wrote:
No problem. smiley

Ive just uploaded a 30 second clip that should be right up your street!!

Thats if youre up to the challenge.. wink


Haaahaaaa, I knew it! I was thinking, what! "Thats if youre up to the challenge", and then the video, "spot 3 differences?" And this beautiful picture of Sogn and Fjordene comes up! Yeah, that's from Norway, nothing like it! good one! I say no more... laugh
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 13th, 2007, 1:03pm

on Oct 13th, 2007, 12:35pm, RoH wrote:
"Thats if youre up to the challenge", and then the video, "spot 3 differences?" And this beautiful picture of Sogn and Fjordene comes up! Yeah, that's from Norway......

Thanks Roh, so did you pass the test?

I should point out that its an open invitation for anybody who wishes to test themselves.

If so click here
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by drewlac on Oct 13th, 2007, 1:29pm

I found 3 no problem wink grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 13th, 2007, 2:02pm

on Oct 12th, 2007, 11:55pm, Gyvor wrote:
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hall/1805/ion.html


I am very familiar with ion lifters. It is a very inefficient method of flight. It takes large power supplies to only lift a tiny mass. I think one experimenter was able to get a mouse aloft. As far as I know, not one lifter has been able to lift without being tethered to a bulky external power supply.

If these drones did use this, Chad and Raj would have been blown as the object went overhead. They never mentioned it.

I don't think the drones use this type of technology. I believe they are much more advanced, tapping into the inner workings of space itself.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 13th, 2007, 2:23pm

on Oct 13th, 2007, 2:02pm, Latitude wrote:
I am very familiar with ion lifters. It is a very inefficient method of flight. It takes large power supplies to only lift a tiny mass. I think one experimenter was able to get a mouse aloft. As far as I know, not one lifter has been able to lift without being tethered to a bulky external power supply.

If these drones did use this, Chad and Raj would have been blown as the object went overhead. They never mentioned it.

I don't think the drones use this type of technology. I believe they are much more advanced, tapping into the inner workings of space itself.

I agree that I feel the Drones arent powered this way solely because as you mention the downwards draft that would be created would have to be noticeable, this reason more so than the power supply issues.

However, I believe that the power supply is inconsequential to the method of propulsion being used. Ive always thought that the energy source for any UFO would have to be created, On the fly or, As required so as to be infinite as long as some kind of energy converter was functioning.

So if you had an infinite energy supply then the method of propulsion and the subsequent drain on said energy supply would be inconsequential?

Just my opinion of course..
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 13th, 2007, 3:24pm

on Oct 13th, 2007, 2:23pm, DrDil wrote:
However, I believe that the power supply is inconsequential to the method of propulsion being used. Ive always thought that the energy source for any UFO would have to be created, On the fly or, As required so as to be infinite as long as some kind of energy converter was functioning.

So if you had an infinite energy supply then the method of propulsion and the subsequent drain on said energy supply would be inconsequential?
..


True. But ion wind lifting is still only a method of reaction propulsion. An ion wind vehicle would fly more like a helicopter, banking and tilting into it's path. None of the witness reports indicate this.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 13th, 2007, 3:39pm

on Oct 13th, 2007, 05:54am, turkoman wrote:
Caret documentation is obvious hoax: it talks about antigravity and the scientific status of antigravity is unknown and a current topic of (hugely expensive) research. If they had known anything about antigravity it would be known by the mainstream scientific community by now. The stated aim of Caret was to commercialize technology. In any case, the document is not written properly, nothing is well defined. Anyone familiar with professional literature would immediately reject it, as of course they have.

The Isaac documents are exactly what they are, a primer. They are not meant to go into detail about antigravity and such. They only give an intro to the technology to be studied. Isaac's area was to decipher the linguistics so at that point an explanation of antigravity was not relevant.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 13th, 2007, 4:29pm

Can the admin/moderator do something about all these beer/foreign language posts. It's getting really annoying and time consuming. The two that post may be enjoying it but I think they are the only ones. They should take this to another area and focus on the 'Drone' subject of the thread. I mean hey I don't mind going off topic a little but when I have to scroll and jump pages full of beer ads and bablefish translations it starts to wear thin real fast and I'd hate to see this thread go off topic again now that we've gotten back on track.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 13th, 2007, 7:16pm

on Oct 13th, 2007, 5:09pm, VonStern wrote:
You bet you I'm on it! If you feel you have significant news that will keep this thread alive..please post!

--o0o--

To qoute myself:

At best, we'll "scrutinize" it all of us...and joke about it..but never, ever let it be personal again...(You know what I mean).

End quote

--o0o--

Word to admins/moderators are on their way.

VonStern


Uhh.. You lost me, you're one of the people making the weird posts.

Quote:
If you feel you have significant news that will keep this thread alive..please post!


Lost me again, I did post something about the lifters. It may or may not be 'significant' who knows what is, especially when it comes to something so 'alien' as the drone topic. Maybe something insignificant will crack open a flood gate. We can only throw everything at the wall and see what sticks.

Listen I enjoy your drone posts. That's why I come here and that's why I read this topic multiple times a day. The whole beer/Norwegian, Russian, German language thing is simply wasting my time (bad enough half my spam comes from Russian ip's). I could start posting stuff in Chinese, Korean or binary and amuse myself, but that's not what this thread is about. One or two post's o.k but when we have to jump through a couple of pages its starts to get annoying.

And while I am ranting is it possible to resize pic's once they're up so I don't have to scroll a mile to the right to read all the other posts?

That's almost as annoying as Norwegian, Russian, German beer posts.
angry angry angry angry angry angry rolleyes rolleyes rolleyes

猛擊您的頭在牆壁上

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Oct 13th, 2007, 7:37pm

on Oct 13th, 2007, 7:16pm, danblast wrote:
Uhh.. You lost me, you're one of the people making the weird posts.



Lost me again, I did post something about the lifters. It may or may not be 'significant' who knows what is, especially when it comes to something so 'alien' as the drone topic. Maybe something insigni



ficant will crack open a flood gate. We can only throw everything at the wall and see what sticks.

Listen I enjoy your drone posts. That's why I come here and that's why I read this topic multiple times a day. The whole beer/Norwegian, Russian, German language thing is simply wasting my time (bad enough half my spam comes from Russian ip's). I could start posting stuff in Chinese, Korean or binary and amuse myself, but that's not what this thread is about. One or two post's o.k but when we have to jump through a couple of pages its starts to get annoying.

And while I am ranting is it possible to resize pic's once they're up so I don't have to scroll a mile to the right to read all the other posts?

That's almost as annoying as Norwegian, Russian, German beer posts.
angry angry angry angry angry angry rolleyes rolleyes rolleyes

huhhuhhuh


I mean really Dan. I have to skip over page after page of your ranting about other posters. This takes a lot of my time. I have to scroll several miles to get to a real post about the Drones. Meanwhile you take up page after page of rants about posters.

Meanwhile I might be missing out when a Drone flies by and I miss my photograph.

Dougster...hoping to become famous for taking a photo of a Drone.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 13th, 2007, 7:48pm

on Oct 13th, 2007, 7:37pm, urantia606 wrote:
I mean really Dan. I have to skip over page after page of your ranting about other posters. This takes a lot of my time. I have to scroll several miles to get to a real post about the Drones. Meanwhile you take up page after page of rants about posters.

Meanwhile I might be missing out when a Drone flies by and I miss my photograph.

Dougster...hoping to become famous for taking a photo of a Drone.


O.k that made a lot of sense especially when I've only made two posts regarding the ten or more Russian, German, Norwegian posts. But I guess you'd rather spend your 'valuable' time reading posts about beer in various languages then talk about the Drones.

Quote:
Dougster...hoping to become famous for taking a photo of a Drone.


If I were you I wouldn't hope too much since you seem to be wasting your time wasting others time. But unlike you I won't waste other peoples time making foolish posts. So I will go yet again back on topic.

Dr Dill here is another link for you;

http://www.americanheritage.com/articles/magazine/it/2007/1/2007_1_55.shtml

By the way urantia606 猛擊您的頭在牆壁上 translates to banging ones head against a wall. Appropriate for the direction this thread seems to be heading. It's no wonder why some members have left. Someone recently posted a comment about the inmates running the asylum, it seems to be coming true. If I wanted comedy I would goto a joke site. I come here to hopefully learn about the Drone phenomena and contribute what little I can.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by creolelady on Oct 13th, 2007, 8:07pm

Okay folks one beer ad off topic is fine and maybe one or two of the language things. If you want to continue with those posts, perhaps send them to each other via pm?
Then all of you here can proceed with the issue the thread was placed here for.
Going off topic now and then for a laugh is good for everyone, but too much does make it a bit more difficult to scroll through. I know you want the thread to keep moving with the technology etc, so jump in and enjoy.
Thanks
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 13th, 2007, 8:57pm

Just because I registered on that date did not mean I have not been following the topic. Actually I have been following the topic from the beginning. I registered later so I could stay more up to date on it. And I have read ALL of the posts and related documents. That's why I find this perpetual silliness such a waste of time.

As for my 'negative' posts none were negative simply observations which were either in the best interests of the board or stabs at the subject that were either right or wrong. The whole Halo thing dissapointed me when I first came across it and thankfully proved wrong (can you admit when you are wrong?) I want this subject to be real and not a hoax, I'd be pretty pissed if it was honestly since I and many others invested so much time into it.

As for my technolbable remark, you can't seriously read that crop circle site and walk away with anything tangible it is technobable, meaning someone whom likes to hear themselves speak. And if you stop dissecting every word I wrote and dissected this topic instead maybe we'd see something instead of silly stuff.

Finally I don't need to explain myself to you at all. Your personal jabs at my knowing everything because I made a suggestion after mentioning I have been running a message board literally since the beginning of the internet (compuserve list servers) is a silly cheap shot. You two hijack a thread, then post a weird response to me all of which are off topic and you accuse me of 'duping' people! More cheap shots, grow up.

I wish I had all the answers, and I wish I was a noble winning scientist but I'm not I'm just an average guy intrigued about this phenomena.

So dude, chill out stop wasting time, not just mine, but yours and everybody else's and lets get back on topic. I don't want you banned, I want to bounce ideas off of that thick head of yours and maybe progress this topic further.

Sorry for all of you that had to read through that.

Now back on topic again rolleyes

I don't know if the lifter propulsion has anything to do with the drones, maybe it's some kind of variation on a similar principle. The lifters do move strangely, they can rise slowly or snap into an orbit, which looks very alien. The drawback is it seems the only public versions of this seem to have to be tethered to a power source, the conundrum is they have yet to make the power source light or small enough for the lifter to be untethered or make a lifter so big it can lift the power source. But after reading that 1964 article they said in the demo he could vary the power to different areas of the grid to propel or turn the lifter, if the lifter would snap to various positions like it can vertically than maybe there is a connection. Think about it 1964 they were doing this and only in the last few years did it really become public domain 'thanks' to NASA. I'd imagine they might have improved on it and did the concept come from a vacuum or was it inspired from some 'other' technology?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 13th, 2007, 9:16pm

Wow danblast pretty impressive. After that speech I think we have the drone mystery solved. See if none of that foreign language was wrote we would have found out sooner. DARN IT... I am how ever sorry to BJ Booth for using bandwidth he pays for. lipsrsealed
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 13th, 2007, 9:24pm

on Oct 13th, 2007, 9:16pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
Wow danblast pretty impressive. After that speech I think we have the drone mystery solved. See if none of that foreign language was wrote we would have found out sooner. DARN IT... I am how ever sorry to BJ Booth for using bandwidth he pays for. lipsrsealed


See again another one comes out the woodwork with a jab that has nothing to do with the topic. I won't even waste my time responding to you in kind.

Let's recap to put it into perspective. Two or three posters had a little fun, but then hijacked the thread, I asked to get back on topic and instead of putting your energy into the subject you focus your frustrations on me instead.

Very mature. I hope you guys don't get abducted, I'd hate for an advanced alien civilization to think you are an example for the rest of us.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 13th, 2007, 9:26pm

Sir, please stay on topic wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by creolelady on Oct 13th, 2007, 10:04pm

I think everyone has sufficiently aired their feelings for the last several posts. Please move on so that your discussions can continue.
Thanks and have a good night.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 13th, 2007, 10:04pm

The point is we all drift once in awhile not always on purpose so we just have to learn to respect one another's bad post if thats what you wont to call it. cool
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 13th, 2007, 10:11pm

Vonstern, Please dont leave. You will find this place comfortable if you give it a chance this forum has much to offer. And I,m sure you also have plenty to offer. So dont give up this is just a bump in the road life goes on. cheesy
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 13th, 2007, 10:15pm

Further ignoring comments from the peanut gallery.

Note I am not saying the drones are lifters, just there might be some ideas observing the lifters similarities that might advance the topic. I find the probes/wires on the eggbeater drone interestingly similar.

The man who started the whole thing in the 1950's-60's
http://youtube.com/watch?v=0S-Ieb7LsGA&mode=related&search=

Interesting lifter vid;
http://youtube.com/watch?v=coqp4MmZpqo

Note the wires extending from thus one;
http://youtube.com/watch?v=bicra-36fBo&mode=related&search=

A nice explanation of the subject. Note the power source does not have to be above, it can run from below.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=uF8otSSPgdA&mode=related&search=

A repeat from my earlier post in case anyone stopped reading because of my response to the silliness.

I don't know if the lifter propulsion has anything to do with the drones, maybe it's some kind of variation on a similar principle. The lifters do move strangely, they can rise slowly or snap into an orbit, which looks very alien. The drawback is it seems the only public versions of this seem to have to be tethered to a power source, the conundrum is they have yet to make the power source light or small enough for the lifter to be untethered or make a lifter so big it can lift the power source. But after reading that 1964 article they said in the demo he could vary the power to different areas of the grid to propel or turn the lifter, if the lifter would snap to various positions like it can vertically than maybe there is a connection to the dragonfly like flight of the drones technology. Think about it 1964 they were doing this and only in the last few years did it really become public domain 'thanks' to NASA. I'd imagine they might have improved on it and did the concept come from a vacuum or was it inspired from some 'other' technology?

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 13th, 2007, 11:04pm

Hi Turkoman:

We took a copy of your post to lunch with us today. We had great sandwiches and dill pickles. We ate our lunch and forgot all about your post [which is clever and obvious disinformation] and enjoyed our sunny breaktime al fresco.

*****************

Thanks for 'clever' comment, Dougster. You are lucky having a bunch of friends to go to lunch with who are interested in ufos, that is the good part about living in California I guess. You even have eucalypts, but they grow funny there. I didn't even recognize them at first, because they are so tall and straight. Proper gum trees are stunted and gnarled, you don't know what you are missing out on. The problem I suppose is that gum trees have no natural insect predators in California.

"looking to become famous by taking a photo of a drone": you might like to think about the implications of that statement Dougster! Don't you think of the 20 alleged witnesses in the good photo cases, there might have been one or two similarly motivated? Especially Ty, who as Latitude pointed out was right into it. If you assume the witnesses were requested to keep quiet about it (which is possible in the case of Chad, TahoeLady) then you are talking about a military prototype.

Urantia, could you do me a favour? Do you reckon you could back the bit about 'obvious' disinformation? the problem being, the CIA don't pay me for **obvious** disinformation because it doesn't work properly. It's supposed to be subtle and preferably undetectable. If you could post something along the lines of "Yes that is a very cogent analysis Turkoman and you have completely changed my thinking on this topic" then that would really be much better, paycheckwise.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 13th, 2007, 11:09pm

Last paragraph of previous post: should be "Do you reckon you could TAKE back the bit ..."
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 13th, 2007, 11:13pm

on Oct 13th, 2007, 10:15pm, danblast wrote:
Further ignoring comments from the peanut gallery.

Note I am not saying the drones are lifters, just there might be some ideas observing the lifters similarities that might advance the topic. I find the probes/wires on the eggbeater drone interestingly similar.

The man who started the whole thing in the 1950's-60's
http://youtube.com/watch?v=0S-Ieb7LsGA&mode=related&search=

Interesting lifter vid;
http://youtube.com/watch?v=coqp4MmZpqo

Note the wires extending from thus one;
http://youtube.com/watch?v=bicra-36fBo&mode=related&search=

A nice explanation of the subject. Note the power source does not have to be above, it can run from below.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=uF8otSSPgdA&mode=related&search=

A repeat from my earlier post in case anyone stopped reading because of my response to the silliness.

I don't know if the lifter propulsion has anything to do with the drones, maybe it's some kind of variation on a similar principle. The lifters do move strangely, they can rise slowly or snap into an orbit, which looks very alien. The drawback is it seems the only public versions of this seem to have to be tethered to a power source, the conundrum is they have yet to make the power source light or small enough for the lifter to be untethered or make a lifter so big it can lift the power source. But after reading that 1964 article they said in the demo he could vary the power to different areas of the grid to propel or turn the lifter, if the lifter would snap to various positions like it can vertically than maybe there is a connection to the dragonfly like flight of the drones technology. Think about it 1964 they were doing this and only in the last few years did it really become public domain 'thanks' to NASA. I'd imagine they might have improved on it and did the concept come from a vacuum or was it inspired from some 'other' technology?


--o0o--

http://www.princeton.edu/~uribarri/Lifters.pdf

http://www.engadget.com/2007/08/15/researchers-use-ionic-wind-to-cool-computer-chips/

--o0o--
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Gyvor on Oct 14th, 2007, 12:20am

Time to inject some logical reasoning into this whole thing. We have three main components to the story.
-the craft
-the witnesses
-the caret documents
This gives us 8 different potential outcomes. They are:
A--craft-real, witness-real, documents-real
B--craft-real, witness-real , documents-fake
C--craft-real, witness-fake, documents-fake
D--craft-real, witness-fake, documents real
E--craft-fake, witness-fake, documents-fake
F--craft-fake, witness-fake, documents-real
G--craft-fake, witness-real, documents-real
H--craft-fake, witness-real, documents-fake
-
if A is true why has no one come forward considering the number of potential witnesses. Also photographed in residental area during day,why no other witnesses.
-
if B is true it would indicate a disinformation campaign indicating an human origin because of the use of alien as the cover. However , i have same concerns as in A
in regards to witnesses
-
if C is true it is not logical because why would people who know of this craft want to make it public with false witnesses and then attach a false story to a real thing.
-
if D is true it would indicate a disclosure. Get photos and eyewitness accounts out to generate interest and then release the documents. But why not just fly it around an get real witnesses.
-
if E is true then it is a hoax. But why considering the number of people that would need to be involved and what is the return on investment?
-
if F is true it could be disclosure aswell but the ones disclosing (ex. former employees) did not have flight photos so they were CGI'd. Not 100% on this but I don't think these have been proved to be cgi after all this time and therefore are probably not.
-
if G is true it does not make sense unless the craft is a holographic image which is possible according to the documents and if documents are real well then so is craft. Also same concern as in A regarding witnesses.
-
if H is true it does not make sense unless we have developed the ability to make holographic images of this quality without "alien technology" Also same concern as A regarding witnesses etc
-
D and E are the only two that make sense to me. The main sticking point with most of the others is the witness issue ,the residential area Raj photos and the group of cyclists etc etc.
D could be possible. The witness issue does not apply because they are faked. The residential issue, storyline's of the photos do not apply because they could have been taken anywhere and in a controlled manner. They could have faked a movie set to get the residential photos ,thus no "real" witnesses--but why? --So that we can wonder why no one else has come forward or why no one else except Raj and the people in the car saw this thing.--Hmm --Leaves me with one final option---------E
-E would indicate a complex and organized hoax. But for what reason and what pay-off. Well if it was for some sort of study then the payoff is everyone of us and how we react to it. We become the study group. It could be a study of belief systems etc. What better group to test it on then ufo geeks. An organization with plenty of funds could pull this off. There is nothing in the evidence presented that would be beyond their ability and there are no issues that are sticking points. CGI you say, well its actually a movie set type construction and its on a crane and the far away shots are actually CGI-very plausable unlike the missing witnesses-Unless they have all been silenced. Oh well back to square one I guess.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by hjdelight on Oct 14th, 2007, 01:01am

Yeah....well I guess everyone who was serious about this has given up by now. I guess I will too.

HJ
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 14th, 2007, 01:17am

on Oct 14th, 2007, 12:20am, Gyvor wrote:
This gives us 8 different potential outcomes. They are:
A--craft-real, witness-real, documents-real
B--craft-real, witness-real , documents-fake
C--craft-real, witness-fake, documents-fake
D--craft-real, witness-fake, documents real
E--craft-fake, witness-fake, documents-fake
F--craft-fake, witness-fake, documents-real
G--craft-fake, witness-real, documents-real
H--craft-fake, witness-real, documents-fake


No need to make this more complicated than it is. The way I see it there is only two potential outcomes. It's either all real or it's all fake. I also see the most likely of those two as being real. The fake argument is complicated as hell. Only one thing stands in the way of real. It's the obstacle that many people cannot seem to get past, the reality of ETs and the government cover up of them. Once you get past that it's easy to see the simple explanation.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 14th, 2007, 02:06am

Latitude, it would be more accurate to say there are three possible outcomes:

> real extraterrestial
> real but manmade
> fake

I take it that people regard 'real but manmade' as a not very exciting outcome.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 14th, 2007, 08:11am

on Oct 13th, 2007, 1:03pm, DrDil wrote:
I should point out that its an open invitation for anybody who wishes to test themselves.

If so click here

on Oct 13th, 2007, 1:29pm, drewlac wrote:
I found 3 no problem wink grin

In that case, you did better than me Drewlac!!

on Oct 13th, 2007, 7:48pm, danblast wrote:
Dr Dill here is another link for you;
http://www.americanheritage.com/articles/magazine/it/2007/1/2007_1_55.shtml

Thanks for the link Danblast and Alexander de Seversky truly was an aviation pioneer, and one of the very few whom were there practically from its inception. Funny enough Id already read quite a bit about him after following up on the, Lifter link Gyvor posted yesterday.

on Oct 14th, 2007, 01:01am, hjdelight wrote:
Yeah....well I guess everyone who was serious about this has given up by now. I guess I will too.

HJ

Dont abandon hope just yet Hjdelight!!

on Oct 14th, 2007, 01:17am, Latitude wrote:
No need to make this more complicated than it is. The way I see it there is only two potential outcomes. It's either all real or it's all fake. I also see the most likely of those two as being real. The fake argument is complicated as hell. Only one thing stands in the way of real. It's the obstacle that many people cannot seem to get past, the reality of ETs and the government cover up of them. Once you get past that it's easy to see the simple explanation.

The fake argument is complicated as hell.

Oh, I dont know about that, a complete amateur could quite easily spoof an IP address by simply Googling it and using one of the subsequent free websites that pops up.

A half competent Sci-Fi writer could fabricate the Isaac/CARET story.

We all know about the CGI pros and cons.

LMHs, Witnesses could quite simply be glory seekers, that may be why their stories dont correlate with what is already known, i.e. mysterious park rangers who instantly recognize the craft as monitoring Drones, movement that appears as a double exposure etc.etc.

Only one thing stands in the way of real. It's the obstacle that many people cannot seem to get past, the reality of ETs and the government cover up of them.

I feel that summary is more than a little unfair, I believe in extraterrestrials, I believe that they have visited earths atmosphere, I believe that the government knows a great deal more than they are telling the mass populous, so my disbelief in the Drone debacle cant be dismissed as simply unwilling to face facts or accept the, Simple explanation.

Indeed I feel its nave to believe that this is the underlying motivation for many who disbelieve in the Drones being ET in origin.

Once you get past that it's easy to see the simple explanation

Apparently just as easy as it is to accept testimony from what is for all intents and purposes anonymous and faceless, Witnesses.

on Oct 14th, 2007, 02:06am, turkoman wrote:
Latitude, it would be more accurate to say there are three possible outcomes:

> real extraterrestial
> real but manmade
> fake

I take it that people regard 'real but manmade' as a not very exciting outcome.

Personally speaking if they were/are manufactured by humans then this would open a veritable smorgasbord of possibilities!! Especially so if it transpired that Isaac was speaking the truth.

As Rodney King said,
User Image
"People, I just want to say, you know, can we all get along?" wink

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 14th, 2007, 11:09am

on Oct 14th, 2007, 02:06am, turkoman wrote:
Latitude, it would be more accurate to say there are three possible outcomes:

> real extraterrestial
> real but manmade
> fake

I take it that people regard 'real but manmade' as a not very exciting outcome.


As I look at all the evidence I see the chance of these things being man made as slim to none. A few big reasons immediately spring to mind. First if it was some type of black project it would not be flying over these locations like Capitola and Tahoe. Second they would not have alien markings on them. Third, if we did have this technology, we would not be spending billions on archaic rockets to get people and satellites into space.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Gyvor on Oct 14th, 2007, 1:26pm

on Oct 14th, 2007, 11:09am, Latitude wrote:
As I look at all the evidence I see the chance of these things being man made as slim to none. A few big reasons immediately spring to mind. First if it was some type of black project it would not be flying over these locations like Capitola and Tahoe. Second they would not have alien markings on them. Third, if we did have this technology, we would not be spending billions on archaic rockets to get people and satellites into space.


I agree, the real-manmade option presents some serious issues that don't logically make sense. The real-alien option alsp presents serious issues that don't logically make sense as it relates to witnesses and residential area sightings. This leaves FAKE as the best alternative. I does not suffer from the same illogical issues. It does have one big question and that is why? And in this new age of the internet I am sure there may be good reasons for doing "tests" like this. Look how the internet is used by terrorist organizations for communication/promotion/conscription etc. The internet has become part of the battleground and it would only make sense for tests like this to be conducted to see how people react to things that challange or confirm their beleifs---images/"stories"/ideas. A study of group dynamics and beleif systems etc. Only this beleif system is ufology and not Radical Islam.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 14th, 2007, 2:26pm

whats up newbies ; good to see you come out with some new ideas welcome aboard tell us what you feel to be a fact or an unknown fact about the drones or isaac . wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 14th, 2007, 3:29pm

on Oct 14th, 2007, 08:11am, DrDil wrote:
The fake argument is complicated as hell.

Oh, I dont know about that, a complete amateur could quite easily spoof an IP address by simply Googling it and using one of the subsequent free websites that pops up.

A half competent Sci-Fi writer could fabricate the Isaac/CARET story.

We all know about the CGI pros and cons.


First and foremost, this entire drone case in no way fits with any type of known hoax. It has already been stated that it is way too complicated to be perpetrated for no monetary gain.

The only way this supposed half competent sci-fi writer could fabricate this is if he was in cahoots with all of the witnesses especially those six with photos. He would have to coordinate an effort to bring out the linguistics and LAP in a manner that would not show any obvious signs of cgi in 35 photos. I can't imagine how the drone parts photo could show parts from two completely different drone photos and not show any signs of cgi. Why would a hoaxer reply back to answer the critics questions? So he could get caught?

What about the interviewed witnesses? Were they merely actors?

How do you explain the different ways these witnesses came forward? Two to C2C, one to Mufon, one to Casebook, some to Earthfiles and Raj to Craigslist. Craigslist? Is that how a hoaxer works, by posting to Craigslist? How innocent is that? Why does a hoaxer register at OMF to answer questions? So he can take a chance on getting caught? You know as much as I do those OMFers would tear him apart if he made one slip.

Quote:
LMHs, Witnesses could quite simply be glory seekers, that may be why their stories dont correlate with what is already known, i.e. mysterious park rangers who instantly recognize the craft as monitoring Drones, movement that appears as a double exposure etc.etc.

It's that kind of testimony that reinforces her claim. Why would she bring up the odd sounding park ranger? Certainly NOT something a hoaxer would bring up. Besides, the part about the ranger makes total sense to me. Put yourself into his shoes. Here is a guy who likely does not believe in UFOs and his job is to keep the peace in the park. When a visitor asks about the object that just flew by, what is his most likely response? Just what he said. He's not going to start a panic screaming about an alien object overhead. We also do not know what kind of a look he had of the object. He may have only caught a glance at it or maybe did not see it at all. There's also the chance the guy had already been briefed from higher ups to keep quiet and blow off any inquiry into the weird aerial object.

Quote:
Only one thing stands in the way of real. It's the obstacle that many people cannot seem to get past, the reality of ETs and the government cover up of them.

I feel that summary is more than a little unfair, I believe in extraterrestrials, I believe that they have visited earths atmosphere, I believe that the government knows a great deal more than they are telling the mass populous, so my disbelief in the Drone debacle cant be dismissed as simply unwilling to face facts or accept the, Simple explanation.

Indeed I feel its nave to believe that this is the underlying motivation for many who disbelieve in the Drones being ET in origin.

Sorry, but that's exactly my take on the subject. Disbelievers can make up all kinds of odd (and extremely complicated and unlikely) theories as to the hows and whys so they don't have to admit that it has finally happened, that is, we finally have up close and personal proof of ETs and a massive government cover up. I'm sure they always had the thought in the back of their minds that it could be this way. But when it finally happens they think it's too good to be true and deny it. Is it simply a case of be careful what you wish for, you might get it? And then when it happens decide they never wanted it after all?

Quote:
Once you get past that it's easy to see the simple explanation

Apparently just as easy as it is to accept testimony from what is for all intents and purposes anonymous and faceless, Witnesses.

I thought you said they were glory seekers?


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 14th, 2007, 5:10pm

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread287946/pg1 huh
image source: (img)http://www.photopile.com/photos/dead/auctions/293127.jpg(img)
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 14th, 2007, 5:22pm

on Oct 14th, 2007, 5:10pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread287946/pg1 huh

Same old, same old.............

User Image

User Image

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 14th, 2007, 5:26pm

image source: http://www.photopile.com/photos/dead/auctions/293127.jpg grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 14th, 2007, 6:09pm

on Oct 14th, 2007, 3:29pm, Latitude wrote:
First and foremost, this entire drone case in no way fits with any type of known hoax. It has already been stated that it is way too complicated to be perpetrated for no monetary gain.

Neither does it fit with any of the many, many thousands of sightings previously so there is no precedence for it.

on Oct 14th, 2007, 3:29pm, Latitude wrote:
The only way this supposed half competent sci-fi writer could fabricate this is if he was in cahoots with all of the witnesses especially those six with photos. He would have to coordinate an effort to bring out the linguistics and LAP in a manner that would not show any obvious signs of cgi in 35 photos. I can't imagine how the drone parts photo could show parts from two completely different drone photos and not show any signs of cgi. Why would a hoaxer reply back to answer the critics questions? So he could get caught?


Cahoots with all of the witnesses especially those six with photos

You are of course assuming that theyre all different people, he/she could easily fabricate it if he was acting alone or in a pair or even three people. Whos to say the Isaac documentation wasnt the original, Masterpiece and whoever is responsible then worked backwards compiling the Drones from this information.

on Oct 14th, 2007, 3:29pm, Latitude wrote:
I can't imagine how the drone parts photo could show parts from two completely different drone photos and not show any signs of cgi.

Try imagining a little harder, what if theyre models, simply dismantle the model and take the photograph.

on Oct 14th, 2007, 3:29pm, Latitude wrote:
What about the interviewed witnesses? Were they merely actors?

No, those would be the glory seekers I referenced, i.e. LMHs, witnesses could quite simply be glory seekers.

on Oct 14th, 2007, 3:29pm, Latitude wrote:
How do you explain the different ways these witnesses came forward? Two to C2C, one to Mufon, one to Casebook, some to Earthfiles and Raj to Craigslist. Craigslist? Is that how a hoaxer works, by posting to Craigslist?

Its how a clever hoaxer would work, if they released them all through the same source then obviously people would say, Its the same person so how would you pre-empt this? By releasing a couple of the Drone images through obscure sources.

on Oct 14th, 2007, 3:29pm, Latitude wrote:
How innocent is that?

That depends entirely on your motivation, which if youre a hoaxer.

on Oct 14th, 2007, 3:29pm, Latitude wrote:
Why does a hoaxer register at OMF to answer questions? So he can take a chance on getting caught? You know as much as I do those OMFers would tear him apart if he made one slip.

Yes, but how could he slip up if its his story and his images, just like reading from a script, it was never, Live merely reading the question, compiling an answer then posting it. (Then he only posted twice, how many questions were asked?)

on Oct 14th, 2007, 3:29pm, Latitude wrote:
Sorry, but that's exactly my take on the subject. Disbelievers can make up all kinds of odd (and extremely complicated and unlikely) theories as to the hows and whys so they don't have to admit that it has finally happened, that is, we finally have up close and personal proof of ETs and a massive government cover up. I'm sure they always had the thought in the back of their minds that it could be this way. But when it finally happens they think it's too good to be true and deny it. Is it simply a case of be careful what you wish for, you might get it? And then when it happens decide they never wanted it after all?

The question I was answering was, It's the obstacle that many people cannot seem to get past, the reality of ETs and the government cover up of them, once you get past that it's easy to see the simple explanation

Like I said Im well past that, I believe 100%!!

on Oct 14th, 2007, 3:29pm, Latitude wrote:
We finally have up close and personal proof of ETs and a massive government cover up

Do we? Where? Surely its not proof as its blatantly un-provable.

on Oct 14th, 2007, 3:29pm, Latitude wrote:
DrDil wrote:
Apparently just as easy as it is to accept testimony from what is for all intents and purposes anonymous and faceless, Witnesses.


I thought you said they were glory seekers?

Yes, I actually said, LMHs, witnesses could quite simply be glory seekers. LMHs WITNESSES, not the people/person who released the images in the first place.

Lets have a quick recap, the post I was addressing said, The fake argument is complicated as hell.

I dont think it is, that is the main point I was addressing, as Im sure you know we could go on in circles like this for ever.

You posted it was complicated, I disagree.

You believe the Drones are extraterrestrial, I dont.

You think if its a hoax its complicated as hell, I dont think it is. I just think its being made to appear that way. I also don't think any of the possibilities I've mentioned are complicated at all.

As Im sure you knew when you posted your reply (as I know I did wink) that one party was never going to convince the other, as weve both said in the past, well just have to agree to differ on this one. grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 14th, 2007, 6:25pm

on Oct 14th, 2007, 6:09pm, DrDil wrote:
As Im sure you knew when you posted your reply (as I know I did wink) that one party was never going to convince the other, as weve both said in the past, well just have to agree to differ on this one. grin


Absolutely correct ... for now. But I believe this is not over. We may have to wait till next May (or even the next year) when new witnesses (how about another from CARET) come forward. Maybe somebody who might just find a way to slip past the agents and make it to a safe haven. Makes me wonder what I would do if I had drone photos or a video.

I've made my points. That's all I wish to do. smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 14th, 2007, 6:29pm

on Oct 14th, 2007, 5:26pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
User Image grin

shockedUser ImageUser ImageUser ImageUser ImageUser ImageUser ImageUser ImageUser ImageUser ImageUser Imagegrin

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 14th, 2007, 6:32pm

on Oct 14th, 2007, 6:25pm, Latitude wrote:
Absolutely correct ... for now.

Sounds ominous!! I hope you keep a week free next May especially for me, so we can disagree further!! wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 14th, 2007, 7:01pm

He must have been quick with his net. nice catch in the back pocket. hahahaha the drones in the basket are a little to young yet. Don't let Department of natural resources see you with those.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 14th, 2007, 7:21pm

ufocatcher, grin grin grin grin grin grin.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 14th, 2007, 7:49pm

on Oct 14th, 2007, 6:25pm, Latitude wrote:
Absolutely correct ... for now. But I believe this is not over. We may have to wait till next May (or even the next year) when new witnesses (how about another from CARET) come forward. Maybe somebody who might just find a way to slip past the agents and make it to a safe haven. Makes me wonder what I would do if I had drone photos or a video.

I've made my points. That's all I wish to do. smiley


I am waiting for a video... ya know one is coming (just a feeling one is coming).
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 14th, 2007, 8:01pm

on Oct 14th, 2007, 7:21pm, jugement wrote:
ufocatcher, grin grin grin grin grin grin.
Its hilarious,http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7168660.html After reading this how far fetched is the net idea? huh
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Gyvor on Oct 14th, 2007, 8:06pm

The single biggest problem with this whole case is the most important part, the witnesses. Where are they? I find it hard to beleive they could have all been silenced. And there was indication that there was probably many more witnesses according to the stories attached to the photos and the location of the photos, in a residential area during the day!. Where are they? Where!!! Even the guy in Kentucky who videotaped the drone-like shadow during the eclipse came forward and public. The thing really looked like a drone at first. Where were the government silencers then. I don't want to get into that case but my point is that when someone sees something really strange they usually come forward. At the very least one of those witnesses would be expected to. If the government was that good a silencing people then beleive me the photos would never had made it out of their cameras, let alone on the internet. If it smells like a rat it usually is a rat.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 14th, 2007, 9:32pm

on Oct 14th, 2007, 8:06pm, Gyvor wrote:
The single biggest problem with this whole case is the most important part, the witnesses. Where are they? I find it hard to beleive they could have all been silenced. And there was indication that there was probably many more witnesses according to the stories attached to the photos and the location of the photos, in a residential area during the day!. Where are they? Where!!! Even the guy in Kentucky who videotaped the drone-like shadow during the eclipse came forward and public. The thing really looked like a drone at first. Where were the government silencers then. I don't want to get into that case but my point is that when someone sees something really strange they usually come forward. At the very least one of those witnesses would be expected to. If the government was that good a silencing people then beleive me the photos would never had made it out of their cameras, let alone on the internet. If it smells like a rat it usually is a rat.


Exactly

But wait,

Quote:
F--craft-fake, witness-fake, documents-real


Could be a govt sponsored test to gauge reaction...similar to Serpo.

This time we were teased with just a little more...photos and doc's.
Maybe the drones are real, and the witnesses are just DIA agents posing as witnesses. Could this be why they dont come forward?.

Hmmmm

And/Or the photos could be faked...we have not been provided with the data needed to confirm one way or the other.

Hmmmm

If this is some type of sponsored release, and I think the possiblity must be considered....what would be the true part?

The Witnesses?
The Photos?
The Documents. To me anyway the doc's are the only real part of this.
Let me re-phase...The doc's are the only thing in this that has the slightest possibility of being real, and I am not sure they are real either.

Look here...When and if Disclosure comes...the govt expects panic...right?

If it is coming and the govt/PtB have no way to stop it ....how do you stop the paralyzing panic.

3 ways

First a disinfo campaign against all believers who have ever seen and reported. We have all seen the media reports with the weird music playing in the back round.

When disclosure comes, most will not believe anyway...the disinfo campaign has worked beautifully. Most will not panic because they don't believe.

Secondly All the Sci-Fi movies, Star Trek and countless others have open up still another section of the populace to the idea that life does exists elsewhere. These people, like myself are open to the idea. Most likely these people will not panic as well.

Thirdly we have the hardcores...all of us here and there on the internet ufo forums. We get the really hardcore stuff to see what can be believed and what cant. We are not going to panic, but our reactions here can be modeled for the real Disclosure Day to lessen the panic.

I could be wrong, I am wrong a lot.

I tell you this...when and if disclosure ever comes, it wont be the Truth....if it was so easy as that we would have had it long ago.

I understand these actions, but I don't trust them
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Gyvor on Oct 15th, 2007, 09:29am

Murnut, I think your on to something. I missed that, but yes "F" could be a viable option. The release targets a specific group. They(Gov) don't want this thing blown wide open. The photos are fake but the craft/docs are real. This is the only way to explain the residential Raj photos and the potential real witnesses not seeing this thing. This theory is certainly not affected by the "witness problem" and is therfore a definate option. Wow, I am almost back on the fence with this one. Unfortunetly I think this is as far as we can go without further evidence. - Sayonara!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 15th, 2007, 1:55pm

Off topic.

I like to check out ATS every now and then if only to get a laugh. Like the post from a guy who was asking if he would still have to go to work if we had disclosure.

Here's the latest kookery from ATS.
Quote:
Eclipse_Solar

posted on 15-10-2007 @ 01:43 PM

When will there be an Alien Invasion?

So when do ya'll think that them Aliens will come? They are gathering a fleet as we speak.
Soon them Aliens will start shooting at us. Will the crop circles determine when they will arrive?

I and my buds have prepared ourselves. We have mounted a machine gun on an old Ford Pickup truck.

When will they strike? And where will they hit first?


I wonder if this guy's machine gun mounted on an old Ford pickup will be enough to repel the invasion? laugh
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by TeachersPet on Oct 15th, 2007, 2:02pm

http://ufo.egrd.net/
This was dropped off and and dropping it off to you. You are welcome..Greetings Dr. V and members Murnut and Gort..
Beautiful stuff..music integrated nicely..I a Lot of threads weave into caret. Besides art, and astronomy and philosophy, there are allusions to power source..I noted use of thre urn (also in anagram) Also one of the sites pointed to had azure either a group or song, and desert..remember this is no longer one person, or one group, of writers, musicians,artists, ..yeah the whole monte folx. also it its a suped up simcity see the game at chrisbrogan.com see the the writing community..there are many..Part f the diagram was painted in flourescence paint..yielding more clues..its connected..as far as giving clues..and showing what a nice pretty site it is..Which really is by the way..Pointing things that the government already has the tech..at least for ground transport as this site hinted at..ideas stolen from the author he mentioned..nice break otherwise..
worth pursuing for clues..its a self growing puzzle..neverending..many answers, depending who the weavers are. I would not be surprised if some here are members..and writers also..that know part of the story but not all of it..it was meant for the right hand not knowing what the left was doing..I saw evidence by team a and team b members at omf..playing each other..so you have the techies on one thing and the artists on another..and guitar players even... Some of these go to regular summer camps just to practice and learn how to spin off carets.. Lifetime of ARG is normally 3 months..tops 0ne year,
http://danhon.com/2007/05/23/sxsw-2007-arg-the-attack-of-the-alternate-reality-games-transcript
worth reading..you think you may know what arg is..go on..it can be used as a disclosure, psyops, disinfo, all sugar coated ..you are the floats in the parade..while the PTP stand and eat their cotton candy, it can be anything..people want it to be..

they are experimenting ways to extend..Episodic ARG, ( ex . Nikki or Victor neuman gets killed in the soap opera, ladies you know what mean..) Yes ARG but a vehicle..it has portals, people looking in, some brilliant and wonderfful..and then not very nice people, opportunity for them yes, but us as well for real thing to be slipped in... it works both ways..
make it their nightmare, make it our dream come true..their mistake..so many artists, and some artists just don't give a squat, in their blood..like in your blood..
Is the science it brings in a rehash of all our stufff..or does it introduce something new..Dr. V would know..if their is a new twist..perhaps some of you..will

End
.


yeah follow it for clues..

Sys
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 15th, 2007, 9:06pm

you lost me.

I went to the first link and it was all dingbat font characters, I tried to change the font, unintelligible. I looked at the source code and got a headache.

Why be so cryptic and mysterious? isn't the drone topic cryptic and mysterious enough?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by newtothis on Oct 15th, 2007, 9:30pm

on Oct 15th, 2007, 9:06pm, danblast wrote:
you lost me.

I went to the first link and it was all dingbat font characters, I tried to change the font, unintelligible. I looked at the source code and got a headache.

Why be so cryptic and mysterious? isn't the drone topic cryptic and mysterious enough?


There is some text in there, have to take all the "?"'s out though... I read a few lines and saw gravity and alternative electrical energy. But it was hurting my brain so I stopped...
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 15th, 2007, 9:36pm

on Oct 15th, 2007, 09:29am, Gyvor wrote:
Murnut, I think your on to something. I missed that, but yes "F" could be a viable option. The release targets a specific group. They(Gov) don't want this thing blown wide open. The photos are fake but the craft/docs are real. This is the only way to explain the residential Raj photos and the potential real witnesses not seeing this thing. This theory is certainly not affected by the "witness problem" and is therfore a definate option. Wow, I am almost back on the fence with this one. Unfortunetly I think this is as far as we can go without further evidence. - Sayonara!


Murnut I think you may be on to something also, Cause i got this memo from a reliable research associate That I can gaurantee you knows what he is talking about.

Dean,

I can't remember if in my previous email I'd tied the viral marketing
theory
to any particular game or film. I think the point is that if the
Isaac/CARET/Chad/drone saga is part of a viral marketing campaign, it
may
relate to the launch of a film, game or other product/service that
hasn't
yet received much (or any) publicity.

For your information, I sent the material below in response to the most

recent question I received on this:

"My gut feeling is that this is a sophisticated hoax, possibly (as has
been
suggested) as part of a viral marketing campaign, or as an initiative
by
somebody wanting to showcase their skills in this area (in the same way
as a
filmmaker used the Haiti/Dominican Republic videos to showcase his CGI
skills). Other possibilities include commercial gain and it will be
interesting to see if a book and/or a DVD appears at some stage, or if
'Isaac' breaks cover and goes on the UFO lecture circuit. It's also
possible that the whole story is a set-up by skeptical ufologists using
it
as a way to study the psychology of belief."

Best wishes,

I cant reveal my source on this but I am inclined to believe the psychology of belief study and LMH is being quite because shes been pawned so there it is guys my stance on the subject and the stance of a very high up person in UFO research.The person that sent me that memo is considered one of the worlds leading authorities in this subject.
If LMH would have given us a simple return on just our thank you notes I would not have turned to this belief but her silence just proves to me she has been pawned.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 15th, 2007, 10:34pm

LMH I am pretty sure you are reading these you've been pawned, otherwise you would be eating this stuff up. Tell me I am wrong I dare ya. No other explanation why you couldnt even give a courtesy reply to these people's thank you notes for your implied help in sending their questions to Issac. Simply as that.
If Issac has almighty revelations why hasnt he come forward to defend his disclosure on this forum and on the other, these are the places that his so called disclosure are the most talked at, which reach every possible citizen on the planet looks to me like a good place to defend ones position.And where are all the witness photogs why havent they defended themselves agaisnt the CGI Hacks. Its a pawn job plain and simple and LMH is the biggest pawn of all.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 15th, 2007, 11:05pm

Her silence is baffling.

And you wonder why the Ufo community gets little respect?

I don't blame LMH for getting snookered, if this is the case.

I blame her for keeping it to herself

Shameful

If this is the case, that is
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 15th, 2007, 11:10pm

Its been my experience when someone goes silent like that it is because they are embarrased they where taken.
Murnut did you see my memo from a friend who knows?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 15th, 2007, 11:31pm

Yes I did. Many have said the same. I held out for as long as I could, but too many items just don't add up

If the lead investigator goes silent, what does that say?

Silent?

Nobody could have wanted this to be real, more than LMH...Nobody.

Hopefully there was something of value gained by this, and it does advance disclosure.

How ironic...Disinfo for Disclosure.

You have to admire how well it has worked for so long.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 15th, 2007, 11:46pm

on Oct 15th, 2007, 11:31pm, murnut wrote:
Yes I did. Many have said the same. I held out for as long as I could, but too many items just don't add up

If the lead investigator goes silent, what does that say?

Silent?

Nobody could have wanted this to be real, more than LMH...Nobody.

Hopefully there was something of value gained by this, and it does advance disclosure.

How ironic...Disinfo for Disclosure.

You have to admire how well it has worked for so long.


I do admire it but if they want to keep it alive they had better start releasing some new stuff cause I noticed a couple of weeks ago it was going dry. Here is the funny thing if it is disinfo then that proves there is something to hide wink So your statement is 100% correct.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by TeachersPet on Oct 16th, 2007, 03:22am

on Oct 15th, 2007, 1:55pm, Latitude wrote:
Off topic.

I like to check out ATS every now and then if only to get a laugh. Like the post from a guy who was asking if he would still have to go to work if we had disclosure.

Here's the latest kookery from ATS.


I wonder if this guy's machine gun mounted on an old Ford pickup will be enough to repel the invasion? laugh



Your comment about ATS from one poster among thousands , without even looking at the several inroads made in analysis at ATS from at least 182 up, tells me you don't know what you are talking about.
You should be praying there were more forums rather than badmouthing them. This whole episode has weakened the infrastructure. and if you don't see that too bad..others do.
The only reason I am here is because of the politeness of 3 of your members, Be thankful you even have them still. This place was imploding, and comments like yours certainly aggravate chances of securing additional members and help. You can continue bootlicking LMH if you want to, but she is irrelevant at this point. You want people to do the work for you..to bring it to you personally. I see others here doing the work. All you have done is mouth off..

My apologies to the remainder..
There is hope..you are asking the right questions..as for games..remember that microsoft recruits and brainstaorms with Darpa backed scientists..the games..shootemup reality based..hone the skills for the future cyberwarriors, remote uav pilots..etc etc.
It is a hand in glove op. unwritten understanding. and the once darpa googlenet has not really shed its old ways..it was never unhooked it just evolved and is evolving. so when we say game based psych test behavioral test its all of the above, and at your level yes you can have oodles of fun playing the game, but its a rigged game.

end
Sys_config ATS

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 16th, 2007, 03:29am

on Oct 15th, 2007, 10:34pm, Razor wrote:
LMH I am pretty sure you are reading these you've been pawned, otherwise you would be eating this stuff up. Tell me I am wrong I dare ya. No other explanation why you couldnt even give a courtesy reply to these people's thank you notes for your implied help in sending their questions to Issac. Simply as that.
If Issac has almighty revelations why hasnt he come forward to defend his disclosure on this forum and on the other, these are the places that his so called disclosure are the most talked at, which reach every possible citizen on the planet looks to me like a good place to defend ones position.And where are all the witness photogs why havent they defended themselves agaisnt the CGI Hacks. Its a pawn job plain and simple and LMH is the biggest pawn of all.


Reply #277 on: Sep 6th, 2007, 9:19pm DrDil Wrote:Possibly part of the reason that she has still failed to release the images is that it will prove conclusively what her unannounced status is in the disclosure game, whether that be the, Player or the, Played. "Dont hate the player/s, hate the game?"

wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 16th, 2007, 07:03am

on Oct 16th, 2007, 03:29am, DrDil wrote:
Reply #277 on: Sep 6th, 2007, 9:19pm DrDil Wrote:Possibly part of the reason that she has still failed to release the images is that it will prove conclusively what her unannounced status is in the disclosure game, whether that be the, Player or the, Played. "Dont hate the player/s, hate the game?"

wink



Which also begs the question, why did C2C drop such a potentially rewarding story and hand it over to LMH? What did they notice that said to them gee great story, but lets let Linda try to make the money on this one.

I have not seen any post on the C2C site since.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 16th, 2007, 08:04am

on Oct 16th, 2007, 03:22am, TeachersPet wrote:
Your comment about ATS from one poster among thousands , without even looking at the several inroads made in analysis at ATS from at least 182 up, tells me you don't know what you are talking about.
You should be praying there were more forums rather than badmouthing them. This whole episode has weakened the infrastructure. and if you don't see that too bad..others do.
The only reason I am here is because of the politeness of 3 of your members, Be thankful you even have them still. This place was imploding, and comments like yours certainly aggravate chances of securing additional members and help. You can continue bootlicking LMH if you want to, but she is irrelevant at this point. You want people to do the work for you..to bring it to you personally. I see others here doing the work. All you have done is mouth off..

My apologies to the remainder..
There is hope..you are asking the right questions..as for games..remember that microsoft recruits and brainstaorms with Darpa backed scientists..the games..shootemup reality based..hone the skills for the future cyberwarriors, remote uav pilots..etc etc.
It is a hand in glove op. unwritten understanding. and the once darpa googlenet has not really shed its old ways..it was never unhooked it just evolved and is evolving. so when we say game based psych test behavioral test its all of the above, and at your level yes you can have oodles of fun playing the game, but its a rigged game.

end
Sys_config ATS


Hi Sys_config,
I agree with you entirely what we need is open cooperation between everyone and all the forums. I think sometimes people push buttons because their agenda is important to them and they just cant get through the way they need to. If you can get a rise from someone it is the surest way to know you are in actual communication with them and they know you are there. If you got any pull at ATS then share this with them we need open cooperation from all researchers to be successful in obtaining any goal. And please add me to your list of 3 friendlies here wink I love everybody and everything on the planet .
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 16th, 2007, 08:14am

on Oct 16th, 2007, 07:03am, Marvin wrote:
Which also begs the question, why did C2C drop such a potentially rewarding story and hand it over to LMH? What did they notice that said to them gee great story, but lets let Linda try to make the money on this one.

I have not seen any post on the C2C site since.


Hi Marvin,
You probably know I like Occam's Razor the simple explanation for that is they probably dont have the investigative power that LMH has, so they are getting help from her hoping to break the story then follow up with her books and stuff that would basiclly make them just as famous it appears to me anyway. But I think she has dropped the ball because right here is the best advertising anyone could have for a book.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 16th, 2007, 09:42am

on Oct 16th, 2007, 08:14am, Razor wrote:
Hi Marvin,
You probably know I like Occam's Razor the simple explanation for that is they probably dont have the investigative power that LMH has, so they are getting help from her hoping to break the story then follow up with her books and stuff that would basiclly make them just as famous it appears to me anyway. But I think she has dropped the ball because right here is the best advertising anyone could have for a book.



I would "buy in" on that idea if C2C was still following the story. But since passing the ball off, it is if they dropped it like a hot potato.

It strikes me as a bit odd, that C2C depends on "hits" to their website, which are driven by posted articles, photos, links and stories. This story has been missing in action after it first broke. No body gives up easy money these days. I suspect there is something more to this part of the story (than to give the money maker over to LMH, to investigate, and not follow up on their own site).

Or am I missing something?

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 16th, 2007, 09:50am

on Oct 16th, 2007, 09:42am, Marvin wrote:
I would "buy in" on that idea if C2C was still following the story. But since passing the ball off, it is if they dropped it like a hot potato.

It strikes me as a bit odd, that C2C depends on "hits" to their website, which are driven by posted articles, photos, links and stories. This story has been missing in action after it first broke. No body gives up easy money these days. I suspect there is something more to this part of the story (than to give the money maker over to LMH, to investigate, and not follow up on their own site).

Or am I missing something?


Hi Marvin you are probably right more to it. The linguisst that is helping us just slapped mr back to earth for my comments saying that anyone who would go to as much trouble with something like this she is reading would not make such a hoax.. LOL i get blasted from all sides wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 16th, 2007, 10:22am

on Oct 16th, 2007, 03:22am, TeachersPet wrote:
Your comment about ATS from one poster among thousands , without even looking at the several inroads made in analysis at ATS from at least 182 up, tells me you don't know what you are talking about.
You should be praying there were more forums rather than badmouthing them. This whole episode has weakened the infrastructure. and if you don't see that too bad..others do.
The only reason I am here is because of the politeness of 3 of your members, Be thankful you even have them still. This place was imploding, and comments like yours certainly aggravate chances of securing additional members and help. You can continue bootlicking LMH if you want to, but she is irrelevant at this point. You want people to do the work for you..to bring it to you personally. I see others here doing the work. All you have done is mouth off..

end
Sys_config ATS


Lighten up, Sys. You talk about the politeness of three members and launch an unprovoked attack on me? I am always polite to the members of UFOcasebook.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 16th, 2007, 10:48am

on Oct 16th, 2007, 09:42am, Marvin wrote:
I suspect there is something more to this part of the story (than to give the money maker over to LMH, to investigate, and not follow up on their own site).

Or am I missing something?


I see it as only professional courtesy. When C2C assigns a researcher to a case it's up to that researcher to investigate the case and more than likely come back on to C2C to report findings. This was attempted in the past like when LMH was on C2C and was to bring in a scientist to support the drone case. Unfortunately the scientist backed out at the last minute. Since all the other witnesses have disappeared it did not surprise me one bit when the scientist bailed.

C2C is not an investigative organization. They have ties to many people who do that sort of thing. C2C is a radio show that specializes in interviewing them.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 16th, 2007, 10:53am

on Oct 16th, 2007, 10:48am, Latitude wrote:
I see it as only professional courtesy. When C2C assigns a researcher to a case it's up to that researcher to investigate the case and more than likely come back on to C2C to report findings. This was attempted in the past like when LMH was on C2C and was to bring in a scientist to support the drone case. Unfortunately the scientist backed out at the last minute. Since all the other witnesses have disappeared it did not surprise me one bit when the scientist bailed.

C2C is not an investigative organization. They have ties to many people who do that sort of thing. C2C is a radio show that specializes in interviewing them.


I have never had any interest in them but that is what i thought Radio show Thanks Latitude. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 16th, 2007, 11:48am

on Oct 16th, 2007, 09:50am, Razor wrote:
Hi Marvin you are probably right more to it. The linguisst that is helping us just slapped mr back to earth for my comments saying that anyone who would go to as much trouble with something like this she is reading would not make such a hoax.. LOL i get blasted from all sides wink



Yea, we kind of all live in the blast zone on this subject (well, sort of) don't we. wink

Hang in there Razor.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by newtothis on Oct 16th, 2007, 4:54pm

Has anyone viewed the file here? http://lucianarchy.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=cali1&action=display&thread=1191844925

Woy at OMF seems to have made a 47mb jpg of the LAP! I can't download it for some reason though...

He says for the smallest lettering to reach an inch in size, the LAP would have to be 150 feet wide!

Hopefully something new to study...

Newt
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 16th, 2007, 5:40pm

Download the photo at the below link.
Save it and rotate it till you are looking at it upside down.

I see the words I STEAL.

Not proof of anything, but strange coincidence?


http://lucianarchy.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=cali1&action=display&thread=1192044632&page=3#1192335616
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by newtothis on Oct 16th, 2007, 5:49pm

on Oct 16th, 2007, 5:40pm, murnut wrote:
Download the photo at the below link.
Save it and rotate it till you are looking at it upside down.

I see the words I STEAL.

Not proof of anything, but strange coincidence?


http://lucianarchy.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=cali1&action=display&thread=1192044632&page=3#1192335616


I do see it smiley Pretty funny! If it is still there after being cleaned up I'm switching sides!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 16th, 2007, 5:55pm

A turned around and closer look...

User Image

Hmmmm.



This is on page 123 of the primer:

User Image

The bottom left "Circle."

User Image

At the 8 o'clock position.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 16th, 2007, 6:14pm

I dont know what this proves, but much respect goes out to woy, and sys and others for this find.

Any comment Linda?


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 16th, 2007, 6:27pm

on Oct 15th, 2007, 9:36pm, Razor wrote:
Murnut I think you may be on to something also, Cause i got this memo from a reliable research associate That I can gaurantee you knows what he is talking about.

Dean,

I can't remember if in my previous email I'd tied the viral marketing
theory
to any particular game or film. I think the point is that if the
Isaac/CARET/Chad/drone saga is part of a viral marketing campaign, it
may
relate to the launch of a film, game or other product/service that
hasn't
yet received much (or any) publicity.

For your information, I sent the material below in response to the most

recent question I received on this:

"My gut feeling is that this is a sophisticated hoax, possibly (as has
been
suggested) as part of a viral marketing campaign, or as an initiative
by
somebody wanting to showcase their skills in this area (in the same way
as a
filmmaker used the Haiti/Dominican Republic videos to showcase his CGI
skills). Other possibilities include commercial gain and it will be
interesting to see if a book and/or a DVD appears at some stage, or if
'Isaac' breaks cover and goes on the UFO lecture circuit. It's also
possible that the whole story is a set-up by skeptical ufologists using
it
as a way to study the psychology of belief."

Best wishes,

I cant reveal my source on this but I am inclined to believe the psychology of belief study and LMH is being quite because shes been pawned so there it is guys my stance on the subject and the stance of a very high up person in UFO research.The person that sent me that memo is considered one of the worlds leading authorities in this subject.
If LMH would have given us a simple return on just our thank you notes I would not have turned to this belief but her silence just proves to me she has been pawned.


Okay......so where is the movie, game, or whatever viral they are always talking about ?
I find it strange that all you heard is that stuff since May, and still no movie or game.
Is it just me or are these guys still milking those weak deductions ?
Someone should notify them that there isn't any movie or game with anything like this so they can stop sounding so stupid.

Mostly I come to read now and then anymore because of things like this. The same old viral this, game that stuff......it's really hard to take, it shouldn't even be printed here.
All of these so called "Experts' at this and that remain unnamed have nothing, but it's always a hoax, viral........and no proof at all of anything either way.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 16th, 2007, 6:37pm

Quote:
It's also
possible that the whole story is a set-up by skeptical ufologists using
it
as a way to study the psychology of belief.
"


This is the key part to me
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by blueyes on Oct 16th, 2007, 6:43pm

on Oct 16th, 2007, 6:37pm, murnut wrote:
This is the key part to me


Thats a very good point you'v made
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 16th, 2007, 6:43pm

on Oct 16th, 2007, 6:27pm, LangLee wrote:
Okay......so where is the movie, game, or whatever viral they are always talking about ?
I find it strange that all you heard is that stuff since May, and still no movie or game.
Is it just me or are these guys still milking those weak deductions ?
Someone should notify them that there isn't any movie or game with anything like this so they can stop sounding so stupid.

Mostly I come to read now and then anymore because of things like this. The same old viral this, game that stuff......it's really hard to take, it shouldn't even be printed here.
All of these so called "Experts' at this and that remain unnamed have nothing, but it's always a hoax, viral........and no proof at all of anything either way.


Hi Langlee,
He is the expert but in case you havent noticed the thread is dying and you just spoke about it wink Look back over my threads and see what friend WE have that is the one of worlds leading authorities on UFO Projects. and ask him yourself what he thinks IVE posted on it many times, and I dont give out peoples names unless they tell me I can wink Or you can come read once in a while and let the thread die, Makes me no never mind, I just try to share new findings with you with you, when people share them with me.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 16th, 2007, 7:12pm

Next time they say movie or game find out the name, I want to buy the game or see the movie.
If that's all he has, it would be easier to say ' I've got nothing ", which is exactly what he's saying.

I was told by people I know that it's a hoax because somthing like that couldn't possibly fly.....
that was after they studied the picture and said there was no indication of hoax, PS, or anything funky

Fear does strange things to people.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 16th, 2007, 7:22pm

It can fly I have a working model that one of my research friends made o fthe Anti Grav drive that it proably uses and woudl be more than happy to show it to you when i get home I am on the road at the moment and I donrt Have my computer with me.

1. Its the first negative research I have shown you Why.
2. Because if it is a psychlogical syudy being conducted on you then you need to know.
3. Will you be disappointe dif it is a game no not if you know in advance.
4.If it is real we will discover the truth no worries while every one else argues I assemble scientists to prove it to you .
5. If I find it is true I will share that with you.
6. Dont depend on C2C and LMH they dont care.They have proven that to me with their silence.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 16th, 2007, 7:56pm

To me, it's just strange enough to be real, if it isn't no big deal, I've never scored 100% on every test I've taken. Being wrong is like being right, you're NOT all of the time.
Psych studies don't work on me, I'm not that full of myself.
Won't be disappointed if it's a game, why would I be ?
C2C and LMH ? Never have depended on them, one has dropped the ball, and the other is sitting on information, I find them without honor if that is the case.

I like the things because finally they aren't blurry blobs......but it seems they are the only things that can be real LOL.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 16th, 2007, 8:08pm

Hi LangLee,
Well this thread is dying and the reason is that in the past every body wanted to argue with every body and critsize each other. It doesnt wash with me. Im a staright up guy if I show you something you can take it to the bank. If every one heRE wants to know the truth of Isaac then they need to get together and assemble the facts and share them. Latitude has tried to express this in the past and he is right. FYI castle4me and Von Stern are on to something in my opinion I am like you I dont claim to be the sharpest tool in the shed bUT I got friends that are and I can gaurantee if there is something to it we will get to the bottom of it. Everybody here needs to get together or it is simply gonna die away. Watch some of my posts and you will see I am a silly kind of guy that likes to research and throw in a little fun, if we fail so what, we had nothing to begin with and can start over.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 16th, 2007, 10:31pm

I can tell you all this, The thread is not dying because of lack of effort on our part, here and OMF and other places.

So many of you I have met online have made me proud to be associated with the drone case. Because of this case, I made my way here and OMF.

Sure we have had disagreements, but most of us are passionate for the cause. In the end, no matter the outcome, I am thankful for the drones.

All of you should be proud

We gave it our all.

The only downside is the awakening to the fact that some(not all) of our UFO leaders dont have the passion that we do, or they believe in something else entirely.....The Almighty Dollar.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 16th, 2007, 10:56pm

on Oct 16th, 2007, 10:31pm, murnut wrote:
I can tell you all this, The thread is not dying because of lack of effort on our part, here and OMF and other places.

So many of you I have met online have made me proud to be associated with the drone case. Because of this case, I made my way here and OMF.

Sure we have had disagreements, but most of us are passionate for the cause. In the end, no matter the outcome, I am thankful for the drones.

All of you should be proud

We gave it our all.

The only downside is the awakening to the fact that some(not all) of our UFO leaders dont have the passion that we do, or they believe in something else entirely.....The Almighty Dollar.


I agree Murnut dont follow those money guys take things into your own hands and make it work dont let the thread die and lose all your efforts.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 16th, 2007, 10:58pm

on Oct 16th, 2007, 10:31pm, murnut wrote:
I can tell you all this, The thread is not dying because of lack of effort on our part, here and OMF and other places.

So many of you I have met online have made me proud to be associated with the drone case. Because of this case, I made my way here and OMF.

Sure we have had disagreements, but most of us are passionate for the cause. In the end, no matter the outcome, I am thankful for the drones.

All of you should be proud

We gave it our all.

The only downside is the awakening to the fact that some(not all) of our UFO leaders dont have the passion that we do, or they believe in something else entirely.....The Almighty Dollar.


I agree MurNut dont let the thread die.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by obie on Oct 17th, 2007, 08:23am


NEWS | OPINIONS | SPORTS | ARTS & LIVING | Discussions | Photos & Video | City Guide | CLASSIFIEDS | JOBS | CARS | REAL ESTATE

Dragonfly or Insect Spy? Scientists at Work on Robobugs.

By Rick Weiss
Washington Post Staff Writer
Tuesday, October 9, 2007; A03



Vanessa Alarcon saw them while working at an antiwar rally in Lafayette Square last month.

"I heard someone say, 'Oh my god, look at those,' " the college senior from New York recalled. "I look up and I'm like, 'What the hell is that?' They looked kind of like dragonflies or little helicopters. But I mean, those are not insects."

Out in the crowd, Bernard Crane saw them, too.

"I'd never seen anything like it in my life," the Washington lawyer said. "They were large for dragonflies. I thought, 'Is that mechanical, or is that alive?' "

That is just one of the questions hovering over a handful of similar sightings at political events in Washington and New York. Some suspect the insectlike drones are high-tech surveillance tools, perhaps deployed by the Department of Homeland Security.

Others think they are, well, dragonflies -- an ancient order of insects that even biologists concede look about as robotic as a living creature can look.

No agency admits to having deployed insect-size spy drones. But a number of U.S. government and private entities acknowledge they are trying. Some federally funded teams are even growing live insects with computer chips in them, with the goal of mounting spyware on their bodies and controlling their flight muscles remotely.

The robobugs could follow suspects, guide missiles to targets or navigate the crannies of collapsed buildings to find survivors.

The technical challenges of creating robotic insects are daunting, and most experts doubt that fully working models exist yet.

"If you find something, let me know," said Gary Anderson of the Defense Department's Rapid Reaction Technology Office.

But the CIA secretly developed a simple dragonfly snooper as long ago as the 1970s. And given recent advances, even skeptics say there is always a chance that some agency has quietly managed to make something operational.

"America can be pretty sneaky," said Tom Ehrhard, a retired Air Force colonel and expert in unmanned aerial vehicles who is now at the Center for Strategic and Budgetary Assessments, a nonprofit Washington-based research institute.

Robotic fliers have been used by the military since World War II, but in the past decade their numbers and level of sophistication have increased enormously. Defense Department documents describe nearly 100 different models in use today, some as tiny as birds, and some the size of small planes.

All told, the nation's fleet of flying robots logged more than 160,000 flight hours last year -- a more than fourfold increase since 2003. A recent report by the U.S. Army Command and General Staff College warned that if traffic rules are not clarified soon, the glut of unmanned vehicles "could render military airspace chaotic and potentially dangerous."

But getting from bird size to bug size is not a simple matter of making everything smaller.

"You can't make a conventional robot of metal and ball bearings and just shrink the design down," said Ronald Fearing, a roboticist at the University of California at Berkeley. For one thing, the rules of aerodynamics change at very tiny scales and require wings that flap in precise ways -- a huge engineering challenge.

Only recently have scientists come to understand how insects fly -- a biomechanical feat that, despite the evidence before scientists' eyes, was for decades deemed "theoretically impossible." Just last month, researchers at Cornell University published a physics paper clarifying how dragonflies adjust the relative motions of their front and rear wings to save energy while hovering.

That kind of finding is important to roboticists because flapping fliers tend to be energy hogs, and batteries are heavy.

The CIA was among the earliest to tackle the problem. The "insectothopter," developed by the agency's Office of Research and Development 30 years ago, looked just like a dragonfly and contained a tiny gasoline engine to make the four wings flap. It flew but was ultimately declared a failure because it could not handle crosswinds.

Agency spokesman George Little said he could not talk about what the CIA may have done since then. The Office of the Director of National Intelligence, the Department of Homeland Security and the Secret Service also declined to discuss the topic.

Only the FBI offered a declarative denial. "We don't have anything like that," a spokesman said.

The Defense Department is trying, though.

In one approach, researchers funded by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA) are inserting computer chips into moth pupae -- the intermediate stage between a caterpillar and a flying adult -- and hatching them into healthy "cyborg moths."

The Hybrid Insect Micro-Electro-Mechanical Systems project aims to create literal shutterbugs -- camera-toting insects whose nerves have grown into their internal silicon chip so that wranglers can control their activities. DARPA researchers are also raising cyborg beetles with power for various instruments to be generated by their muscles.

"You might recall that Gandalf the friendly wizard in the recent classic 'Lord of the Rings' used a moth to call in air support," DARPA program manager Amit Lal said at a symposium in August. Today, he said, "this science fiction vision is within the realm of reality."

A DARPA spokeswoman denied a reporter's request to interview Lal or others on the project.

The cyborg insect project has its share of doubters.

"I'll be seriously dead before that program deploys," said vice admiral Joe Dyer, former commander of the Naval Air Systems Command, now at iRobot in Burlington, Mass., which makes household and military robots.

By contrast, fully mechanical micro-fliers are advancing quickly.

Researchers at the California Institute of Technology have made a "microbat ornithopter" that flies freely and fits in the palm of one's hand. A Vanderbilt University team has made a similar device.

With their sail-like wings, neither of those would be mistaken for insects. In July, however, a Harvard University team got a truly fly-like robot airborne, its synthetic wings buzzing at 120 beats per second.

"It showed that we can manufacture the articulated, high-speed structures that you need to re-create the complex wing motions that insects produce," said team leader Robert Wood.

The fly's vanishingly thin materials were machined with lasers, then folded into three-dimensional form "like a micro-origami," he said. Alternating electric fields make the wings flap. The whole thing weighs just 65 milligrams, or a little more than the plastic head of a push pin.

Still, it can fly only while attached to a threadlike tether that supplies power, evidence that significant hurdles remain.

In August, at the International Symposium on Flying Insects and Robots, held in Switzerland, Japanese researchers introduced radio-controlled fliers with four-inch wingspans that resemble hawk moths. Those who watch them fly, its creator wrote in the program, "feel something of 'living souls.' "

Others, taking a tip from the CIA, are making fliers that run on chemical fuels instead of batteries. The "entomopter," in early stages of development at the Georgia Institute of Technology and resembling a toy plane more than a bug, converts liquid fuel into a hot gas, which powers four flapping wings and ancillary equipment.

"You can get more energy out of a drop of gasoline than out of a battery the size of a drop of gasoline," said team leader Robert Michelson.

Even if the technical hurdles are overcome, insect-size fliers will always be risky investments.

"They can get eaten by a bird, they can get caught in a spider web," said Fearing of Berkeley. "No matter how smart you are -- you can put a Pentium in there -- if a bird comes at you at 30 miles per hour there's nothing you can do about it."

Protesters might even nab one with a net -- one of many reasons why Ehrhard, the former Air Force colonel, and other experts said they doubted that the hovering bugs spotted in Washington were spies.

So what was seen by Crane, Alarcon and a handful of others at the D.C. march -- and as far back as 2004, during the Republican National Convention in New York, when one observant but perhaps paranoid peace-march participant described on the Web "a jet-black dragonfly hovering about 10 feet off the ground, precisely in the middle of 7th avenue . . . watching us"?

They probably saw dragonflies, said Jerry Louton, an entomologist at the National Museum of Natural History. Washington is home to some large, spectacularly adorned dragonflies that "can knock your socks off," he said.

At the same time, he added, some details do not make sense. Three people at the D.C. event independently described a row of spheres, the size of small berries, attached along the tails of the big dragonflies -- an accoutrement that Louton could not explain. And all reported seeing at least three maneuvering in unison.

"Dragonflies never fly in a pack," he said.

Mara Verheyden-Hilliard of the Partnership for Civil Justice said her group is investigating witness reports and has filed Freedom of Information Act requests with several federal agencies. If such devices are being used to spy on political activists, she said, "it would be a significant violation of people's civil rights."

For many roboticists still struggling to get off the ground, however, that concern -- and their technology's potential role -- seems superfluous.

"I don't want people to get paranoid, but what can I say?" Fearing said. "Cellphone cameras are already everywhere. It's not that much different."

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 17th, 2007, 09:22am

Just an idea I heard somewhere else, in response to the above article.

The next time one of us is at one of these types of rallies....

Bring a net and catch one. wink

Props to ufocatcher
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by vinya12 on Oct 17th, 2007, 1:19pm

I Have only just started looking in to the drone thing. I thought they looked a bit like the shape of crop circles. I live in the UK and have not herd any reports of them here. Is this just a US thing?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 17th, 2007, 4:41pm

Not the first time the crop circle connection has been mentioned, but most of the sightings of the craft were in California, with one in Tahoe, Alabama, and Tennesse I think.

Funny, it never occured to me before, but the drones maybe a type of cropcircle itself.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by vinya12 on Oct 17th, 2007, 4:51pm

This may be a bit far out. But I was thinking, if the aliens made the crop circles, maybe they were the designs for the drones, a sort of way of showing us how to make a drone.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 17th, 2007, 7:06pm

on Oct 17th, 2007, 4:51pm, vinya12 wrote:
This may be a bit far out. But I was thinking, if the aliens made the crop circles, maybe they were the designs for the drones, a sort of way of showing us how to make a drone.
whats up;yes could be from a design from a cropcircle,but did not issac say the drone was some way from a downed craft of alien orgin? huh
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Luvey on Oct 17th, 2007, 10:26pm

If by some incredible quirk of fate you folks have missed this link I am posting it .... "just in case".... But if its old news please disregard.... smiley

http://lucianarchy.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=cali1&action=print&thread=1183057365

Luvey
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by vinya12 on Oct 18th, 2007, 02:21am

no I haven't seen that link. looks Interesting .
just hope my brain can make something of it lol laugh
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 18th, 2007, 10:56am

Firstly it really needs to be made quite clear that the Caret documents, and by extension the photographed? drones, are hoaxes. It is perfectly obvious: the document talks about antigravity, which is not known to the scientific community to exist. That is not to say that antigravity does not exist, but the matter has not been determined (and in fact it probably doesn't). If Caret knew, the scientific community would know. It is this simple fact that accounts for the fact that everyone has dropped this matter, and the mainstream media has completely ignored the drones except as a media phenonenum in its own right.

It does not follow that drones do not exist, indeed I believe that I may have seen one, or rather not seen one. In 2003 I hit a golf ball and watched it disappear in mid air. Fine you say, happens to me all the time: but this was not a drive but a chip shot no more that 50m from the hole, and the ball disappeared no more than 30m from me. An extensive search failed to find the ball and it was a straight forward chip. My brother in law, who was on the green at the time, said he heard me hit the ball but never heard it land. I did not know what happened to the ball, but now I believe it may have been captured by a drone.

This interpretation relies not only on the drone accounts but the extraordinary news from the world of mainstream science: that invisibility is possible and our work on it is progressing. In 2006 invisibility for microwaves was shown. Early this month the work was extended to the visible spectrum. Seeing is believing, you can see the images on the net. Putting together the fact that we are now "allowed to" "believe in" invisibility with the drone sightings gives me my interest in this topic.

So where from here. Allow me to suggest the following:

* simple arguments show that extraterrestial civilizations are many orders of magnitude older than our own, although probably no older than 200 million years (since second generation stars with iron and so forth are required).

* for such old civilizations the main imperative is the generation of meaning, ie interest in their lives. They like to observe us for the same reasons we like to observe orangetangs and gorillas, and they do not set up embassies with us for the same reason that we do not set up embassies with orangetangs and gorillas. (The gorillas are probably debating the question whether the strange hairless apes they sometimes see really exist, with the overwhelming gorillan concensus being that such a hairless thing is physically impossible.)

* invisible drones are the efficient and cost-effective way of observing us. We may all star in a celestial version of Big Brother or SimEarth. These drones may well be pervasive, at least one every 100sq miles, possibly many more. I am guessing that a spherical object is more easily cloaked than other shapes.

* The invisibility work suggests that invisibility is harder to create for higher frequencies. It may well not be possible at all in the ultra violet and x-ray spectrum. Maybe someone who understands the physics could offer a comment on this.

* The earth is surveilled from space by various (manmade) satellites in various spectra. Possibly some of this material is publicly available and in the ultra violet or xray spectrum.

* If so such photographs should be checked for anomalies which could be drones. Obviously these anomalies would just be little dots.

* In any case we could carry out some surveillance of our own using cameras working in the x-ray spectrum. This would establish statistical patterns of observation (if it works). Once the phenomenum can be made predictable and repeatable then establishment scientists will fall over themselves rushing to study it. I suggest that those with an interest in photographing drones, such as Dougster (Urantia), push their efforts in this direction. Surely Fry's sells X-ray cameras? Just out of interest, anyone else got any disappearing golf ball stories? I suspect that if you tried to shoot down a drone, absolutely nothing would happen: the drone would capture the bullet.

Some general comments: (1) Americans worry too much about "disclosure". You don't need the approval of the government before you accept something as fact. It doesn't matter what the American government says or doesn't say. Most UFO phenonena are outside the USA in any case. European governments such as France, Belgium are becoming increasingly open. The fact that everyone are carrying around cameras in their phones are making ufo sightings, and belief in ufos, ubiquitous.
(2) You should not worry about the supposed hostile intent of ufos. If they wanted to take the planet, they would have done so 100 million years ago. Our role for aliens, sorry the 'spatially challenged', lies in the generation of meaning. Response to ufos depends on the culture. Because we English speakers have had a great run over the last 400 years of history , we are used to being in control and many of us resent the thought that anyone else could dominate us. This is why ufos struggle in English speaking governments and the USA in particular. In Europe they are more used to being conquered and not being in control, and so more accepting of ufos. In the third world they are used to total domination by foreign culture and technology, they take it for granted. Ufos are just an extension of this, no (extra) problems!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 18th, 2007, 11:40am

on Oct 18th, 2007, 10:56am, turkoman wrote:
Firstly it really needs to be made quite clear that the Caret documents, and by extension the photographed? drones, are hoaxes. It is perfectly obvious: the document talks about antigravity, which is not known to the scientific community to exist. That is not to say that antigravity does not exist, but the matter has not been determined (and in fact it probably doesn't). If Caret knew, the scientific community would know. It is this simple fact that accounts for the fact that everyone has dropped this matter, and the mainstream media has completely ignored the drones except as a media phenonenum in its own right.


Please make up your mind! Why do you contradict yourself? You start out saying that the drones are a hoax then spend the remainder of your post arguing with yourself. Just because Caret knew anti-gravity existed does not mean they figured out how it worked. Besides Caret was a beyond secret project and not connected with mainstream science. Also, I don't need to tell you that at one time mainstream science claimed the world was flat!

Close Encounters of the Golfing Kind? Cool story.

The possibility of invisibility has been around since 1919. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_lensing
If electromagnetic radiation is only a wave in a medium, it stands to reason that control of that medium would open up all kinds of possibilities including invisibility. Don't trust your eyes. What you see is not always what you get.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 18th, 2007, 12:04pm

Contradiction wa, "a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds"- one of your blokes wasn't it?

You seem to have forgotten that Caret purportedly stands for "Commercial applications... ". Doesn't sound too secret to me. Even if it were, news that big would spread like wildfire. Thats what happens when objects start floating around laboratories.

It is a myth that people seriously believed in the middle ages that the earth was flat. Apparently there are only four instances of medieval authorities stating this. The majority of authorities thought the earth was round. See the Wikapedia article. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_earth

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 18th, 2007, 12:15pm

Something to consider on invisibility...

This UFO case:

http://www.ufocasebook.com/illinoissightings.html

Pay close attention to the Police Officers testimony at one minute and 20 seconds into the following film:

http://dbarkertv.com/EOR%20Preview%20DSL.wmv

http://www.cybercityradio.com/ufo/jan52000b.htm


My opinion is this technology in not alien.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 18th, 2007, 12:15pm

on Oct 18th, 2007, 12:04pm, turkoman wrote:
You seem to have forgotten that Caret purportedly stands for "Commercial applications... ". Doesn't sound too secret to me.


I agree with you on this point because that "Commercial applications... " moniker has always bothered me, especially with military brass watching over the entire project. If we ever have dialog with Isaac I would like to ask him about that one. It seems to me that intelligent scientists would have raised serious eyebrows at the notion. It has been brought up before that the money generated by the sale of this technology could have been funneled back into all kinds of secret weapons projects.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 18th, 2007, 12:20pm

on Oct 18th, 2007, 12:04pm, turkoman wrote:
Contradiction wa, "a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds"- one of your blokes wasn't it?

You seem to have forgotten that Caret purportedly stands for "Commercial applications... ". Doesn't sound too secret to me. Even if it were, news that big would spread like wildfire. Thats what happens when objects start floating around laboratories.

It is a myth that people seriously believed in the middle ages that the earth was flat. Apparently there are only four instances of medieval authorities stating this. The majority of authorities thought the earth was round. See the Wikapedia article. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_earth



I think the contradiction Latitude is pointing out is the first statement that the drones are a hoax then later argue for the reality of drones.

on Oct 18th, 2007, 10:56am, turkoman wrote:
Firstly it really needs to be made quite clear that the Caret documents, and by extension the photographed? drones, are hoaxes. It is perfectly obvious.

It does not follow that drones do not exist, indeed I believe that I may have seen one, or rather not seen one.



At least that is what tripped me up. But I believe you saying the photos were a hoax.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 18th, 2007, 12:25pm

on Oct 18th, 2007, 12:20pm, Marvin wrote:
I think the contradiction Latitude is pointing out is the first statement that the drones are a hoax then later argue for the reality of drones.
At least that is what tripped me up.

Thanks Marvin. That's exactly what I was thinking.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 18th, 2007, 12:38pm

on Oct 18th, 2007, 12:15pm, Marvin wrote:
Something to consider on invisibility...

This UFO case:

http://www.ufocasebook.com/illinoissightings.html

Pay close attention to the Police Officers testimony at one minute and 20 seconds into the following film:

http://dbarkertv.com/EOR%20Preview%20DSL.wmv

http://www.cybercityradio.com/ufo/jan52000b.htm


My opinion is this technology in not alien.


Sorry Marvin but I disagree for the same reasons I believe the drones aren't ours and neither was the O'hare object. The locations these things are sighted in are totally inconsistent with a military black project.

What I don't like about this Illinois report is something that has always bothered me about most UFO reports. Why does the object have lights on it, especially considering one officer says the thing was trying to use some sort of stealth?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 18th, 2007, 1:41pm

on Oct 18th, 2007, 11:40am, Latitude wrote:
Close Encounters of the Golfing Kind? Cool story.

User Image

grin

(No disrespect intended, just struck me as funny that the alien technology is here to rob golf b@lls!! <--- The profanity filter recognizes ridiculous words!! Cant even say C0CKPIT!!)



Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 18th, 2007, 7:41pm

on Oct 18th, 2007, 12:38pm, Latitude wrote:
Sorry Marvin but I disagree for the same reasons I believe the drones aren't ours and neither was the O'hare object. The locations these things are sighted in are totally inconsistent with a military black project.

What I don't like about this Illinois report is something that has always bothered me about most UFO reports. Why does the object have lights on it, especially considering one officer says the thing was trying to use some sort of stealth?



That's okay Latitude, if we agreed on everything, then we wouldn't have anything to debate. grin wink

The technology of seeing "through" the object by projecting the background to the other side or in this case, to the bottom of the craft as described by the Police Officer, was put out to the public in an declassified release a little over a year ago. It is a very "earthy" technology... for an alien. I believe this is the key for this specific case.

The plasma lights have been reported and photographed many times on the Manta. Yes, these craft can be very visible at times. Stealth has only approached the vis region in resent years, but as you know, stealth usually refers to radar profile (but also it is now being applied to sound, heat signatures, etc.).

Hiding things in plain sight is a lot easier than trying to completely hide them. Take a drone like device, place "alien" writing on it and fly it just about anywhere you want, now you can debunk it as a hoax or it is an alien craft... anything but what it really is. But shhhhh, don't tell anyone. rolleyes

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by ABCStore on Oct 18th, 2007, 9:36pm

Come to think of it, a drone could be simply an automated rescue vehicle. Think about it, makes sense...

ABC
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 18th, 2007, 10:12pm

Quote:
(No disrespect intended, just struck me as funny that the alien technology is here to rob golf b@lls!!


You sceptics can scoff, but those of us who haven't seen ufos know what we didn't see.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 18th, 2007, 11:55pm

on Oct 18th, 2007, 10:12pm, turkoman wrote:
You sceptics can scoff, but those of us who haven't seen ufos know what we didn't see.


Did they let you take a mulligan for that shot? wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 19th, 2007, 01:45am

on Oct 18th, 2007, 10:12pm, turkoman wrote:
You sceptics can scoff, but those of us who haven't seen ufos know what we didn't see.

And those who have are rarely believed, I guess its like being stuck between the rough and a water hazard......
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 19th, 2007, 3:21pm

You Smart minds - go for this:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/10/071012160144.htm

The team of mathematicians that first created the mathematics behind the "invisibility cloak" announced by physicists last October has now shown that the same technology could be used to generate an "electromagnetic wormhole."


--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 19th, 2007, 3:47pm

on Oct 18th, 2007, 12:15pm, Marvin wrote:
Something to consider on invisibility...

This UFO case:

http://www.ufocasebook.com/illinoissightings.html

Pay close attention to the Police Officers testimony at one minute and 20 seconds into the following film:

http://dbarkertv.com/EOR%20Preview%20DSL.wmv

http://www.cybercityradio.com/ufo/jan52000b.htm


My opinion is this technology in not alien.


Marvin, you're onto what I described in my Magazine..hehe grin

Showing the stars above, reproducing them underneath the vessel!

Kudos to you! cheesy

No further questions...take it from here! I'm off to the "peanut gallery" or the woodworks...I hope some of you climb the tree! grin

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 19th, 2007, 6:28pm

on Oct 19th, 2007, 3:21pm, VonStern wrote:
You Smart minds - go for this:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/10/071012160144.htm

The team of mathematicians that first created the mathematics behind the "invisibility cloak" announced by physicists last October has now shown that the same technology could be used to generate an "electromagnetic wormhole."


--VonStern



I guess it depends on your definition of a "wormhole."

I have always thought that a wormhole is like a fold in time/space that connects two distant points so that if enter it, you would then immediately exit it and be a very large distance away (but it did not seem like you traveled at all you just stepped through).

What is being described is more like an invisible tube or a projection. If time/space is reduced to zero when traveling through this tube then I would call it a wormhole. Otherwise, it just may be media hype.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 19th, 2007, 6:48pm

I made this gif of the Ty pics. I think this is the sequence.

User Image



Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 19th, 2007, 6:53pm

on Oct 19th, 2007, 6:48pm, Latitude wrote:
I made this gif of the Ty pics. I think this is the sequence.

User Image





Great work as always Latitude!

But as I watch this version, does it seem like the "feelers" do not change orientation?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 19th, 2007, 7:02pm

on Oct 18th, 2007, 10:56am, turkoman wrote:
Firstly it really needs to be made quite clear that the Caret documents, and by extension the photographed? drones, are hoaxes. It is perfectly obvious: the document talks about antigravity, which is not known to the scientific community to exist. That is not to say that antigravity does not exist, but the matter has not been determined (and in fact it probably doesn't). If Caret knew, the scientific community would know. It is this simple fact that accounts for the fact that everyone has dropped this matter, and the mainstream media has completely ignored the drones except as a media phenonenum in its own right.

It does not follow that drones do not exist, indeed I believe that I may have seen one, or rather not seen one. In 2003 I hit a golf ball and watched it disappear in mid air. Fine you say, happens to me all the time: but this was not a drive but a chip shot no more that 50m from the hole, and the ball disappeared no more than 30m from me. An extensive search failed to find the ball and it was a straight forward chip. My brother in law, who was on the green at the time, said he heard me hit the ball but never heard it land. I did not know what happened to the ball, but now I believe it may have been captured by a drone.

This interpretation relies not only on the drone accounts but the extraordinary news from the world of mainstream science: that invisibility is possible and our work on it is progressing. In 2006 invisibility for microwaves was shown. Early this month the work was extended to the visible spectrum. Seeing is believing, you can see the images on the net. Putting together the fact that we are now "allowed to" "believe in" invisibility with the drone sightings gives me my interest in this topic.

So where from here. Allow me to suggest the following:

* simple arguments show that extraterrestial civilizations are many orders of magnitude older than our own, although probably no older than 200 million years (since second generation stars with iron and so forth are required).

* for such old civilizations the main imperative is the generation of meaning, ie interest in their lives. They like to observe us for the same reasons we like to observe orangetangs and gorillas, and they do not set up embassies with us for the same reason that we do not set up embassies with orangetangs and gorillas. (The gorillas are probably debating the question whether the strange hairless apes they sometimes see really exist, with the overwhelming gorillan concensus being that such a hairless thing is physically impossible.)

* invisible drones are the efficient and cost-effective way of observing us. We may all star in a celestial version of Big Brother or SimEarth. These drones may well be pervasive, at least one every 100sq miles, possibly many more. I am guessing that a spherical object is more easily cloaked than other shapes.

* The invisibility work suggests that invisibility is harder to create for higher frequencies. It may well not be possible at all in the ultra violet and x-ray spectrum. Maybe someone who understands the physics could offer a comment on this.

* The earth is surveilled from space by various (manmade) satellites in various spectra. Possibly some of this material is publicly available and in the ultra violet or xray spectrum.

* If so such photographs should be checked for anomalies which could be drones. Obviously these anomalies would just be little dots.

* In any case we could carry out some surveillance of our own using cameras working in the x-ray spectrum. This would establish statistical patterns of observation (if it works). Once the phenomenum can be made predictable and repeatable then establishment scientists will fall over themselves rushing to study it. I suggest that those with an interest in photographing drones, such as Dougster (Urantia), push their efforts in this direction. Surely Fry's sells X-ray cameras? Just out of interest, anyone else got any disappearing golf ball stories? I suspect that if you tried to shoot down a drone, absolutely nothing would happen: the drone would capture the bullet.



Not a Golf Ball, but a few good men right here, I read this 40 years ago and I won't walk through a field at all.

http://www.spartechsoftware.com/dimensions/vanished/DavidLang.htm
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 19th, 2007, 7:05pm

on Oct 19th, 2007, 6:53pm, Marvin wrote:
Great work as always Latitude!

But as I watch this version, does it seem like the "feelers" do not change orientation?


It seems the bottom cage area doesn't rotate independent of the main structure at all.
I hate CGI..........
Except in Transformers LOL
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 19th, 2007, 7:37pm

on Oct 18th, 2007, 12:20pm, Marvin wrote:
I think the contradiction Latitude is pointing out is the first statement that the drones are a hoax then later argue for the reality of drones.




At least that is what tripped me up. But I believe you saying the photos were a hoax.


But then he said he thought he saw one, I don't get it.
As far as leaking out info about something floating in a lab, let's see....
Don't believe the "Bomb" had any leaks, and there were communities built to house those working on the project, there were literaly thousands working on it.
No one had ever heard of Francis Gary Powers until he and his Spy Plane were shot down.
The SR-71 had been flying for years before any word of it got out, then it took quite a while to prove it's existence.
Many Afro-American men were given Syphllis in Alabama, and it was allowed to run it's course, long thought to be rumor until it was proven and the Government tried to make ammends. Some perished, I believe some went insane, and many left sterile

I've been reading that the Rajman pics are hoaxes ? Did I miss something, there have been anomolies found in them and I missed the post ?
Many long kept secrets make the way into the public, much of the public would just as soon not want to know, many out of fear. Some secrets take longer than others, some have such a thick layer of BS on it built up over the years that the truth is more horrible than the lie to cover it up is.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 20th, 2007, 08:38am

on Oct 19th, 2007, 6:48pm, Latitude wrote:
I made this gif of the Ty pics. I think this is the sequence.

User Image

Hi Latitude, thats a great animation, I hope you dont mind but I played with the timing of it a little, this was the result.

User Image

Something struck me about the animation, it appeared as if the spike protruding from the bottom of the craft wasnt moving in correspondence with the rest of the craft.

Its almost as if the craft is sitting on the spike and rotating, or being rotated as a whole but from the base of the spike as that is where the least movement occurs.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 20th, 2007, 08:44am

(I forgot to ask undecided) was the base of the spike what you used as a point of reference?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 20th, 2007, 10:01am

That would be my guess.


Here is a poorly done GIF that shows relative motion to the background trees...



User Image


The sequence is in order from AA and I did some adjustments to try to keep the trees in about the same orientation and size. Like I said, poorly done.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 20th, 2007, 10:59am

on Oct 20th, 2007, 08:44am, DrDil wrote:
(I forgot to ask undecided) was the base of the spike what you used as a point of reference?


I did use the spike as the point of reference.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 20th, 2007, 11:02am

on Oct 19th, 2007, 6:53pm, Marvin wrote:
Great work as always Latitude!

But as I watch this version, does it seem like the "feelers" do not change orientation?


What part is the feelers?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 20th, 2007, 11:12am

on Oct 19th, 2007, 7:37pm, LangLee wrote:
I've been reading that the Rajman pics are hoaxes ? Did I miss something, there have been anomolies found in them and I missed the post ?


Where did you read this? I must have missed it too.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 20th, 2007, 11:17am

on Oct 20th, 2007, 11:02am, Latitude wrote:
What part is the feelers?



That would be the curved "wires" on top.

User Image

This part.



Someone called them feelers and that kind of stuck with me.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 20th, 2007, 11:33am

on Oct 20th, 2007, 11:17am, Marvin wrote:
That would be the curved "wires" on top.

Pics "kk" and "ll" has the drone at the top of the photo and cuts off the feelers.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Nodnunk on Oct 20th, 2007, 12:08pm

From the animations above, I noticed that photo JJ is the only one showing the feature circled in the image below. I'd think it would be visible in the other views.

User Image


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 20th, 2007, 1:37pm

on Oct 20th, 2007, 12:08pm, Nodnunk wrote:
From the animations above, I noticed that photo JJ is the only one showing the feature circled in the image below. I'd think it would be visible in the other views.


I made this same observation a while back. I think It was RoH who pointed out the apparent anomaly is likely the outer small ring of the double set.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 20th, 2007, 2:30pm

on Oct 18th, 2007, 11:40am, Latitude wrote:
Please make up your mind! Why do you contradict yourself? You start out saying that the drones are a hoax then spend the remainder of your post arguing with yourself. Just because Caret knew anti-gravity existed does not mean they figured out how it worked. Besides Caret was a beyond secret project and not connected with mainstream science. Also, I don't need to tell you that at one time mainstream science claimed the world was flat!

Close Encounters of the Golfing Kind? Cool story.

The possibility of invisibility has been around since 1919. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravitational_lensing
If electromagnetic radiation is only a wave in a medium, it stands to reason that control of that medium would open up all kinds of possibilities including invisibility. Don't trust your eyes. What you see is not always what you get.


Right there Latitude, he seemed quite convinced, thought he had proof that I missed. must be his wording that's confusing me.
As far as his statement about Commercial Applications......
Thing that NASA and Defense Dept. develop don't make money, not real money. Sure the manufacturers that employ people make money from the Government, but that's it.
For instance, Carbon Fiber once only for DoD or NASA has made it's way into our world, there isn't a racing car or motorcycle that doesn't have some, that also goes for street driven vehicles.
Flameproof Coatings, Titanium, Exotic Welding Techniques, Precision Machining, Metals with memory, all started there, now they make real money in our world, they have adapted it to our uses.
Heck, even in Star Gate SG-1 there was a conglomerate of businessmen that paid people to steal Alien Technology so they could adapt it in a way to be able to sell it pubilcly to make money, not for World Domination. that episode has got to be at least 5 years old.
Gotta make a buck off of it or it sits there as a Show Piece I guess.

Latitude, it's his first paragraph above the one I posted, the one you're commenting on.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Nodnunk on Oct 20th, 2007, 3:33pm

I still find it hard to see where that feature circled in the Ty JJ photo comes from. Also, the plum bob thing in the Ty JJ photo looks different compared to other images. Sure would be nice to see JJ in high resolution.

User Image User Image User Image
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 20th, 2007, 4:55pm

I do not have an answer Nodnunk. There's a lot of stuff in there.


Someone posted this version of the drone rotating sometime back:

User Image

Maybe it will be helpful.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 20th, 2007, 5:02pm

on Oct 20th, 2007, 3:33pm, Nodnunk wrote:
User Image User Image User Image



I think that is a glint... but when you think it through, where is the light source for it (especially with this "over cast" white sky)?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by CARETbust on Oct 20th, 2007, 8:06pm

*****THE TRUTH*****
No exif data..

exif data from an imported image, an unedited copy of an imported image, and an edit of an original image. Notice how exif data from a copy saved in photoshop retains the camera information, and also contains an adobe footprint. Also notice how a shooped image removes camera information.

Original image:
User Image
Copy saved in photoshop:
User Image
Original edited:
User Image


Original image:
http://xs220.xs.to/xs220/07420/header-original.jpg
Copy saved in photoshop:
http://xs220.xs.to/xs220/07420/header-copy.jpg
Original edited:
http://xs220.xs.to/xs220/07420/header-edited.jpg



Problems fully rendering the images, risky move "shooting" it (really, that's read "shopping" it) above power lines...

User Image
That has absolutely NOTHING to do with the lighting or any other natural element (eg - the wind), wires don't wind all over the place or get thinner in spots. Poor attention to detail in a key location will get your busted every time.. case in point.



Sorry guys.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 20th, 2007, 8:25pm

Excellent work my dear watson. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Oct 20th, 2007, 9:21pm

on Oct 20th, 2007, 8:06pm, CARETbust wrote:
*****THE TRUTH*****
No exif data..

exif data from an imported image, an unedited copy of an imported image, and an edit of an original image. Notice how exif data from a copy saved in photoshop retains the camera information, and also contains an adobe footprint. Also notice how a shooped image removes camera information.

Original image:
User Image
Copy saved in photoshop:
User Image
Original edited:
User Image


Original image:
http://xs220.xs.to/xs220/07420/header-original.jpg
Copy saved in photoshop:
http://xs220.xs.to/xs220/07420/header-copy.jpg
Original edited:
http://xs220.xs.to/xs220/07420/header-edited.jpg



Problems fully rendering the images, risky move "shooting" it (really, that's read "shopping" it) above power lines...

User Image
That has absolutely NOTHING to do with the lighting or any other natural element (eg - the wind), wires don't wind all over the place or get thinner in spots. Poor attention to detail in a key location will get your busted every time.. case in point.



Sorry guys.



A couple of questions for you CB and another observation. What is your original source of this Capitola drone image? Just FYI, the "bulky" looking wire is quite common in fact. It results from a low tension wire or wires (as in cable wire) being wrapped around a supporting guide wire which is the case in the Capitola image you have "busted" here. If you look at the entire image you can easily see this. I am surprised you missed that wink The fact that the "bulky" wire has a section missing IS really sloppy "shooping"....and if you also look at the smaller wires toward the top of the drone, they are on the wrong side of the spike...again missing "wire" segments on both if the drone is supposed to be above the wires. The Capitola image I am looking at is one of the ones I downloaded from one of the UFOC links somewhere in these massive threads. The exif data is only pertinent if you are commenting on the original image of this drone....which only LMH has...and I don't know if she has this one or not, can't recall. That's why I asked where you got the image you analysed. I'm not sure....has someone already said the Capitola images are hoaxed....if so, sorry, but I missed that.
Good job showing us a hack job on this image. Nice info for all on the exif data. Thanks!
The problem is still that none of us have original digital or analogue images to analyse....so all the cgi/lighting/shooping/discussion is nearly pointless. Even if this image is faked, it still does not answer whether the drone craft (only) images are hoaxed, real, disinformation, secret terrestrial (I doubt), extraterrestrial, or models placed in what ever setting you choose. I posted some images from a supposed German local a while back that were obvious fakes.
So....the drone saga drones on..... wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Fencesitter on Oct 21st, 2007, 02:44am

on Oct 19th, 2007, 3:21pm, VonStern wrote:
You Smart minds - go for this:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/10/071012160144.htm

The team of mathematicians that first created the mathematics behind the "invisibility cloak" announced by physicists last October has now shown that the same technology could be used to generate an "electromagnetic wormhole."


--VonStern


I'm calling shenanigans on the reporters of this story. All that's been invented here is a mathematical model showing that 'if a material with property x exists, we could bend emag waves around it in a particular way'.

They're using the good old place-holder of 'meta materials', meaning materials that haven't been invented yet. "It's up to the engineers to invent a working prototype" ---translation---> "This looks good on paper but we can't even imagine if it's possible in the physical world".

It's a neat idea, but I'd say this is a case of the reporter not quite 'getting it', and becoming caught up in the blue-sky possibilities. The comment on the 3D TV was particularly out to lunch - last time I checked, pixels appearing at the end of fixed-length invisible tubes still produce a 2D image...
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 21st, 2007, 02:45am

on Oct 20th, 2007, 8:06pm, CARETbust wrote:
User Image
That has absolutely NOTHING to do with the lighting or any other natural element (eg - the wind), wires don't wind all over the place or get thinner in spots. Poor attention to detail in a key location will get your busted every time.. case in point.

User Image

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 21st, 2007, 04:25am

I keep forgetting to mention that the word, Search is spelled wrong in the forum thread title. smiley

----------------------------------------
User Image
----------------------------------------


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 21st, 2007, 05:02am

on Oct 21st, 2007, 02:44am, Fencesitter wrote:
They're using the good old place-holder of 'meta materials', meaning materials that haven't been invented yet. "It's up to the engineers to invent a working prototype" ---translation---> "This looks good on paper but we can't even imagine if it's possible in the physical world".




--o0o--

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metamaterial

"Metamaterials have been proposed as a mechanism for building a cloaking device. These mechanisms typically involve surrounding the object to be cloaked with a shell that affects the passage of light near it.[8] Duke University and Imperial College London are currently researching this use of metamaterials and has managed to use metamaterials to cloak an object (in the microwave spectrum) using special concentric rings; the microwaves were barely affected by the presence of the cloaked object.[9] In early 2007, a metamaterial with a negative index of refraction for visible light wavelengths was announced by a joint team of researchers at the Ames Laboratory of the United States Department of Energy and at Karlsruhe University in Germany. The material had an index of -0.6 at 780 nanometers.[10]

Metamaterials have been also proposed for designing agile antennas [11]."

--o0o--

http://ceta-p5.mit.edu/metamaterials/papers/external/2003/zharov_prl_2003.pdf

"We analyze the properties of microstructured materials with negative refraction, the so- called lefthanded
metamaterials. We consider a two-dimensional periodic structure created by arrays of wires
and split-ring resonators embedded into a nonlinear dielectric, and calculate the effective nonlinear
electric permittivity and magnetic permeability.We demonstrate that the hysteresis-type dependence of
the magnetic permeability on the field intensity allows changing the material properties from left- to
right-handed and back. These effects can be treated as the second-order phase transitions in the
transmission properties induced by the variation of an external field."

--o0o--

http://www.opticsexpress.org/abstract.cfm?id=86672&CFID=3835983&CFTOKEN=74729834

--o0o--

End Transmission
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Gort on Oct 21st, 2007, 09:43am

Has anyone noticed the symbols on the cube from the transformers movie (its covered with them)? This may have been discussed, if so apologize for bringing up old stuff.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by Nodnunk on Oct 21st, 2007, 10:58am

on Oct 20th, 2007, 8:06pm, CARETbust wrote:
*****THE TRUTH*****

Problems fully rendering the images, risky move "shooting" it (really, that's read "shopping" it) above power lines...

User Image
That has absolutely NOTHING to do with the lighting or any other natural element (eg - the wind), wires don't wind all over the place or get thinner in spots. Poor attention to detail in a key location will get your busted every time.. case in point.



Sorry guys.



The twisted wires are shown clearer in this other Capitola image with the wires seen against the blue sky. There seem to be three dark wires and one lighter colored wire all twisted together. With the drone in the background, the lighter wire and the drone blend together causing an apparent "rendering problem".

I don't consider this wire issue as evidence for a CGI.

User Image


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by drewlac on Oct 21st, 2007, 12:59pm

I have a question about the May, 2006 Birmingham, Alabama case. Was this sighting only reported to Earthfiles? I've searched the MUFON database and couldn't find it. Also, does anyone know when it was submitted to Earthfiles? Was it in 2006 or after the Chad's C2C debut?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 21st, 2007, 1:40pm

on Oct 21st, 2007, 12:59pm, drewlac wrote:
I have a question about the May, 2006 Birmingham, Alabama case. Was this sighting only reported to Earthfiles? I've searched the MUFON database and couldn't find it. Also, does anyone know when it was submitted to Earthfiles? Was it in 2006 or after the Chad's C2C debut?

Nope, it was reported on May 23, 2007 exclusively to LMH (Earthfiles) saying,

"I remembered the device when I saw the photo on Coast to Coast WebPage. undecided

(Submitted by Mr. Smith <-- Which is the number 1 most popular surname in the US!!)
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 21st, 2007, 1:47pm

on Oct 21st, 2007, 12:59pm, drewlac wrote:
I have a question about the May, 2006 Birmingham, Alabama case. Was this sighting only reported to Earthfiles? I've searched the MUFON database and couldn't find it. Also, does anyone know when it was submitted to Earthfiles? Was it in 2006 or after the Chad's C2C debut?

http://www.earthfiles.com/news.php?ID=1253&category=Environment


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 21st, 2007, 1:57pm

on Oct 20th, 2007, 8:06pm, CARETbust wrote:
*****THE TRUTH*****
No exif data..

exif data from an imported image, an unedited copy of an imported image, and an edit of an original image. Notice how exif data from a copy saved in photoshop retains the camera information, and also contains an adobe footprint. Also notice how a shooped image removes camera information.

Original image:
User Image
Copy saved in photoshop:
User Image
Original edited:
User Image


Original image:
http://xs220.xs.to/xs220/07420/header-original.jpg
Copy saved in photoshop:
http://xs220.xs.to/xs220/07420/header-copy.jpg
Original edited:
http://xs220.xs.to/xs220/07420/header-edited.jpg



Problems fully rendering the images, risky move "shooting" it (really, that's read "shopping" it) above power lines...

User Image
That has absolutely NOTHING to do with the lighting or any other natural element (eg - the wind), wires don't wind all over the place or get thinner in spots. Poor attention to detail in a key location will get your busted every time.. case in point.



Sorry guys.




Johnnie Come Way too lately.......
You've got yourself a low res Rajman pic, in the pic I have you can clearly see the aluminum wire wrapped around the black cable
Been there, done that, moved on.......
Next ?

Just so you don't think I'm being a pr$*k, you can download the good one from here .....

http://allyoucanupload.webshots.com/b/2050419501371641644

I am kinda, sorta, maybe, and probably not sorry I came out that way.
If you really looked when you came in here you should've seen all of the other pages dedicated to this discussion. But since that's what you've come up with, I guess you're not into "seeing " anything. I bet you think that Salads' CGI's are exact duplicates too, you have my sympathy.
For you to come in here 5 months and 100's of pages later with that is simply........
I don't have a nice word for it, fill in the blank as you see fit.
With a name like that I just don't see that you're here to be constructive and help with this. So if you're here to just belittle this you're in the wrong place, but there is a place for you out there where others share your view.
It just isn't here.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 21st, 2007, 2:23pm

on Oct 21st, 2007, 09:43am, Gort wrote:
Has anyone noticed the symbols on the cube from the transformers movie (its covered with them)? This may have been discussed, if so apologize for bringing up old stuff.


Yes, I have it on my screen right now......
There's nothing there.
The "Transformers" link is now dead, nothing from CARET and no Drones or Drone like in the movie AT ALL.
No Halo 3 either
No UT 3 either
No Star Gate Worlds either
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 21st, 2007, 3:06pm

on Oct 21st, 2007, 2:23pm, LangLee wrote:
Yes, I have it on my screen right now......
There's nothing there.
The "Transformers" link is now dead, nothing from CARET and no Drones or Drone like in the movie AT ALL.
No Halo 3 either
No UT 3 either
No Star Gate Worlds either


Good job LangLee. I've said before that it would be a good idea to have a faq or maybe different threads on these same things that keep coming up over and over when another newbie discovers the drone case and thinks they have uncovered a smoking gun that nobody else has thought of before. What bothers me is their arrogant attitude. I have nothing but admiration for the job that the many "dronologists" have done since May.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 21st, 2007, 4:13pm

on Oct 21st, 2007, 3:06pm, Latitude wrote:
Good job LangLee. I've said before that it would be a good idea to have a faq or maybe different threads on these same things that keep coming up over and over when another newbie discovers the drone case and thinks they have uncovered a smoking gun that nobody else has thought of before. What bothers me is their arrogant attitude. I have nothing but admiration for the job that the many "dronologists" have done since May.


True Latitude, the audacity of them to think that they have it all covered....alone, and with weak observation skills simply makes me sick.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Gort on Oct 21st, 2007, 5:25pm

Some screen grabs of the cube (from Transformers)

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c1.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c2.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c3.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c4.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c5.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c6.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c7.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c8.jpg


Even if symbols not similar, interesting since the cube can execute programs, create machines.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 21st, 2007, 6:23pm

on Oct 21st, 2007, 5:25pm, Gort wrote:
Some screen grabs of the cube (from Transformers)

Even if symbols not similar, interesting since the cube can execute programs, create machines.


I finally saw the movie Friday night. My little boy had been bothering me to see it because he saw it at the theater and was blown away. I thought it was somewhat juvenile but entertaining.

Certain aspects did intrigue me. The one you pointed out and the Sector 7 agents who I think are very much real but may be called something else.

Unfortunately the movie continues with the ludicrous Hollywood notion that our species would be able to resist an alien attack.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by drewlac on Oct 21st, 2007, 6:56pm

on Oct 21st, 2007, 1:40pm, DrDil wrote:
Nope, it was reported on May 23, 2007 exclusively to LMH (Earthfiles) saying,

"I remembered the device when I saw the photo on Coast to Coast WebPage. undecided

(Submitted by Mr. Smith <-- Which is the number 1 most popular surname in the US!!)


Thanks DrDil and Lat!

This specific drone case (Alabama) has always bothered me. Why would Mr. Smith wait so long to report this sighting? Another few questions, did LMH interview Mr. Smith or was it submitted to Earthfiles via email? Did the photos submitted to Earthfiles have exf data? (sorry, i don't subscribe to Earthfiles and can't access the story).


And also, I was under the impression that Mr. Smith as an alias.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 21st, 2007, 10:15pm

on Oct 21st, 2007, 6:56pm, drewlac wrote:
Thanks DrDil and Lat!

This specific drone case (Alabama) has always bothered me. Why would Mr. Smith wait so long to report this sighting? Another few questions, did LMH interview Mr. Smith or was it submitted to Earthfiles via email? Did the photos submitted to Earthfiles have exf data? (sorry, i don't subscribe to Earthfiles and can't access the story).


And also, I was under the impression that Mr. Smith as an alias.


Yes "Mr Smith" is an alias. The exif is always stripped off of LMH's photos but instead has her Mac version photoshop tag.

Mr Smith like so many other witnesses like Sequoia Shirley, Yosemite Mom and even Isaac, came forward when they began hearing about the drones in the UFO media. Makes perfect sense to me. I see no impropriety in that.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by want2bleive on Oct 22nd, 2007, 09:48am

on Oct 21st, 2007, 05:02am, VonStern wrote:
--o0o--

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metamaterial

"Metamaterials have been proposed as a mechanism for building a cloaking device. These mechanisms typically involve surrounding the object to be cloaked with a shell that affects the passage of light near it.[8] Duke University and Imperial College London are currently researching this use of metamaterials and has managed to use metamaterials to cloak an object (in the microwave spectrum) using special concentric rings; the microwaves were barely affected by the presence of the cloaked object.[9] In early 2007, a metamaterial with a negative index of refraction for visible light wavelengths was announced by a joint team of researchers at the Ames Laboratory of the United States Department of Energy and at Karlsruhe University in Germany. The material had an index of -0.6 at 780 nanometers.[10]

Metamaterials have been also proposed for designing agile antennas [11]."

--o0o--

http://ceta-p5.mit.edu/metamaterials/papers/external/2003/zharov_prl_2003.pdf

"We analyze the properties of microstructured materials with negative refraction, the so- called lefthanded
metamaterials. We consider a two-dimensional periodic structure created by arrays of wires
and split-ring resonators embedded into a nonlinear dielectric, and calculate the effective nonlinear
electric permittivity and magnetic permeability.We demonstrate that the hysteresis-type dependence of
the magnetic permeability on the field intensity allows changing the material properties from left- to
right-handed and back. These effects can be treated as the second-order phase transitions in the
transmission properties induced by the variation of an external field."

--o0o--

http://www.opticsexpress.org/abstract.cfm?id=86672&CFID=3835983&CFTOKEN=74729834

--o0o--

End Transmission



Von,

I tried to explain this awhile back,

what I thought the drones were, I thought they were used for transfers by bending light, space , and time. The Big Basin was used for longer distance and the smaller drone for shorter distance. The language was more of a map to show where you are and how to get to the net point ( point of reference) also what resouces are available. Like a map of the BB network. Just read my previous post for a more detail description. I won't go on and on here and just repeat my thoughts over and over. But bottom line is that the drones are a part of a bigger network of drones throughout the universe, they have been around for a long time and it's how higher life forms travel by bending space and time. Notice the circles look alot like the diagram in the link you provided.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by want2bleive on Oct 22nd, 2007, 10:34am

Von,

I went back and dugg it up, here my original post back in Jul, 26, 2007




on 07/26/2007 at 14:35:19, want2bleive wrote:Look at it like a BB doorway to the BB galactic network

The top looks like a BB channel selector/ connection to the net
The bottom looks like a power source/generator for the device
The other rings maybe for the actual transfers

Think of it as a piece of hardware to connect to the galactic internet
Its our own welcome mat to the universe.
The mayans had a game to get a ball through a ring sounds familiar. last but not least, the writing on the panel on BB, all craft called the lingustic primer is not a primer but a universal road map and set of instructions just in case you finger fumbled your distination and pop out the other side of no where, got lost or get there by mistake. You could read the directions "you are here" and here's the map to help you get back on track. All of the smaller drone are advertising how to get to the BB like a http:// link "click here to find the BB" doorway to the universe. by the way I think it could transport any number of thing biological or non-biological.

I'd like to add that the writting on the drones provide a complete list all resources available. Never know what resources they may be running low on and may have to go out for it.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 22nd, 2007, 11:05am

On Headline news they are this morning reporting that an unknown source is causing the power grid in California to be sparking.
It is in relation to the fire storm story being run on Malibou. Bu tthey are not saying where the grid is being affected.
Is the grid going down? Is the soucre the drones do they sense something is wrong?
You tell me!!!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 22nd, 2007, 12:46pm

on Oct 22nd, 2007, 11:05am, Razor wrote:
On Headline news they are this morning reporting that an unknown source is causing the power grid in California to be sparking.
It is in relation to the fire storm story being run on Malibou. Bu tthey are not saying where the grid is being affected.
Is the grid going down? Is the soucre the drones do they sense something is wrong?
You tell me!!!


The grid is working fine here. I don't think the drones are interested in the grid. I think they have bigger fish to fry. Just my opinion.

edit to add: I live in central California.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 22nd, 2007, 2:21pm

on Oct 21st, 2007, 5:25pm, Gort wrote:
Some screen grabs of the cube (from Transformers)

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c1.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c2.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c3.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c4.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c5.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c6.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c7.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y53/Godzilla1/c8.jpg


Even if symbols not similar, interesting since the cube can execute programs, create machines.


Sorry if I misunderstood Gort, I did think about that when I saw the Cube floating thru Space.
It was said that "It created our World", where did IT come from ? But that's not for here lol.
There was talk some years ago of "Self Healing Computers", if a circut went bad, it would re-route itself.

I'm finding this whole silence thing a bit strange.......
On one hand it could mean that in fact the whole thing has some substance to it. If there was nothing to it I would think someone would by now be boasting what boneheads we are for believing such a farce.
It would seem that with all of the hard work it would take to create such a hoax, wouldn't that person or persons want to rub our noses in it ?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 22nd, 2007, 2:48pm

on Oct 22nd, 2007, 12:46pm, Latitude wrote:
The grid is working fine here. I don't think the drones are interested in the grid. I think they have bigger fish to fry. Just my opinion.

edit to add: I live in central California.


The reason I ask was, everyone was looking at power poles and tags earlier and every time i see a picture of a drone they are next to a power pole , So i was just thinking maybe they minitor the grid to watch for danger or hook to the internet so they can see what people are saying about them, some internet connections are through the power grid.
Where is the Park Ranger from an earlier post that said they are just a normal part of his surroundings?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by drewlac on Oct 22nd, 2007, 3:00pm

on Oct 21st, 2007, 10:15pm, Latitude wrote:
Yes "Mr Smith" is an alias. The exif is always stripped off of LMH's photos but instead has her Mac version photoshop tag.
Shouldn't she keep an original? Poor on her part

on Oct 21st, 2007, 10:15pm, Latitude wrote:
Mr Smith like so many other witnesses like Sequoia Shirley, Yosemite Mom and even Isaac, came forward when they began hearing about the drones in the UFO media. Makes perfect sense to me. I see no impropriety in that.

IMO, the thing that separates Mr Smith from these folks (can't count Isaac, he's a different animal all together) is he took a photograph, thus having a piece evidence to back-up his story. I don't buy his, "I did not want to get involved in anything, so I let it go" excuse. If it was true he would have never came forward. This piece of the drone saga is shaky at best for me.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 22nd, 2007, 4:58pm

A very talented Psychic with remote viewing abilitites has graciously agreed to join our research team today. She feels the next drone sighting will be in Arizona and they are there looking for an unkown mineral around the crater site. She informs me she gives free readings and if any one wishs to talk with her I will hook you up. If the next drone is in Arizona then you will know to believe in her!!!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 22nd, 2007, 5:28pm

Further when I showed her the first picture she said it was no treal and then on the second she said she got the distinct impression it was in Arizona. If any one is in Arizona keep an eye on that Crater area. Also she siad that even if they are invisible they are leaving an Ion trail behind so for those who ask me about testing equipment I think an Ion meter would be your best bet at this point as it is something that can be used in real time.

http://www.hotektech.com/DeltaOhmHD2102.htm
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 23rd, 2007, 06:38am

on Oct 21st, 2007, 3:06pm, Latitude wrote:

Hey Latitude, I forgot to mention, your favourite friendly researcher is back online again. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 23rd, 2007, 07:59am

on Oct 22nd, 2007, 5:28pm, Razor wrote:
Further when I showed her the first picture she said it was no treal and then on the second she said she got the distinct impression it was in Arizona. If any one is in Arizona keep an eye on that Crater area. Also she siad that even if they are invisible they are leaving an Ion trail behind so for those who ask me about testing equipment I think an Ion meter would be your best bet at this point as it is something that can be used in real time.

http://www.hotektech.com/DeltaOhmHD2102.htm


1st picture ?
2nd picture ?
Which one's were they ?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 23rd, 2007, 08:09am

on Oct 23rd, 2007, 07:59am, LangLee wrote:
1st picture ?
2nd picture ?
Which one's were they ?


These's pictures.
http://isaaccaret.fortunecity.com/

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 23rd, 2007, 09:58am

on Oct 23rd, 2007, 06:38am, DrDil wrote:
Hey Latitude, I forgot to mention, your favourite friendly researcher is back online again. wink


Yeah the liar is back up. BTW, I emailed Dr Bruce Maccabee and asked him if he was part of a Mufon investigation into the drones. He promptly replied that he did see the photos but was not part of a investigation (another Steve Reichman lie). He did say "IMHO this may not be resolved by photo analysis alone, but may require a full FBI level investigation of the witnesses."
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 23rd, 2007, 10:32am

I looked at the UFO Researcher site. There seems to be a Latitude there involved in the drone debate, with similar views to our Latitude. This proves there is intelligent life on other bulletin boards and it is fundamentally similar to the life on this one. No doubt sceptics will claim it is a different Latitude, or at least that there is no evidence that it is the same Latitude, but I choose to believe it is.

Questions arising from the debate on that board:

1) How can it be so hard to find out the weather in Capitola on 16th May 2007? There may be debate about UFOs but surely the weather is uncontroversial? Can't you just ring up the weather bureau and ask them, or look in the archives of the local newspaper at the local library.

2) Haven't you seen Saladfingers analysis of the Rajman photos at the OpenMinds forum (I won't go into the question as to whether it is the same Saladfingers). That proved conclusively to me the Rajman photos are fakes. All the sky pixels are the same in different photographs. Saladfingers posted another example to show that this is a rendering artifact. I don't see how anyone could take the Rajman photos seriously after seeing that - seeing is believing, as we say in the trade.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by ZeroPointEnergy on Oct 23rd, 2007, 11:31am

on Oct 22nd, 2007, 5:28pm, Razor wrote:
Further when I showed her the first picture she said it was no treal and then on the second she said she got the distinct impression it was in Arizona. If any one is in Arizona keep an eye on that Crater area. Also she siad that even if they are invisible they are leaving an Ion trail behind so for those who ask me about testing equipment I think an Ion meter would be your best bet at this point as it is something that can be used in real time.

http://www.hotektech.com/DeltaOhmHD2102.htm


Razor,

I have read and follow this thread daily.

I live in Arizona, west of the Phoenix metro area. A drive to the crater area takes about 3 hours. I live directly in the landing pattern of Luke AFB, which I tend to think accounts for the fact I never see anything in this area. (ILS Radars, etc)

Going to the crater on the 'off chance' I might see a drone will be hit and miss. I have been camping in the general area though and also didn't see anything. (mormon lake area)

One of the reasons for my going caming in this area was to investigate the NPIO, which got my attention on google earth. I suspect there is more to this facility than 'meets the eye'.

http://www.nofs.navy.mil/projects/npoi/

Rest assured, I keep my eyes and ears open, and my camera ready at all times. This thread will be the first to know of anything from me in the Phoenix metro area.




Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 23rd, 2007, 12:33pm

on Oct 23rd, 2007, 10:32am, turkoman wrote:
I looked at the UFO Researcher site. There seems to be a Latitude there involved in the drone debate, with similar views to our Latitude. This proves there is intelligent life on other bulletin boards and it is fundamentally similar to the life on this one. No doubt sceptics will claim it is a different Latitude, or at least that there is no evidence that it is the same Latitude, but I choose to believe it is.

Quote:
The Drone Mystery, Isaac's Account : #5 on: 09/28/2007 at 16:04:29 Latitude wrote:

I am so glad you brought this up. I was considering posting about the outcome of this little episode. It's not pretty.

Yes, I registered at Steve's web forum UFOresearchers.com. Above is one of the responses from Steve to my inquiry. I went on to show him two more weather reports that show absolutely no rain the day of the Capitola sighting (one from his source the NOOA. He evidently does not know how to look up weather history on their website or refuses to). They also showed a 9 mile visibility and only .02 inches of rain the entire month of May and that happened on the first few days. There was no rain withing weeks of the 17th.

He never responded to that so I investigated his claim that Chad and Raj having the same IP address. It was OMF and C2C who worked together on that issue as sighted by Steve. I remembered something about OMF's admins discovering similarities in the IP addresses so I went into the archives of omf to get the straight story. It was confusing in that they initially claimed there was a similarity but later claim there wasn't. I asked OMF admins to make a final statement to clear up the ip address issue once and for all. I was told the was never a similarity and any previous claims of a similarity were cause by a miscommunication between OMF and C2C.

I posted this to Steve's forum and was banned the next day without an explanation. Also my post about the IP addresses, which was completely civil, respectful and within forum guidelines, was deleted. I sent an email to Steve asking why I was banned and the email bounced back to me three days later.

This guy is obviously lying about the facts, but why?

smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 23rd, 2007, 12:43pm

on Oct 23rd, 2007, 10:32am, turkoman wrote:
I looked at the UFO Researcher site. There seems to be a Latitude there involved in the drone debate, with similar views to our Latitude. This proves there is intelligent life on other bulletin boards and it is fundamentally similar to the life on this one. No doubt sceptics will claim it is a different Latitude, or at least that there is no evidence that it is the same Latitude, but I choose to believe it is.

It was me. wink

Quote:
Questions arising from the debate on that board:

1) How can it be so hard to find out the weather in Capitola on 16th May 2007? There may be debate about UFOs but surely the weather is uncontroversial? Can't you just ring up the weather bureau and ask them, or look in the archives of the local newspaper at the local library.

It's not hard to find the archived weather data. I posted links on that site to three different sources which specifically state the clear weather for Capitola on 5-16-07. All Steve could do is try to fool people with a continental satellite view of water vapor. This is the exact same tactic used by other disinfo agents.

Quote:
2) Haven't you seen Saladfingers analysis of the Rajman photos at the OpenMinds forum (I won't go into the question as to whether it is the same Saladfingers). That proved conclusively to me the Rajman photos are fakes. All the sky pixels are the same in different photographs. Saladfingers posted another example to show that this is a rendering artifact. I don't see how anyone could take the Rajman photos seriously after seeing that - seeing is believing, as we say in the trade.

Where on Steve's forum was Saladfingers ever discussed? If you are convinced by Salad then so be it but why try to associate it with Steve's forum? But since were on the subject, when did Salad ever prove a problem with sky pixels? I never saw that come from him. Link please.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by LangLee on Oct 23rd, 2007, 1:56pm

The ONLY thing Salad has proved is that the Drones CANNOT be duplicated.
If your eyes see that his and the pics are indentical, your mind is lacking.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DdP on Oct 23rd, 2007, 2:01pm

on Oct 23rd, 2007, 12:43pm, Latitude wrote:
All Steve could do is try to fool people with a continental satellite view of water vapor. This is the exact same tactic used by other disinfo agents.


Great email exchange with Dr Bruce Maccabee.

Your sept. dialogue with Steven Reichmuth is still online :
http://forums.uforesearcher.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=000100

...or did he erase some of your remarks ?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 23rd, 2007, 2:48pm

on Oct 23rd, 2007, 2:01pm, DdP wrote:
Great email exchange with Dr Bruce Maccabee.

I agree, and I see you're still busy with your updates. (And your site is still one of my most visited. Just to see what you're saying about me of course!! grin)

Hope you're keeping well.
(OVNIS-USA.com For daily Drone updates!! wink)

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 23rd, 2007, 3:41pm

on Oct 23rd, 2007, 1:56pm, LangLee wrote:
The ONLY thing Salad has proved is that the Drones CANNOT be duplicated.
If your eyes see that his and the pics are indentical, your mind is lacking.



Hi LangLee,
Your criticisim of members in another post and this one flaming Laitude has broken the forum rules and your membership agreement, everyone has been more than warned several times not to do this by my self , Merlin, MarkM so BYE BYE your smart mouth just got you banned from here. We dont need your kind of smart mouth remarks of critisim here.
Latitude's Mind is not lacking he is one of the most valuable members here unlike your self who only comes to read once in a awhile (from you own words), and obviously make others miserable
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by TeachersPet on Oct 23rd, 2007, 4:59pm

There is a God..I mean Razor in the sky..Thy will be done..
I feel a great current in here again.
Kudos to all


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 23rd, 2007, 6:05pm

on Oct 23rd, 2007, 2:01pm, DdP wrote:
Great email exchange with Dr Bruce Maccabee.

Your sept. dialogue with Steven Reichmuth is still online :
http://forums.uforesearcher.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=000100

...or did he erase some of your remarks ?


Yes, he erased my last post. It was the one Dr Dill pointed out where I posted about OMF's administration confirming that Chad and Raj's IP addresses were in no way even similar, much less as Steve was claiming identical. My post was respectful and within forum guidelines but must have been too much for him to handle.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 23rd, 2007, 6:18pm

on Oct 23rd, 2007, 4:59pm, TeachersPet wrote:
There is a God..I mean Razor in the sky..Thy will be done..
I feel a great current in here again.
Kudos to all



LOL Thanks TheachersPet,

I take it you didnt like his snide little critisisms also. It really demeans people and I have no room for it at all anymore since ATO is gone. I read your posts with great interest(keep up your great posts I enjoy them, and admire the way you put in a little compliment to people here and there wink] by the way if anyone picks on you, see me I have absolutely no reservations in bouncing a few more of the ones I been watching who demean people.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 23rd, 2007, 11:50pm

Quote:
The ONLY thing Salad has proved is that the Drones CANNOT be duplicated.
If your eyes see that his and the pics are indentical, your mind is lacking.

LangLee was having a go at me, not Latitude. Reading my post should have told him that I was not referring to any of Saladfingers CGI recreations, but rather this analysis:


http://lucianarchy.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=cali1&action=display&thread=1188663891&page=1#1188815382

dugBot yourWorkingBot
all questions about my 'mind' should be referred to my lead programmer. The Emma 8000 series of working bots is known for its reliable cognition and class-leading inductive stability:
http://emma8000.universalrobotics.com
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 24th, 2007, 01:21am

on Oct 23rd, 2007, 11:50pm, turkoman wrote:
Reading my post should have told him that I was not referring to any of Saladfingers CGI recreations, but rather this analysis:

http://lucianarchy.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=cali1&action=display&thread=1188663891&page=1#1188815382


Oh yes. I remember this. Way too easy!

Those similarities are caused by imperfections in Raj's camera lense and ccd. The similarities in the Isaac photo is most likely caused by the scanner glass.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 24th, 2007, 02:33am

on Oct 23rd, 2007, 4:59pm, TeachersPet wrote:
There is a God..I mean Razor in the sky..Thy will be done..
I feel a great current in here again.
Kudos to all


Hi Sys, nice to see you back again!! wink

User Image


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 24th, 2007, 03:53am

on Oct 24th, 2007, 01:21am, Latitude wrote:
Oh yes. I remember this. Way too easy!

Those similarities are caused by imperfections in Raj's camera lense and ccd. The similarities in the Isaac photo is most likely caused by the scanner glass.


How do you know it is? Have you tested it using your own camera? Noone seemed to demonstrate that very convincingly in the thread, although there was much of debate!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Razor on Oct 24th, 2007, 07:05am

on Oct 23rd, 2007, 11:50pm, turkoman wrote:
LangLee was having a go at me, not Latitude. Reading my post should have told him that I was not referring to any of Saladfingers CGI recreations, but rather this analysis:


http://lucianarchy.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=cali1&action=display&thread=1188663891&page=1#1188815382

dugBot yourWorkingBot
all questions about my 'mind' should be referred to my lead programmer. The Emma 8000 series of working bots is known for its reliable cognition and class-leading inductive stability:
http://emma8000.universalrobotics.com


Thats ok Turkoman he shouldnt have been having a go at anybody. Maybe he will have a better attitude with people the next time he joins a forum. I deleted him but someone else unknown to me banned his IP so he wont be back here. Cause I am not gonna waste my time to unbann him.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 24th, 2007, 09:32am

wish every one safty that are close or in the area of the california fires,be safe out west, fla sending love. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 24th, 2007, 9:04pm

magooollo at OMF found this in a spam email

http://www.alienware.com/contest_pages/contest_declassified.aspx


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 24th, 2007, 9:16pm

on Oct 24th, 2007, 9:04pm, murnut wrote:
magooollo at OMF found this in a spam email

http://www.alienware.com/contest_pages/contest_declassified.aspx

thank you murnut:some one wants the drone enigma solve prety badly they will pay an cash award,i thing that will get minds rolling.thou i am of no help with the drone language as spanish. grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 24th, 2007, 9:40pm

Viral Marketing=Hoax


Or is it?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 24th, 2007, 10:51pm

You might like to check out http://www.alienware.com/Microsite_Pages/declassified/main.aspx for more stuff which seems strangely familiar.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by murnut on Oct 24th, 2007, 11:00pm

Thanks...In a strange way, I am glad the jig is up.
But I will never forget the great friends I met along the way.

You are all to be commended
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by hjdelight on Oct 25th, 2007, 12:04am

Well that sucks! I'll never buy their merchandise and I'm a gamer.

HJ
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 25th, 2007, 12:20am

The jig may be up for the more spectacular drone sightings, but for ufology as a whole the jig is not up and hopefully only beginning... it was always obvious from the rubbish in the Caret document that Isaac and the photographed drones were a hoax. It is embarrassing to think that I ever speculated that the earliest sightings (Chad and LakeTahoeLady) could be genuine, but we are here to be open minded aren't we. It in no way bears on the question as to whether cloaked drones are actually in operation. It is not that I am paranoid about being watched by cloaked drones: rather that I am an economist, and it seems clear to me that cloaked drones are the most effective way for advanced extraterrestials to achieve their objectives. I would never have considered invisible drones before the spectacular experiments of the past year made it respectable to countenance such things. As I suggested earlier, we should be looking for them in the x-ray spectrum.

Therefore, to push this forward, we need to find out from someone perhaps in the medical field what exists in the way of x-ray cameras. Are there digital x-ray cameras now? Those false color screens they use in customs inspections: is that x-ray technology? I think it is, the machines say beware of x-rays. If someone in this forum has experience in one of these areas we can keep this thing moving by setting up a surveillance program.

Ideally we would use an x-ray and ordinary digital camera side by side to allow sightings to be interpreted.

For all the enthusiastic analysis of Caret, it is odd that no-one thought to do a simple frequency analysis of the letters and deciper the message that way: there is enough material in the diagrams to permit that. I even show the kids how to do that in the 'spy school' I run at Sunday School, but I never thought of doing it here. Oh the shame!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 25th, 2007, 01:16am

Do we know for sure alienware is the origin of all of this? or are they jumping on the dronewagon? It seems silly to go through all that trouble for a $2800 prize trip to NY. I decoded their code and compared it to some of the primer expecting some hidden messages. I found none which I find odd for such a complex hoax (if it is). You would expect to find tons of hidden messages all through the primer, on the drones etc.

Granted I gave it a cursory look but nothing jumped out at me. No 'Alienware' on the tails of the drones.

BTW here is their alien message deciphered;

"Denials and cover ups will prove futile when each and every person can hold the evidence in their hands.
Seek out the area 51 m15x and area 51 m14x." Not %100 on the m15x or m14x I had trouble seeing the primer numbers. I tried to enter and the form does not work, figures jerks.

I still find it hard to believe they are the origin of this, has anyone e-mailed them and asked? I just did. I can't figure out how they benefit from creating such an elaborate hoax.

They are jerks either way, jumping on the dronewagon or creating it.

I also would not by anything from them.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 25th, 2007, 07:38am

on Oct 25th, 2007, 01:16am, danblast wrote:
Do we know for sure alienware is the origin of all of this? or are they jumping on the dronewagon? It seems silly to go through all that trouble for a $2800 prize trip to NY. I decoded their code and compared it to some of the primer expecting some hidden messages. I found none which I find odd for such a complex hoax (if it is). You would expect to find tons of hidden messages all through the primer, on the drones etc.

Granted I gave it a cursory look but nothing jumped out at me. No 'Alienware' on the tails of the drones.

I still find it hard to believe they are the origin of this, has anyone e-mailed them and asked? I just did. I can't figure out how they benefit from creating such an elaborate hoax.



I have to agree with you danblast. One must ask the question, which came first? The chicken or the egg?

I saw no connection to the drones on their site and no admission that they are the origin of the Isaac/drone viral advertising. The only connection is the primer and language. Even the language has different characters in it now, that is in their contest, so it is not really quite the same.

They may be seeing this opportunity as low hanging fruit and an easy way to promote, advertise (get their name out) and make a buck. Gee, I have never heard of them before so it must be working.

I think it is a bit early to throw in the towel on this one as being the source.

Please let us know what response you get from your inquiry to them.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Oct 25th, 2007, 11:16am

I don't think they are the source, I think they are just capitalizing on the drone alien language.... and stirring up interest.

They got all of us to look at their site didn't they?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 25th, 2007, 12:03pm

I hope this Alienware marketing campaign is only the beginning. As more mainstream entities pick up on the drones more people will begin to seek it's origins. This might be the continued evolution of the drone saga. Let's hope they next begin showing pics of drones. That, in my opinion, would likely spur a new wave of witnesses coming forward. I wonder how the agents are seeing this lap campaign?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 25th, 2007, 12:21pm

I can't see how they benefit from creating the 'hoax' all that work, months then nothing for weeks. Now a stupid contest and simple substitution code. It does not make sense. What makes sense is them hitching their wagon to this because it's weird brings people to their site, so I think they simply are riding the wave. Because honestly all that time which equates to money that had go into this if it is a 'hoax' could have been much better spent and had a much bigger pay off.

The really telling thing I think is when applying their code to the primer nothing jumps out at you. If this was such a well planned hoax then I would expect 'Alienware' to be written across the tail of a drone. Why would they put together such an incredibly elaborate scheme then leave out the punch line?

Anyone else try applying their code to the primer using my translation of the alienware code? It took a while but if you compare the translation I posted you can get the whole alphabet they use and apply it to the primer.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 25th, 2007, 12:29pm

on Oct 25th, 2007, 12:21pm, danblast wrote:
I can't see how they benefit from creating the 'hoax' all that work, months then nothing for weeks. Now a stupid contest and simple substitution code. It does not make sense. What makes sense is them hitching their wagon to this because it's weird brings people to their site, so I think they simply are riding the wave. Because honestly all that time which equates to money that had go into this if it is a 'hoax' could have been much better spent and had a much bigger pay off.

The really telling thing I think is when applying their code to the primer nothing jumps out at you. If this was such a well planned hoax then I would expect 'Alienware' to be written across the tail of a drone. Why would they put together such an incredibly elaborate scheme then leave out the punch line?

Anyone else try applying their code to the primer using my translation of the alienware code? It took a while but if you compare the translation I posted you can get the whole alphabet they use and apply it to the primer.


I think it is obvious that Alienware has hitched onto the lap. I'd be willing to bet that if you did apply their code to the primer you would end up with gibberish.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 25th, 2007, 1:02pm

Lattitude, here is the alphabet crack. Some wanker on OMF claims my translation of the code is wrong and flawed. So here it is check it out for yourself.

User Image

I tried to register at OMF but I have to wait to be approved. I don't know why this person got all bent out of shape and kind of nasty. It is what it is I know I got it right. Except possibly for the two numbers.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 25th, 2007, 1:20pm

on Oct 25th, 2007, 1:02pm, danblast wrote:
Lattitude, here is the alphabet crack. Some wanker on OMF claims my translation of the code is wrong and flawed. So here it is check it out for yourself.



Yes you seem to be the first to crack it. Good job. You may have to wait for Bren to wake up (he's in the UK) before you can register. But I don't see why Ivo can't do it. Maybe Ivo is busy.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 25th, 2007, 1:26pm

How about the first part of the message regarding denials and coverups? Forget the plug for their laptops. Alienware is with us in our beliefs.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Smisser on Oct 25th, 2007, 1:31pm

@ danblast --What tells us this -huh?

User Image
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 25th, 2007, 1:42pm

Nothing just letters if it is letters. When you apply the alienware code you get ICEM and KH nonsense stuff. So I have a hard time thinking alienware originated this. I think they just assigned letters to the symbols and came up with their own code. You could do the same with the caret symbols and switch them around for a completely different code.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Kenray on Oct 25th, 2007, 1:44pm

you know, i have been hitting the economic aspect of this since day 1 of the isaac upload.

Of course the guys over at alienware copied that stuff out of the caret document. I mean, why the hell not? There were people selling stuff left and right with all that art on it, might as well jump in since no copyright holder (black ops) was going to come forth.

Hey, has anybody sent a copy of the primer in to the United States Copyright Office?

Let me go grab a form PR right now!!!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 25th, 2007, 1:50pm

Wanker Woy, now claims I am 'SLIIIIGHTLY" off and wont post his cipher because he/she doesn't want to ruin the fun and risk loosing a trip to NY. The only thing that can be off is the two numbers. Don't know why woy is so bent out of shape about me cracking the code. Obviously I can't be the only one.

I don't care I live in NY what are they going to give me busfare? and they are jerks for either starting a hoax (doubt it) or muddying the waters. Alienare can take their prize and put it where the probes go. grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by drewlac on Oct 25th, 2007, 2:51pm

Hey all, I contacted LMH to hear her spin on this Alienware marketing campaign. Good news is that apparently she's still in touch with Isaac. lol, I guess she didn't like Salad's video either

"This is obviously something generated after the release of the CARET document by Isaac. He notified me of an email address change, but has not released any more information.

There was also a rock video production by German youth, using my podcast illegally and the CARET graphics from my Earthfiles report.
When I asked them to stop disseminating something I had nothing to do with and that they were violating all reasonable and ethical copyright laws, their only answer was: "We aren't charing anything for it so we can use anything from the web we want."

I couldn't believe their attitude - which apparently is the attitude of lots of bullies today in this increasingly harsh and unreasonable world.

Sincerely,

Linda Moulton Howe"
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 25th, 2007, 3:01pm

on Oct 25th, 2007, 2:51pm, drewlac wrote:
Hey all, I contacted LMH to hear her spin on this Alienware marketing campaign. Good news is that apparently she's still in touch with Isaac. lol, I guess she didn't like Salad's video either

"This is obviously something generated after the release of the CARET document by Isaac. He notified me of an email address change, but has not released any more information.

There was also a rock video production by German youth, using my podcast illegally and the CARET graphics from my Earthfiles report.
When I asked them to stop disseminating something I had nothing to do with and that they were violating all reasonable and ethical copyright laws, their only answer was: "We aren't charing anything for it so we can use anything from the web we want."

I couldn't believe their attitude - which apparently is the attitude of lots of bullies today in this increasingly harsh and unreasonable world.

Sincerely,

Linda Moulton Howe"


Thanks for the update, Drew. LMH will be on C2C tonight. Do we have a volunteer to call in and ask for the release of the high rez BB pics and of all Isaac correspondence?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Oct 25th, 2007, 6:49pm

on Oct 25th, 2007, 1:50pm, danblast wrote:
Wanker Woy, now claims I am 'SLIIIIGHTLY" off and wont post his cipher because he/she doesn't want to ruin the fun and risk loosing a trip to NY. The only thing that can be off is the two numbers. Don't know why woy is so bent out of shape about me cracking the code. Obviously I can't be the only one.

I don't care I live in NY what are they going to give me busfare? and they are jerks for either starting a hoax (doubt it) or muddying the waters. Alienare can take their prize and put it where the probes go. grin


Nice job! I am trying to work out the number crack and possibility that several letters may be different than you have so far quickly cracked. The Alienware model numbers are different in sequence structure than fits the listed code break. I will post if have time to complete this evening.
I agree, the Alienware Ad work is just after the fact, not the source....for all the reasons already mentioned. The craft "code" would be jibberish if you apply the Alienware cracked code. So, this changes nothing at all and is of no consequence in my opinion....added publicity...maybe....probably not the kind we really need. Will LMH being taking UFO question during her Sasquatch/Indian Red Rain segmenthuh? She is only on for the 1st hour. Lets keep our eyes on Arizona...we shall see.... wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Gyvor on Oct 25th, 2007, 7:49pm

Don't know if it is of any consequence but there is an employee at Alienware by the name of ISAAC.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Oct 26th, 2007, 12:22am

danblast....After looking at the Alienware characters more closely, it becomes obvious that they are inverted/and/or reversed from many of the actual drone characters. Also, due to the poor resolution, some are not clear, especially the possible number characters. There are also some characters that have no previous context within the "puzzle", so, hard to know what they could represent. The "Area-51" seems clear enough, but the letter/number/number/letter sequences don't seem to correlate to anything I can find anywhere on the Alienware website.....but then again it is late and I am tired and I am not a gamer.....so maybe some of you gamers out there might have ago at it. NO more effort on this one. I hope LMH releases some more info soon.....Night All cool
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by PawnSacrifice on Oct 26th, 2007, 01:58am

I haven't been keeping up to date but just learnt of this Alienware comp. I think it's terrible that a company like that would not think more wisely before using this imagery.

It's situations like this that hinder serious UFO research all over the world. They could at least say where the imagery their using came from. Or admit to being the ones who created it.

I believe UFO investigations are of serious importance and any hoaxers should be held accountable by law. We need to do something to deter these idiots from wasting our time. Any suggestions?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by donkeykong on Oct 26th, 2007, 02:46am

Essentially, a hoax (as annoying as it is) is really just a deformed type of joke. I don't think you can take anyone to court for playing a joke. Maybe if they went to the police and it sparked a big expensive investigation they could be done for wasting police time. But really, that is as far as it goes.

Personally.. I say string them up and burn them, but that is just my opinion smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 26th, 2007, 04:34am

on Oct 26th, 2007, 01:58am, PawnSacrifice wrote:
I believe UFO investigations are of serious importance and any hoaxers should be held accountable by law. We need to do something to deter these idiots from wasting our time. Any suggestions?


It is hard enough getting witnesses to come forward as it is. Consider this: every clear photograph is eventually classified as a hoax by the authorities. Why would anyone come forward if they knew that they would face charges?

Having said that, it would make for some great show trials and martyrs, like the famous trials in the evolution debate which ultimately spurred acceptance of Darwinian evolution. With your name, PawnSacrifice, maybe you could be first cab off the rank?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 26th, 2007, 06:58am

on Oct 26th, 2007, 12:22am, Cogent1 wrote:
danblast....After looking at the Alienware characters more closely, it becomes obvious that they are inverted/and/or reversed from many of the actual drone characters. Also, due to the poor resolution, some are not clear, especially the possible number characters. There are also some characters that have no previous context within the "puzzle", so, hard to know what they could represent. The "Area-51" seems clear enough, but the letter/number/number/letter sequences don't seem to correlate to anything I can find anywhere on the Alienware website.....


If you look at their products... they have a series of Area 51 Mxxxx codes. So I am assuming that is what this part of the code is referring to. I tried to do a search on their site, but I could not find the Area 51 product that seems to be in the code.

Good luck to anyone who wants to find it. wink

Hey danblast, any word back from Alienware yet?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 26th, 2007, 07:04am

on Oct 26th, 2007, 02:46am, donkeykong wrote:
Essentially, a hoax (as annoying as it is) is really just a deformed type of joke. I don't think you can take anyone to court for playing a joke. Maybe if they went to the police and it sparked a big expensive investigation they could be done for wasting police time. But really, that is as far as it goes.

Personally.. I say string them up and burn them, but that is just my opinion smiley



Hi donkeykong! I am glad to see you posting again! I look forward to your input. smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 26th, 2007, 07:20am

Reader on OMF posted this;
Quote:
Now, this is the chance for me, to make those happy, who sit on the other side of the fence:

[ - quote - ]
In an interview with Linda Moulton Howe, who has collected the most reports of witnesses and news about the dronelike objects, with grenzwissenschaft-aktuell.de [the grammar is that bad in the original] the journalist explains, that she herself does not believe, that the actual marketing campaign does present the solution of the riddle: I myself have talked to nearly all the eye-witnesses personally, know their real names, telephone numbers, addresses, identities and professional backgrounds. I know, that those witnesses dont lie and that many witnesses are authentic and they have observed the fotographed objects. Also the CARET documents of Isaac are authentic and hopefully there will be more informations from this source in the future. The marketing campaign of alienware in my opinion uses in the same way the music video on youtube did before the letters and pictograms from the foto serials and the CARNET (sic!) documents as a model for their own interests, without any relation of all this to the real observations.
Moulton Howe adds: Also the various trials of the youtube community, [to recreate; was missing here] the flying objects with CGI (Computer Generated Imagery = by 3D-computergraphics produced pictures) were very important and instructive for they all show, that the real pictures did not proceed like that.
[ - /quote - ]

If Linda talks with German accents, this is my fault. And, of course, retranslation of a translation differs from the original, but I think, the message is clear. The CARNET is obviously a mistake by the author.

If you want to check out the German original, you find it here:
http://grenzwissenschaft-aktuell.blogspot.com/2007/10/bizarre-flugkrper-werbegag-von.html



Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by hjdelight on Oct 26th, 2007, 10:29am

So the question is....who will wait and see and who will throw their hands in the air and walk away? I will wait because much of the AlienWare connection doesn't fit quite right. I think it's been said by someone here, maybe Lat, that they may just have just climbed onboard an existing wave of interest. That makes a lot of sense. Particulary because they sure aren't getting their buck's worth if the financed it. Unless they are pretty stupid which they are not. What a trip this has been either way though!

HJ
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 26th, 2007, 12:25pm

on Oct 26th, 2007, 06:58am, Marvin wrote:
Hey danblast, any word back from Alienware yet?


No, not a peep. And they can't know I'm the one that posted their code, unless they checked the e-mails against the forum members.

I'm glad to see Linda mentioning something about it. The fact that she has spoken to the witnesses, knows their names, addresses etc. Give more credence to the case. But why she is not talking about it more is strange. At least get a dialog with Issac going some Q & A. She seems to just be sitting on this, the only good thing to come out of this alienware stupidity is it made her talk a little.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by BuzZz777 on Oct 26th, 2007, 2:01pm

Alienware's computers look just as daft as the drones cheesy
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 26th, 2007, 3:29pm

on Oct 26th, 2007, 12:25pm, danblast wrote:
No, not a peep. And they can't know I'm the one that posted their code, unless they checked the e-mails against the forum members.

I'm glad to see Linda mentioning something about it. The fact that she has spoken to the witnesses, knows their names, addresses etc. Give more credence to the case. But why she is not talking about it more is strange. At least get a dialog with Issac going some Q & A. She seems to just be sitting on this, the only good thing to come out of this alienware stupidity is it made her talk a little.


Dan,

I disagree with you regarding what you term "alienware stupidity". The more I think about it, the more I like it. I think it's a step closer to the drones/Isaac going mainstream. I'm wondering what the agents are thinking about this. Could they be getting ready to give Dell a call and tell them all government Dell workstation contracts are in jeopardy unless they cease this endeavor?

I think Alienware is with us on the drones. But you have to wonder how far they thought this out. Should they have known the forums would beat the "you know what" out of their code? Maybe it does not matter to them. Maybe they have already accomplished what they set out to do, to send a hidden message that the drones real!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Serach For The Tr
Post by ufonetter on Oct 26th, 2007, 7:18pm

on Oct 20th, 2007, 8:25pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
Excellent work my dear watson. wink



Who is watson? And what kind of work does he do?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Ufocatcher on Oct 26th, 2007, 7:30pm

He,s the guy that invented the the net launcher. lipsrsealed
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by ufonetter on Oct 26th, 2007, 7:39pm

on Oct 26th, 2007, 7:30pm, Ufocatcher wrote:
He,s the guy that invented the the net launcher. lipsrsealed


See that is where you are WRONG. I am the guy who invented the net launcher.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by TeachersPet on Oct 26th, 2007, 8:34pm

on Oct 26th, 2007, 3:29pm, Latitude wrote:
Dan,

I disagree with you regarding what you term "alienware stupidity". The more I think about it, the more I like it. I think it's a step closer to the drones/Isaac going mainstream. I'm wondering what the agents are thinking about this. Could they be getting ready to give Dell a call and tell them all government Dell workstation contracts are in jeopardy unless they cease this endeavor?

I think Alienware is with us on the drones. But you have to wonder how far they thought this out. Should they have known the forums would beat the "you know what" out of their code? Maybe it does not matter to them. Maybe they have already accomplished what they set out to do, to send a hidden message that the drones real!



I agree Latitude..they had several mesages but ultimately its an implementation of dell Philosophy about community responsibility we are all one..about the Earth..if you check dells site they really are waist deep into corporate social responsibility and inclusion of partners and customers in it, virtual island, idea storm, etc .they probably collaborated with community artists and so on on this thing. imo

Ps Dell also has a model series called the Lattitude .smiley.I have been pretty happy with most of their products.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 26th, 2007, 11:49pm

Hey, I've been wrong before. Maybe something good will come out of this alienware stuff.

Did anyone catch lindas show? Did she address the drone issue or avoid it?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by turkoman on Oct 27th, 2007, 10:51am

Since the forum has a 'ghosts and hauntings' section, I think it is worth pointing out that there is a vague chance that drones are responsible for such phenomena. They might record events and play them back later as slides or whatever. Of course most such things are indoors so it isn't the best explanation I ever came up with.

On the other hand, for all the centuries people have been talking about ghosts, what do we really have in the way of hard knowledge - nothing really, so I don't have a lot to go on.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Oct 27th, 2007, 11:41am

on Oct 26th, 2007, 8:34pm, TeachersPet wrote:
Ps Dell also has a model series called the Lattitude .smiley.I have been pretty happy with most of their products.


Yeah! I have one sitting right here. But that's not where I took my handle from. It was only a coincidence.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by danblast on Oct 29th, 2007, 07:17am

Wow two days and no ones posted! Is this thread dead? Did anyone listen to Linda's show?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by jugement on Oct 29th, 2007, 09:07am

its kinda boring to keep repeating over and over the same,bound to hapen danblast,until something new comes long that we have not decussed the drones wil remain idle.thats for us started day one with the enigma. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 29th, 2007, 09:11am

November Issue:

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/Magazine.html

Happy Halloween to you all

VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Merlin on Oct 29th, 2007, 11:08am

I think it's going to be a little slow in here until some new information comes to light. undecided


We may be making some changes to spice up the Drone discussion as it does seem to be getting a little stale, The current format has been done to death therefore change is needed. I will shortly post a poll on what you would like to see changes, after all it's you guys who have made this thread and your ideas and suggestions are important.
We will take into account all constructive suggestions and ideas so if you have an idea you think would work please post them, not here but in the new ideas thread.



Merlin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Oct 29th, 2007, 12:04pm

on Oct 29th, 2007, 09:11am, VonStern wrote:
November Issue:

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/Magazine.html

Happy Halloween to you all

VonStern


Thanks for the always interesting info. Nice to see you posting again. Question: If the drones were levitated sonically, would there be ground disruption or some detectable signature below them? Also, would sonic propulsion cause any unusual atmospheric effects....optical distortion, ionic trails etc...?
.....Cogito, ergo miro... wink
May the good spirits be with you as well smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 29th, 2007, 1:06pm

on Oct 29th, 2007, 12:04pm, Cogent1 wrote:
Thanks for the always interesting info. Nice to see you posting again. Question: If the drones were levitated sonically, would there be ground disruption or some detectable signature below them? Also, would sonic propulsion cause any unusual atmospheric effects....optical distortion, ionic trails etc...?
.....Cogito, ergo miro... wink
May the good spirits be with you as well smiley


Thank you for the kind words, it's good to know my information is used... cheesy

If, and I say IF the Drones are using sonic levitation, there will be resonance in the ground below, depending of the wavelength applied. If you put your ear to the ground like the native Indian Americans did, when they wanted to know if horses were approaching, you should be able to know if a drone is near by. Provided they use wavelength you can hear.

All this is pure speculation, but if they do, some sound should be heard, I suggest use of an instrument capable of detecting sounds outside our human spectrum.

It has been mentioned, that the use of Microwave might be in hand here, especially when talking about the CropCircle connection...maybe the use of this also is responsible for the levitation and the propulsion?

It is absolutely possible, that there will be traces in both light and sound frequencies...but it has to be detected by an istrument, as we probably can't hear or see the waves in use.

If we knew if the eyewitnesses felt the resonance in their chest like loud music, vibrations, when they were exposed to the Drones, we would have something to work on.

I hope this answers some of your questions,

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Oct 30th, 2007, 10:29am

on Oct 29th, 2007, 09:11am, VonStern wrote:
November Issue:

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/Magazine.html

VonStern


Good job on your magazine Von Stern. I am glad that everyone took off with the whole "sound" subject. Roh and I had mentioned this several times early on about the Octal switch and Octal numbering system and how music is in Octaves. I really think there is a connection there with how the drones operate. And at first it really excited me.

And that video of the vibrating plates that change geometric shapes with each note played amazes me every time I think about it. To me, as a Christian it shows even more the amazing things that God created. And the creative power of sound. The bible says that God spoke, and the world was created. he SAID let there by light and there was light. The power of sound and language is a creative force. The bible also says that "life and death are in the power of the tongue." And that we can either bless or curse someone with what we speak. We can create or destroy with the sounds and words that come out of our mouths.

So, if the "aliens" have figured out how to use sound coupled with language as a force for manipulating time, space, gravity, and more.... then they have tapped into the very intricate "force" that God created with sound.

It's why God warns us in the bible to make sure our heart is right with him because "out of our mouth flow the issues of the heart."

Why am I saying all of this? Because the root of the whole issue of sound and language having power is rooted in God and his mysteries. Any race must be careful how they use it. In fact, I would go so far as to say that this mystery of God's creation is not necessarily something he wants us to delve too far into.... as the more I studied this here recently the more it pointed to witchcraft and other evil studies throughout history. Satan knows of the mysteries of God more than we. So far it seems only evil sects have tried to utilize this 'power' which makes me really want to stand off.

I think that through science we too can achieve great things using this mystery power, I just don't think it's God's will for us to do so. There were some things forbidden for us to know... like when God told Adam and Eve not to eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. This knowledge that we have discovered about the drones is possibly part of this very knowledge we were to never know about. This brings me to conclusions that alien races that use this type of technology could possibly be evil races of aliens operating out of the will of God.

I am sure there are those of you here that will disagree or will ridicule....and that's OK. I am confident enough with my knowledge of God and what his heart is based on the amount of time I spend WITH him in conversations, in prayer, in church, in intimate worship, in reading the word of God to know that I am on the right track here. I cannot pretend to know someone that I have not spent time with. And, I am not 100% sure about this... it's just a strong feeling that I have -- and while I was researching the sound/geometry/power thing it led to a dark path and different websites that led away from God not to him.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 30th, 2007, 8:30pm

on Oct 29th, 2007, 09:11am, VonStern wrote:
November Issue:

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/Magazine.html

Happy Halloween to you all

VonStern



Thank you from the heart, VonStern. The powerful sound (of music was awesome!!!). wink

Thank you for sharing!

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by nekitamo on Oct 31st, 2007, 03:10am

on Oct 30th, 2007, 10:29am, castles4me wrote:
...I am glad that everyone took off with the whole "sound" subject. Roh and I had mentioned this several times early on about the Octal switch and Octal numbering system and how music is in Octaves. I really think there is a connection there with how the drones operate. And at first it really excited me.

...

I am sure there are those of you here that will disagree or will ridicule...

No ridicule here, just disagreement.

If you think that drones are of alien origin, the first thing you should get rid of are human conventions, as they are probably unusable for analysis of something truly alien. Musical octave is simply one such convention, (miss)naming an interval between two tones, as you can see here - Quote:
As well as being used to describe the relationship between two notes, the word is also used when speaking of a range of notes that fall between a pair an octave apart. In the diatonic scale, and the other standard heptatonic scales of Western music, this is 8 notes if one counts both ends, hence the name "octave", from the Latin octavus, from octo (meaning "eight"). In the chromatic scale, this is 13 notes counting both ends, although traditionally, one speaks of 12 notes of the chromatic scale, since there are 12 intervals. Other scales may have a different number of notes covering the range of an octave, such as the Arabic classical scale with 17, 19, or even 24 notes, but the word "octave" is still used.

So by convention, we mainly use the 12 tone chromatic musical scale and call it an 'octave'. No real link to octal numbering system, unless you tend to ignore black keys at your piano? smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Oct 31st, 2007, 07:01am

The eight notes likely have a very human tie in due to the ancient instruments and using human hands to play them you use 8 fingers for the notes and your opposable thumbs are used to help hold the instrument. The word Octave comes from old Latin (of the old Roman times) meaning the eighth. Therefore it would seem any relationship would not be as direct one would think, but instead it is being inferred or assumed, due to your frame of reference. In music, the Octave is not as straight forward as some may think (there are changes and rules), so I would doubt is it universal as some would think.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Oct 31st, 2007, 08:39am

well music is universal and there are 8 main notes -- yes, there are flats and sharps, but 8 main pitches that create one octave. C D E F G A B C
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Oct 31st, 2007, 10:57am

Check this out from Foxnews 10/31/07

British defense researchers have invented an invisible tank or at least a way to make a tank invisible.
London's Daily Mail, Daily Telegraph and Sun all report on tests conducted by the Ministry of Defence last week in which a tank rolled across a field, completely invisible to observers standing at a certain point.

"This technology is incredible," an unnamed soldier was quoted by the Daily Mail and Sun. "If I hadn't been present I wouldn't have believed it. I looked across the fields and just saw grass and trees but in reality I was staring down the barrel of a tank gun."

Before bloggers start making comparisons to Harry Potter and Romulan spacecraft, it must be noted that the "technology" relies on heavy use of camera and projectors.
Basically, a camera films the background, which is then projected upon a special surface applied to something in the foreground in this case, a tank.

One person was willing to go on the record in all three British newspaper stories theoretical physicist Sir John Pendry of Imperial College London, one of the world's leading experts on surface reflectivity and lead author of a widely reported paper last year that said a "cloak of invisibility" would theoretically be possible.

"The drawback at the moment is the dependence upon cameras and projectors," the Sun quoted Pendry, who did not confirm an implied connection with the defense project. "The next stage is to make the tank invisible without them which is intricate and complicated, but possible."

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Takabb on Oct 31st, 2007, 11:47am

I'm just found this ufo photo on UM Gallery. I think it look like drone craft from Big Basin.

User Image
All info about this picture is just the name of this picture "ufo_2ss3_Motion_Blur.jpg". Do you think this is another drone picture or fake?

Anyway, Hello to everyone is this boardcheesy

SOURCE: http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/gallery/displayimage.php?album=lastup&cat=0&pos=7
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Oct 31st, 2007, 12:58pm

User Image

here it is -- it looks like one taken from a car window. Awesome find. BUT -- it says shadowdemon666 was the album it came from... reminds me a little too much of leviathan666. I am signing up for an account there, you have to have an account to view that album.

Will let you know what I find out.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 31st, 2007, 1:45pm

on Oct 31st, 2007, 11:47am, Takabb wrote:
I'm just found this ufo photo on UM Gallery. I think it look like drone craft from Big Basin.

User Image
All info about this picture is just the name of this picture "ufo_2ss3_Motion_Blur.jpg". Do you think this is another drone picture or fake?

Anyway, Hello to everyone is this boardcheesy

SOURCE: http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/gallery/displayimage.php?album=lastup&cat=0&pos=7


Welcome, Takabb! Thank you for posting!

Any input here will be investigated, regardless of origin.

Please hang on, the investigators in here will prove/disprove your finding! cheesy

VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 31st, 2007, 1:58pm

on Oct 31st, 2007, 08:39am, castles4me wrote:
well music is universal and there are 8 main notes -- yes, there are flats and sharps, but 8 main pitches that create one octave. C D E F G A B C


Castles4me, you know that the tone we all go for when tuning our musical instrument is the "Chambertone" (Which should be "A" in the middle range). Actually, a Violin has more than 1000 frequencies that lies in between the used normal range of octaves. It's not used because it would sound "out of tune" .

Have you ever considered, when a musical instrument goes "out of tune" is because it does not meet the standard rules of the music played from the sheet?

I play too, you know....and if I don't, my player piano does it for me....!!

I do not usually do this, but to make my point, I'll post this
video of my own Player Piano, a Hupfeld-Roenish Phonola 1925:

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/Gabe/Gabe_2007.wmv

It's well out of tune, but it still performs. If a piano tuner was to tune it, it would sound "right" to us...

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Oct 31st, 2007, 2:23pm

on Oct 31st, 2007, 12:58pm, castles4me wrote:
User Image

here it is -- it looks like one taken from a car window. Awesome find. BUT -- it says shadowdemon666 was the album it came from... reminds me a little too much of leviathan666. I am signing up for an account there, you have to have an account to view that album.

Will let you know what I find out.


I will begin an analysis on this one and post when complete. Anyone find any other source info on this one or has anybody seen it on other sites/forums, etc. At least it is something new to check out....as usual, wish we could get originals?
I'll let you know when I have something. smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Oct 31st, 2007, 2:25pm

on Oct 31st, 2007, 1:58pm, VonStern wrote:
Castles4me, you know that the tone we all go for when tuning our musical instrument is the "Chambertone" (Which should be "A" in the middle range). Actually, a Violin has more than 1000 frequencies that lies in between the used normal range of octaves. It's not used because it would sound "out of tune" .

Have you ever considered, when a musical instrument goes "out of tune" is because it does not meet the standard rules of the music played from the sheet?

I play too, you know....and if I don't, my player piano does it for me....!!

I do not usually do this, but to make my point, I'll post this
video of my own Player Piano, a Hupfeld-Roenish Phonola 1925:

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/Gabe/Gabe_2007.wmv

It's well out of tune, but it still performs. If a piano tuner was to tune it, it would sound "right" to us...

--VonStern


yeah, I just used C as an example of the 8-pitch whole step octave scale.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Oct 31st, 2007, 2:34pm

on Oct 31st, 2007, 2:25pm, castles4me wrote:
yeah, I just used C as an example of the 8-pitch whole step octave scale.


Nothing wrong by doing this, I just wanted to make clear, that there is much more to music than meets the ear! If we considered all waves coming from an untuned musical instrument we would expirience a whole lot more bizarre music! grin

You know, we are used to listen to music in the standards of the 17'th and 18'th Century!

Tell that to the heavy metal bands! wink

You are not that wrong afterall... grin

All the best,

VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Oct 31st, 2007, 3:25pm

on Oct 31st, 2007, 12:58pm, castles4me wrote:
here it is -- it looks like one taken from a car window. Awesome find. BUT -- it says shadowdemon666 was the album it came from... reminds me a little too much of leviathan666. I am signing up for an account there, you have to have an account to view that album.

Will let you know what I find out.


Ok, the poster, Demonmonkey says he took it from out of a classroom window in San Antonio. I am trying to obtain the original photo. He can't remember the date, but I asked him to try and find out. I also invited him to register here with us and post. Have sent another message, will let you know what he says.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Oct 31st, 2007, 5:33pm

Demonmonkey wrote:

Quote:
Sorry i forgot to add the details, I took this picture, i was at school here in San Antonio i dont remember the date. my camera was about to die so i took it in a rush. i was sitting in class and i looked out the window seeing this odd shaped craft, i thougth it was a new type of plane.

I know ive seen the big basin pics there crazy. theres also a a video on youtube but i think someone recreated it it asome to watch

That is the original pic my camera is weird it doesnt have the dates on it lol sorry. That is the only pic it took and the only time i saw it. It never dame back again.


Will let you know what else I find out. I have invited him here.

But... also DrDil he could have been in summer school or some kind of technical school also.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Oct 31st, 2007, 5:53pm

on Oct 31st, 2007, 5:33pm, castles4me wrote:
Will let you know what else I find out. I have invited him here.

That's what I like about you Castles, you always see the good in people!! smiley

EDIT: It's all yours. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by newtothis on Oct 31st, 2007, 10:08pm

on Oct 31st, 2007, 3:25pm, castles4me wrote:
Ok, the poster, Demonmonkey says he took it from out of a classroom window in San Antonio. I am trying to obtain the original photo. He can't remember the date, but I asked him to try and find out. I also invited him to register here with us and post. Have sent another message, will let you know what he says.


Very nice find Takabb! shocked
Castles, holy crap! 3 and 1/2 hours to find the source! What took you so long! wink Very nice! And in San Antonio...
*As I wait patiently for some analysis from the superstars!*
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Oct 31st, 2007, 10:23pm

well the guys at OMF didn't waste any time suggesting this new photo ahoax..... they found another site by shadowdemon666
http://arthur.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/browse.php?user_id=126782

leviathan? or similar?

I don't know...

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by newtothis on Oct 31st, 2007, 10:25pm

on Oct 31st, 2007, 10:23pm, castles4me wrote:
well the guys at OMF didn't waste any time proving this new photo ahoax..... they found another site by shadowdemon666
http://arthur.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/browse.php?user_id=126782

leviathan? or similar


Eh! Just saw that... Well, another hoax shot down in hours, what does that say about the original drone pics?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Oct 31st, 2007, 11:13pm

on Oct 31st, 2007, 10:25pm, newtothis wrote:
Eh! Just saw that... Well, another hoax shot down in hours, what does that say about the original drone pics?



yeah I thought that 666 thing was just too coincidental. But, I was trying to give the benefit of the doubt. If it is Lev why give clues like Texas and 666 ? Just to ruffle his own feathers? Either that or there is two of them out there LOL. Or, maybe shadow is part of the "group"

But I don't know... he did tell me his real name in PM on the Unexplained mysteries site -- the same name he signs his photos with on Renderosity site. Francisco.

could it be he took the photo out of a window for real then did a recreation of it two days later? August 6 is when the blur photo was posted, then august 8 the rendering.

Who knows??
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by newtothis on Nov 1st, 2007, 12:16am

Wouldn't surprise me if it was Lev or a kid trying to test his skills!

My question is: Does each fake drone picture, or cgi copy that is proven fake within hours, strengthen the case of the originals to be real or hurt it?

Some have been obvious, some not so obvious... But each has been shot down expeditiously!






Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Nov 1st, 2007, 12:31am

on Nov 1st, 2007, 12:16am, newtothis wrote:
Wouldn't surprise me if it was Lev or a kid trying to test his skills!

My question is: Does each fake drone picture, or cgi copy that is proven fake within hours, strengthen the case of the originals to be real or hurt it?

Some have been obvious, some not so obvious... But each has been shot down expeditiously!



I would say strengthens the case to be real.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by hjdelight on Nov 1st, 2007, 12:38am

Obviously it bolsters the case for it being real. Everyone seems to be able to discern a fake....whereas with the originals it's a split decision. And, I might add, there will always be a percentage of debunkers no matter what.

HJ
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by jugement on Nov 1st, 2007, 08:57am

i said that the drones builders are reptilians,i wrote about this way back my tread 2,or 3.personaly i think the drones have sothing to do with hollow earth,since the retilians been here and no one has been able to spot them,my guess would be like many others, that drones are surveying iner earth for problems that the hollow earths ocupants only know about,thats always been my take on the drones and whom made them and part of the work the drones do,besides being a type of stargate like the bigbasin craft. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Nov 1st, 2007, 4:40pm

on Oct 31st, 2007, 12:58pm, castles4me wrote:
User Image

here it is -- it looks like one taken from a car window. Awesome find. BUT -- it says shadowdemon666 was the album it came from... reminds me a little too much of leviathan666. I am signing up for an account there, you have to have an account to view that album.

Will let you know what I find out.


Castles (and anyone else)....I have read all the posts after this one and looked at the Renderosity website. I have a few questions, if you have time. First, other than the "666" /Lev inferred connection/designation, how has this one been proven fake? Is demonmonkey the same person as shadowdemon666? (to the best of your knowledge) Also, the 2 images on Renderosity are not the same image as the one posted here on casebook. The Aug 8th image is obviously a render, the other supposed photograph is at a different angle and the "drone" is in a different position both in viewing angle and placement relative to the blue CArMax awning in the background. The large structure is a Car Max used car dealership. The photo of at least the background (if this is a fake)is probably taken from a muliti-story office building, as the height and reflected ceiling light patterns fits with commercial building lighting patterns I have seen before. Also, the San Antonio Independent School District had the first day of class on Aug 14th....after the photo was taken and the render was done. Could have been taken from a "Trade School" as many of them are housed in multi-story commercial office buildings. Another problem I see is this; demonmonkey said he took only 1 picture and the camera died.....how can we have 2 different images of the same scene then? The casebook image and then the supposed photo image on Renderosity. I also did a quick filter analysis and the photo image in casebook is not embedded nor a layered composite....could still be cgi, but blurry and without the original file impossible to say for sure. While it looks like the BB craft, the "plumb-bob" at the bottom seems longer and the vertical curved "attenae" structure on the top seems more closed at the top than the BB craft. The photo was taken from an office/classroom at 3611 Fountainhead Drive, San Antonio TX.....CarMax right across the street!!! Compliments of Google Satellite Maps. There is only one CarMax in San Antonio. So, conclusion possibilities based on our small amount of information; location is real/craft is real, location is real/photo of craft is faked, location is real/craft is real, but somehow inserted into image. My biggest question is still; if he took only 1 picture...how can we have 2 different views....unless one is faked using the original. I hope this helps a bit smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Nov 1st, 2007, 4:46pm

Note: The 3611 Fountainhead Drive address is the CarMax address, the office building/classroom address is unknown, but across the street. Just to be clear. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Truether on Nov 1st, 2007, 6:40pm

An interesting place: http://www.livyatan.blogspot.com/
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Nov 1st, 2007, 7:29pm

Possible drone sighting in Tomball, TX area. Below is a report from the National UFO Reporting Center I just came across:

Sighting Report
Occurred : 7/19/2007 05:10 (Entered as : 07/19/2007 05:10)
Reported: 7/20/2007 1:01:30 PM 13:01
Posted: 8/7/2007
Location: Tomball, TX
Shape: Other
Duration:10 seconds
Object seen in cloudy sky over Tomball

Here is what I saw on July 19th, 2007.

I was on the way home from work in Tomball, Texas. At the intersection of F.M. 249 and Hicks St., I noticed an object flying rather low and at a slow speed. At first glance it appeared to be a small airplane or maybe a news chopper. But after a few seconds of observation, I noticed that the brown to rusty colored object was indeed a new sight to me! We have had rain every day for about two weeks and it was very cloudy, so the object only appeared briefly (about ten seconds) and was gone behind the clouds. The shape is hard to explain, but for lack of a better term, it resembled an upside down helicopter!

Only there was more to it. A vertical shaft with the lower part of the shaft being slimmer and attached to a horizontal section. Toward the top of it, there were two more horizontal sections. One on each side appearing like wings. Nothing was spinning or making noise or [color=Yellow]blinking-no lights.
[/color]Which all contradicts most sightings I have read about in the last day! It was a brief but exciting experience for me and the first of its kind for me.

I have found no way to identify it yet, but I will always remember the way it looked and the movement of this object! The one other fact the interests me is that the sighting was directly above the Grand Parkway that is being built because it is a huge undertaking that will take years to finish and maybe it was some sort of observation?! I dont know, but I have just learned to keep my eye to the sky more often!
See what you think. cool
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Nov 1st, 2007, 7:38pm

on Nov 1st, 2007, 6:40pm, Truether wrote:
An interesting place: http://www.livyatan.blogspot.com/



Interesting? I dont know if I need a frontal lobotomy or a bottle in front of me. It is an angry place.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Nov 1st, 2007, 8:49pm

on Nov 1st, 2007, 4:46pm, Cogent1 wrote:
Note: The 3611 Fountainhead Drive address is the CarMax address, the office building/classroom address is unknown, but across the street. Just to be clear. wink


as soon as the guys at OMF figured this photo out to be fake and such.... Lev with his new nic at OMF nic654 sent me strange PMs and the supposed shadowdemon666 never answered me again in PM at unexplained mysteries or in email.

I think it is pretty safe to say that either they are one in the same person or part of the quote unquote "group"

I think you answered your own question.... if he said he only took one photo and there is two different angles, obviously it's a fake. Plus he named the photo motion blur.... a technical term for that style of blur for rendering.

we can close the casebook on this one.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by castles4me on Nov 1st, 2007, 8:51pm

on Nov 1st, 2007, 7:29pm, Cogent1 wrote:
Possible drone sighting in Tomball, TX area. Below is a report from the National UFO Reporting Center I just came across:

Sighting Report
Occurred : 7/19/2007 05:10 (Entered as : 07/19/2007 05:10)
Reported: 7/20/2007 1:01:30 PM 13:01
Posted: 8/7/2007
Location: Tomball, TX
Shape: Other
Duration:10 seconds
Object seen in cloudy sky over Tomball

Here is what I saw on July 19th, 2007.

I was on the way home from work in Tomball, Texas. At the intersection of F.M. 249 and Hicks St., I noticed an object flying rather low and at a slow speed. At first glance it appeared to be a small airplane or maybe a news chopper. But after a few seconds of observation, I noticed that the brown to rusty colored object was indeed a new sight to me! We have had rain every day for about two weeks and it was very cloudy, so the object only appeared briefly (about ten seconds) and was gone behind the clouds. The shape is hard to explain, but for lack of a better term, it resembled an upside down helicopter!

Only there was more to it. A vertical shaft with the lower part of the shaft being slimmer and attached to a horizontal section. Toward the top of it, there were two more horizontal sections. One on each side appearing like wings. Nothing was spinning or making noise or [color=Yellow]blinking-no lights.
[/color]Which all contradicts most sightings I have read about in the last day! It was a brief but exciting experience for me and the first of its kind for me.

I have found no way to identify it yet, but I will always remember the way it looked and the movement of this object! The one other fact the interests me is that the sighting was directly above the Grand Parkway that is being built because it is a huge undertaking that will take years to finish and maybe it was some sort of observation?! I dont know, but I have just learned to keep my eye to the sky more often!
See what you think. cool


that does sound like a drone... I wonder if we could get in touch with this person. I don't live too far from Tomball smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Nov 2nd, 2007, 03:45am

on Nov 1st, 2007, 8:49pm, castles4me wrote:
as soon as the guys at OMF figured this photo out to be fake and such.... Lev with his new nic at OMF nic654 sent me strange PMs and the supposed shadowdemon666 never answered me again in PM at unexplained mysteries or in email.

I think it is pretty safe to say that either they are one in the same person or part of the quote unquote "group"

I think you answered your own question.... if he said he only took one photo and there is two different angles, obviously it's a fake. Plus he named the photo motion blur.... a technical term for that style of blur for rendering.

we can close the casebook on this one.


User Image


grin wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by drewlac on Nov 2nd, 2007, 05:33am

on Nov 1st, 2007, 7:29pm, Cogent1 wrote:
Possible drone sighting in Tomball, TX area. Below is a report from the National UFO Reporting


Nice find Cogent1! Certain sounds dronish.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Nov 2nd, 2007, 5:49pm

on Nov 2nd, 2007, 12:05pm, elevenaugust wrote:
LEV EYE IS WATCHING YOU
grin


That image was from a comment I posted yesterday on why I thought that recent image was a fake, but Castles invited the, Creator, into the forum so I removed my comment/conclusions regarding the Exif data, school holidays etc. so as no to, Rock The Boat and of course so as not to risk revealing what we already knew.

Now Castles is in agreement I thought Id re-post one of the images from the comment, Im pleased you liked it although it is something of a testament to the mighty, Leviathan Group that you recognised the Leviathan eye instantly!!

(The text accompanying the image was as follows)

Quote:
Lev loved doing stuff like this, who can forget the Drone allegedly photographed out of the car window, looks like the same sort of approach, those two images are at the bottom (with Levs, Third eye in between them.)

User Image


Also at the top of the images there are two smaller fake Drones, again courtesy of Lev, this is all only my opinion of course but I dont hold out much hope undecided

(I'm not saying it is Lev just that it's similar to his Modus Operandi)


The only reason I re-posted this comment is that the image when viewed alone seems like an attack on Lev and it wasn't, it was a comparison......
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Nov 3rd, 2007, 10:54am

I just want to throw in some sense:

The drones are real!

Isaac noticed the link from the photo's that it was what he's been working on...in the 80'th.

Either we believe him, judging that this is what is at hand here, or we dismiss HE's credability?

Do we have a case, really, if it wasn't for his revelations?

Any new sightings will be in that relief, looking for similarities, according to the evidence Isaac provided.

I believe that if he didn't see the link, or if he never told us what HE knew about this, we would't be the wiser.

It'll be arrogant to disprove Isaac at this stage, regardless what moderators tell you.

No one has proved to this date, that he is wrong.

Therefore, my point - we have to work on the link he wanted us to work on...

To gather all possible intelligence, theories and speculations...and not just dismiss the fact, that we actually have been given the fact, that HE saw, what was what HE knew for a fact!!

Just my humble opinion,

VonStern


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Nov 3rd, 2007, 6:23pm

on Nov 1st, 2007, 7:29pm, Cogent1 wrote:
Possible drone sighting in Tomball, TX area. Below is a report from the National UFO Reporting Center I just came across:

Sighting Report
Occurred : 7/19/2007 05:10 (Entered as : 07/19/2007 05:10)
Reported: 7/20/2007 1:01:30 PM 13:01
Posted: 8/7/2007
Location: Tomball, TX
Shape: Other
Duration:10 seconds
Object seen in cloudy sky over Tomball

Here is what I saw on July 19th, 2007.

I was on the way home from work in Tomball, Texas. At the intersection of F.M. 249 and Hicks St., I noticed an object flying rather low and at a slow speed. At first glance it appeared to be a small airplane or maybe a news chopper. But after a few seconds of observation, I noticed that the brown to rusty colored object was indeed a new sight to me! We have had rain every day for about two weeks and it was very cloudy, so the object only appeared briefly (about ten seconds) and was gone behind the clouds. The shape is hard to explain, but for lack of a better term, it resembled an upside down helicopter!

Only there was more to it. A vertical shaft with the lower part of the shaft being slimmer and attached to a horizontal section. Toward the top of it, there were two more horizontal sections. One on each side appearing like wings. Nothing was spinning or making noise or [color=Yellow]blinking-no lights.
[/color]Which all contradicts most sightings I have read about in the last day! It was a brief but exciting experience for me and the first of its? kind for me.

I have found no way to identify it yet, but I will always remember the way it looked and the movement of this object! The one other fact the interests me is that the sighting was directly above the Grand Parkway that is being built because it is a huge undertaking that will take years to finish and maybe it was some sort of observation?! I don?t know, but I have just learned to keep my eye to the sky more often!
See what you think. cool


Thanks for the report and your interest in this subject!

Sounds very much like a Drone to me. Excellent sighting!

The length of time, the color, the movement, the shape, it all might add up to one thing.........a Drone.

The two points that intrigue me the most are the COLOR & the short time observation of the object.

Dougster
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Nov 3rd, 2007, 6:26pm

on Nov 3rd, 2007, 10:54am, VonStern wrote:
I just want to throw in some sense:

The drones are real!

Isaac noticed the link from the photo's that it was what he's been working on...in the 80'th.

Either we believe him, judging that this is what is at hand here, or we dismiss HE's credability?

Do we have a case, really, if it wasn't for his revelations?

Any new sightings will be in that relief, looking for similarities, according to the evidence Isaac provided.

I believe that if he didn't see the link, or if he never told us what HE knew about this, we would't be the wiser.

It'll be arrogant to disprove Isaac at this stage, regardless what moderators tell you.

No one has proved to this date, that he is wrong.

Therefore, my point - we have to work on the link he wanted us to work on...

To gather all possible intelligence, theories and speculations...and not just dismiss the fact, that we actually have been given the fact, that HE saw, what was what HE knew for a fact!!

Just my humble opinion,

VonStern



Are the drones real? IMO, YES. Very real.

You may know that Isaac recently notified LMH of his new email address.

Always good to see your reports.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Nov 3rd, 2007, 8:02pm

on Nov 3rd, 2007, 6:23pm, urantia606 wrote:
Thanks for the report and your interest in this subject!

Sounds very much like a Drone to me. Excellent sighting!

The length of time, the color, the movement, the shape, it all might add up to one thing.........a Drone.

The two points that intrigue me the most are the COLOR & the short time observation of the object.

Dougster


Dougster....Thanks alot. I am waiting for an e-mail back from Peter Davenport at NUFORC. I hope he has the name and contact number of the witness....and is willing to forward to me if OK with the witness. I happen to live very near Tomball, so I will interview the witness if possible. Will relate any new info here at casebook. I have had 2 other sightings (not Drones) myself here in the Tomball area since May 2007, both during the day. So, I thinkl the overall activity is increasing in this part of Texas. I continue to look for new drone sightings worldwide...but none that don't appear to be fakes so far....but always on the look out for something new to check out grin
Just FYI, I have been investigating UFO's for 30 years now and been following the Drones since May 2007....was just a lurker here for a long time. Some really good people here at casebook, BJ runs a very professional operation.....unlike many other boards I have seen. I'll be in touch when I have new info. Take care.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Nov 3rd, 2007, 8:16pm

on Nov 3rd, 2007, 10:54am, VonStern wrote:
I just want to throw in some sense:

The drones are real!

Isaac noticed the link from the photo's that it was what he's been working on...in the 80'th.

Either we believe him, judging that this is what is at hand here, or we dismiss HE's credability?

Do we have a case, really, if it wasn't for his revelations?

Any new sightings will be in that relief, looking for similarities, according to the evidence Isaac provided.

I believe that if he didn't see the link, or if he never told us what HE knew about this, we would't be the wiser.

It'll be arrogant to disprove Isaac at this stage, regardless what moderators tell you.

No one has proved to this date, that he is wrong.

Therefore, my point - we have to work on the link he wanted us to work on...

To gather all possible intelligence, theories and speculations...and not just dismiss the fact, that we actually have been given the fact, that HE saw, what was what HE knew for a fact!!

Just my humble opinion,

VonStern



VonStern....nice to hear from you again smiley I agree, I think the drones are real also.....but I don't think they have been "reverse" engineered by U.S. or BLACK gov't....I don't think we have a control interface for this "language" based on other things I have seen in many other cases. If these craft are reverse engineered....it could not be without direct help from a Type 2 civilization or higher....we are currently a Type 0....on the verge of becoming a Type 1....this is the most dangerous time for all Earth civilizations in our global history.....we are all very lucky to be living during this time. Let's hope we can come out the other side as a Type 1 and not a Type "Null".....it would be a shame to waste all that perfectly good beer grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by hjdelight on Nov 3rd, 2007, 8:45pm

grin Lol!

HJ
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Nov 3rd, 2007, 11:30pm

on Nov 1st, 2007, 7:29pm, Cogent1 wrote:
Possible drone sighting in Tomball, TX area. Below is a report from the National UFO Reporting Center I just came across:


First, kudos to Cogent1 for bringing this to the forum! smiley

Upside down helicopter that had wings that did not spin. That could be a drone. Rusty brown? Only the BB drone could have been brown or different shades of brown. The other drones were more an off white. Still, it could be a drone we have not yet seen pics of. But what bothers me about this sighting is it makes no mention of the birdcage wires/spikes at the top. All the drones did have that characteristic. It could be the witness saw the drone from an angle that kept him from seeing the spikes.

If only the witness could see the drone pics to see if they are a match or similar.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Nov 4th, 2007, 01:16am

on Nov 3rd, 2007, 11:30pm, Latitude wrote:
First, kudos to Cogent1 for bringing this to the forum! smiley

Upside down helicopter that had wings that did not spin. That could be a drone. Rusty brown? Only the BB drone could have been brown or different shades of brown. The other drones were more an off white. Still, it could be a drone we have not yet seen pics of. But what bothers me about this sighting is it makes no mention of the birdcage wires/spikes at the top. All the drones did have that characteristic. It could be the witness saw the drone from an angle that kept him from seeing the spikes.

If only the witness could see the drone pics to see if they are a match or similar.


Thanks Lat....If Peter gets me the contact info, I plan to do just that when I interview the witness. I don't want to bias the witness, so I will have the person give me a drawing first as best they can, before I show them any pictures. I will also get as much info as possible before we look at any of the Drone images. It is too easy to psychologically "load" their description and testimony if given any information prior to their recounting the experience. I will let everyone know as this developes. cool
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Nov 4th, 2007, 8:07pm

on Nov 3rd, 2007, 11:30pm, Latitude wrote:
First, kudos to Cogent1 for bringing this to the forum! smiley

Upside down helicopter that had wings that did not spin. That could be a drone. Rusty brown? Only the BB drone could have been brown or different shades of brown. The other drones were more an off white. Still, it could be a drone we have not yet seen pics of. But what bothers me about this sighting is it makes no mention of the birdcage wires/spikes at the top. All the drones did have that characteristic. It could be the witness saw the drone from an angle that kept him from seeing the spikes.

If only the witness could see the drone pics to see if they are a match or similar.


Due to the cloaking device forcefield, the birdcage wires on top are sometimes not entirely visible.

One wonders what may have caused the cloaking to be interrupted for a few seconds.

Just a thought.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Nov 6th, 2007, 08:26am

French researcher Henri Lhote found this cavepainting in the Taassili Mountains in northern Africa in the 1950's.

What is interesting in this case, is the ring with spikes.

User Image

Could it be a drone? Perhaps with the mothership above - in front of the sun?

VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Nov 6th, 2007, 10:39am

on Nov 6th, 2007, 08:26am, VonStern wrote:
French researcher Henri Lhote found this cavepainting in the Taassili Mountains in northern Africa in the 1950's.

What is interesting in this case, is the ring with spikes.


Could it be a drone? Perhaps with the mothership above - in front of the sun?

VonStern


I am reluctant to admit I have never studied this fascinating subject. I did a quick search on Henri Lhote and I did not see this painting come up. Can you post some links for more information on this?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Nov 6th, 2007, 10:51am

on Nov 6th, 2007, 10:39am, Latitude wrote:
I am reluctant to admit I have never studied this fascinating subject. I did a quick search on Henri Lhote and I did not see this painting come up. Can you post some links for more information on this?


This is what I have at the moment:

--o0o--

http://www.daviddarling.info/encyclopedia/L/Lhote.html

http://www.igap.dk/stenalder.htm (Danish only)

--o0o--

It's a very narrow issue but interesting.

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by elevenaugust on Nov 6th, 2007, 10:58am

I think VonStern make a little mistake:
This cavepainting is dated between 7.000 years and 2.000 years before J.C., and was found by a Russo-Chinese mission at Fergana, in Ouzbekistan.

Source:
http://www.effendi.info/ovni1.html
In French (sorry undecided)
and
http://ufologie.net/htm/picanc3.htm

You can also see a complete text in english here:
http://ufologie.net/htm/fergana.htm

Since the source is the french review "Lumires dans la Nuit" that I know very well (subscribed since 20 years) I can try to make thorough research to go up until the origin.

11
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Nov 6th, 2007, 11:05am

on Nov 6th, 2007, 10:58am, elevenaugust wrote:
I think VonStern make a little mistake:
This cavepainting is dated between 7.000 years and 2.000 years before J.C., and was found by a Russo-Chinese mission at Fergana, in Ouzbekistan.

Source:
http://www.effendi.info/ovni1.html
In French (sorry undecided)
and
http://ufologie.net/htm/picanc3.htm

You can also see a complete text in english here:
http://ufologie.net/htm/fergana.htm

11


Thanks for the correction grin

I just found it on the 'net and wanted to share. The sources I was using has not been validated. I apologize.

Still interesting though,

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Nov 6th, 2007, 4:30pm

--o0o--

This is something to consider for you all:

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/Science.html

THIS one I'm sure of the origin! grin Sir Martin Rees talking.

VonStern

Ps:Education is evident...mistakes are inevitable. If we grasp a straw in our time, we are considered lucky!


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by elevenaugust on Nov 6th, 2007, 5:32pm

I made some research and I found the article of origin in the French review lights in the night (Lumires dans la nuit) n355 pp3-4, where it is question of this cavepainting.
The article was written by Didier LEROUX who carried out a survey to try to go back to the origins of information.
We learn thus that the discoverer of cavepainting would be Doctor Zatsev, Ph-D of the Academy of Science of Russia and deceased in 1992.

This doctor is interviewed in a film of E. Von Daniken the extraterrestrial among us where he exposes his theory but at any time does not speak about engraving.
The reproductions of this cavepainting are in addition visible in the book of Von Daniken Presence of extraterrestrial of 1968.
It is indeed a reproduction of artist, because work is signed.
No mention nor seen in addition of the original, once again...

The Russian ufologist Boris Chourinov mentions in his book UFOS in Russia (1995) the existence of Doctor Zaitsev and even specifies that it was forgotten very quickly that Rynine, Zaitsev and Agrest (theorists) remained at the stage of the assumptions

I will try to contact Didier LEROUX, and the Russian ufologists to try to know more.

It is however curious than ever nobody could see, photograph or film the original of this rupestral engraving.

Finally, i found these links (in English, Spanish and Italian) which provide us much informations about the original sources..... Very interesting:
http://www.alcione.org/FERGANA/
http://www.ceticismoaberto.com/fortianismo/fergana.htm
And more strange about Mr Zaitsev, also a designer:
http://www.dexigner.com/fashion/announcements-g833.html

It seems plausible that it does not have there an original and that this drawing was made by Mr. Zatsev itself
You will note the correlation made by the article of the link above and the crop-circle of Chibolton.
11
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Nov 6th, 2007, 6:19pm

on Nov 6th, 2007, 4:30pm, VonStern wrote:
--o0o--

This is something to consider for you all:

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/Science.html

THIS one I'm sure of the origin! grin Sir Martin Rees talking.

VonStern

Ps:Education is evident...mistakes are inevitable. If we grasp a straw in our time, we are considered lucky!




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKhorTDDg_c

This is the same technology they are using for the tank cloaking.

It is a bit misleading to say this is a display made of concrete... concrete is the matrix the holds the fiber optics... and supplys some additional armor protection. But it works very nicely for this applcation.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Nov 6th, 2007, 6:55pm

on Nov 6th, 2007, 6:19pm, Marvin wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKhorTDDg_c

This is the same technology they are using for the tank cloaking.

It is a bit misleading to say this is a display made of concrete... concrete is the matrix the holds the fiber optics... and supplys some additional armor protection. But it works very nicely for this applcation.


Should we say, that the technology ALLOWS it to be built in concrete? ROFL

It's for street use, no doubt. Do you know any teenager who wouldn't kick any screen exposed to the street? No...excellent for commercials in the open common space...if you ask me!

This was WAY off topic! grin grin grin My mistake! rolleyes

You should listen to Sir Martin Rees, that was the purpose here! Gee...Sir Marvin! wink

Good of you to work on the other issues as well,

VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Nov 6th, 2007, 7:12pm

on Nov 6th, 2007, 6:55pm, VonStern wrote:
Should we say, that the technology ALLOWS it to be built in concrete? ROFL

It's for street use, no doubt. Do you know any teenager who wouldn't kick any sceen exposed to the street? No...excellent for commercials in the open common space...if you ask me!

This was WAY off topic! grin grin grin My mistake! rolleyes

You should listen to Sir Martin Rees, that was the purpose here! Gee...Sir Marvin! wink

Good of you to work on the other issues as well,

VonStern



I saw his video... but since this subject is in my educational background... nothing jumped out at me (except the theory on dark matter is in collapse or at least is being subjected to great doubt). What caught your attention?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Nov 8th, 2007, 11:49pm

It's so sad when individuals take it so personally, that some people think THIS and others think THAT.

I mean, until there is more physical evidence, we're all only guessing.

We have to be patient, and wait until more evidence show up, that's all.

And let's just leave our egos out of it, okay y'all?


Shech--
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Nov 9th, 2007, 08:01am

on Nov 8th, 2007, 11:49pm, Shechaiyah wrote:
It's so sad when individuals take it so personally, that some people think THIS and others think THAT.

I mean, until there is more physical evidence, we're all only guessing.

We have to be patient, and wait until more evidence show up, that's all.

And let's just leave our egos out of it, okay y'all?


Shech--



Hi Shech,

Were you concerned about VonStern and me?

If so, do not worry. We were kidding back and forth (we were also in PM contact with each other too). No ego trips, no great debate or hurt feeling going on here.

There was something that caught VonStern's eye on the Sir Martin Rees Video. I did not catch anything new there maybe VonStern will elaborate for us, if he is still lurking?

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Nov 9th, 2007, 08:17am

on Nov 9th, 2007, 08:01am, Marvin wrote:
Hi Shech,

Were you concerned about VonStern and me?

If so, do not worry. We were kidding back and forth (we were also in PM contact with each other too). No ego trips, no great debate or hurt feeling going on here.

There was something that caught VonStern's eye on the Sir Martin Rees Video. I did not catch anything new there maybe VonStern will elaborate for us, if he is still lurking?


No need to worry at all - we were just tickeling oneanother's toes..!! grin

I confirm that we PM'ed that too..

Actually, you came up with what caught my eye/ear, the possible decay of the Dark Matter. (Just did not want to give you the credit, as we made fun with all of it at the time. wink )

Everything's cool, has been from the start grin grin

Cheers,

VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Nov 9th, 2007, 09:23am

I know this is side tracking a bit, but here is something to fill in your time until some more Drone news hits the thread.

What is Dark Matter:
http://imagine.gsfc.nasa.gov/docs/science/know_l1/dark_matter.html

http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/070820_mm_dark_forces.html

http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/dark_matter_animated_030415-1.html


Proof of Dark Matter:
http://www.nasa.gov/home/hqnews/2006/aug/HQ_06297_CHANDRA_Dark_Matter.html

http://physics.about.com/b/2007/05/17/dark-matter-stands-alone.htm


The debate over Dark Matter:
http://physics.about.com/b/2007/08/19/new-questions-over-dark-matter.htm

http://space.newscientist.com/article/dn8631

http://online.itp.ucsb.edu/online/lens06/carroll/


After all is said and done we are still missing about 20% of the gravitational mass needed to explain the Universe, thus Dark Matter is not dead yet.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Nov 9th, 2007, 12:25pm

on Nov 9th, 2007, 09:23am, Marvin wrote:
I know this is side tracking a bit, but here is something to fill in your time until some more Drone news hits the thread.

What is Dark Matter:
http://imagine.gsfc.nasa.gov/docs/science/know_l1/dark_matter.html

http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/070820_mm_dark_forces.html

http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/dark_matter_animated_030415-1.html


Proof of Dark Matter:
http://www.nasa.gov/home/hqnews/2006/aug/HQ_06297_CHANDRA_Dark_Matter.html

http://physics.about.com/b/2007/05/17/dark-matter-stands-alone.htm


The debate over Dark Matter:
http://physics.about.com/b/2007/08/19/new-questions-over-dark-matter.htm

http://space.newscientist.com/article/dn8631

http://online.itp.ucsb.edu/online/lens06/carroll/


After all is said and done we are still missing about 20% of the gravitational mass needed to explain the Universe, thus Dark Matter is not dead yet.


Marvin....thanks for all the fun links grin From everything I have read, Dark Matter and Dark Energy must exist in some form or state not yet detectable directly....perhaps not ever directly detectable as they may exist through an interface with another dimension beyond our 3 + time notion of reality....maybe call it "Doesnt Matter".... grin sorry, could not resist, seriously though....could dark energy be the "vacuum" energy hypothesized by the "zero point energy" system advocates out there, starting with Nikola Tesla onward...just a thought....also consider the possible duality of Local and non-local particle properties which seem to exist....superluminal travel would then not be mere science fiction....would also be handy to have a nearly unlimited power source for traversing this and other universes/dimension/branes, without having to carry a supply on board, craft could be quite small, sound familiar?....Very fun to consider how all this seems to fit together as it could relate to the Drones...back on thread now....
NOTE: I am still waiting for my contact information for the witness in Tomball, TX who may have spotted a Drone. Will post the second anything breaks on this one smiley
Take care all. cool

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Nov 9th, 2007, 4:34pm

on Nov 6th, 2007, 5:32pm, elevenaugust wrote:
I made some research and I found the article of origin in the French review lights in the night (Lumires dans la nuit) n355 pp3-4, where it is question of this cavepainting.
The article was written by Didier LEROUX who carried out a survey to try to go back to the origins of information.
We learn thus that the discoverer of cavepainting would be Doctor Zatsev, Ph-D of the Academy of Science of Russia and deceased in 1992.

This doctor is interviewed in a film of E. Von Daniken the extraterrestrial among us where he exposes his theory but at any time does not speak about engraving.
The reproductions of this cavepainting are in addition visible in the book of Von Daniken Presence of extraterrestrial of 1968.
It is indeed a reproduction of artist, because work is signed.
No mention nor seen in addition of the original, once again...

The Russian ufologist Boris Chourinov mentions in his book UFOS in Russia (1995) the existence of Doctor Zaitsev and even specifies that it was forgotten very quickly that Rynine, Zaitsev and Agrest (theorists) remained at the stage of the assumptions

I will try to contact Didier LEROUX, and the Russian ufologists to try to know more.

It is however curious than ever nobody could see, photograph or film the original of this rupestral engraving.

Finally, i found these links (in English, Spanish and Italian) which provide us much informations about the original sources..... Very interesting:
http://www.alcione.org/FERGANA/
http://www.ceticismoaberto.com/fortianismo/fergana.htm
And more strange about Mr Zaitsev, also a designer:
http://www.dexigner.com/fashion/announcements-g833.html

It seems plausible that it does not have there an original and that this drawing was made by Mr. Zatsev itself
You will note the correlation made by the article of the link above and the crop-circle of Chibolton.
11


elevenaugust, you have done a tremendous work here.

Can you provide evidence, that the picture I provided is a fake?

If not, we must assume that the original bears resemblance to the Drones. No matter what, it cought my eye.

Any resemblance to the Drone sightings HAS to be investigated!

Good job so far!

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by elevenaugust on Nov 10th, 2007, 07:20am

on Nov 9th, 2007, 4:34pm, VonStern wrote:
elevenaugust, you have done a tremendous work here.

Can you provide evidence, that the picture I provided is a fake?

If not, we must assume that the original bears resemblance to the Drones. No matter what, it cought my eye.

Any resemblance to the Drone sightings HAS to be investigated!

Good job so far!

--VonStern


No certainty, but of strong presumptions, since Mr. Zaitsev seems to have also talents of draughtsman!!
It seems difficult to go up further towards the source of origin, more especially as Mr. Zaitsev is deceased a few years ago
However, it's true that there's a strong ressemblance with a drone...
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Nov 10th, 2007, 10:21am

on Nov 6th, 2007, 5:32pm, elevenaugust wrote:
I made some research and I found the article of origin in the French review lights in the night (Lumires dans la nuit) n355 pp3-4, where it is question of this cavepainting.
The article was written by Didier LEROUX who carried out a survey to try to go back to the origins of information.
We learn thus that the discoverer of cavepainting would be Doctor Zatsev, Ph-D of the Academy of Science of Russia and deceased in 1992.

This doctor is interviewed in a film of E. Von Daniken the extraterrestrial among us where he exposes his theory but at any time does not speak about engraving.
The reproductions of this cavepainting are in addition visible in the book of Von Daniken Presence of extraterrestrial of 1968.
It is indeed a reproduction of artist, because work is signed.
No mention nor seen in addition of the original, once again...

The Russian ufologist Boris Chourinov mentions in his book UFOS in Russia (1995) the existence of Doctor Zaitsev and even specifies that it was forgotten very quickly that Rynine, Zaitsev and Agrest (theorists) remained at the stage of the assumptions

I will try to contact Didier LEROUX, and the Russian ufologists to try to know more.

It is however curious than ever nobody could see, photograph or film the original of this rupestral engraving.

Finally, i found these links (in English, Spanish and Italian) which provide us much informations about the original sources..... Very interesting:
http://www.alcione.org/FERGANA/
http://www.ceticismoaberto.com/fortianismo/fergana.htm
And more strange about Mr Zaitsev, also a designer:
http://www.dexigner.com/fashion/announcements-g833.html

It seems plausible that it does not have there an original and that this drawing was made by Mr. Zatsev itself
You will note the correlation made by the article of the link above and the crop-circle of Chibolton.
11


Yes, this is an known "hoax."

http://www.hiddenmysteries.org/author/hurley/ufoart.html

User Image

This claimed by many to be a a cave painting found near Fergana in Uezbekistan, thought to be thousands of years old. Part of it is depicted in my copy of Erich Von Daniken's "Chariots of the Gods." (Souvenir Press 1973 Hardback)

Explanation: A french researcher -Lemaire emailed the author the following information. Basically it was a sketch done by a russian artist for a magazine "Spoutnik" in 1967 for an article concerning astronauts visiting mankind 12,000 yrs ago. Spoutnik was a magazine from the former USSR (in Reader's Digest format). It was published in several languages including russian, german, english, french and italian. Below is the original sketch, the artist's signature and the cover of the magazine.

User Image

User Image
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by elevenaugust on Nov 10th, 2007, 10:27am

on Nov 10th, 2007, 10:21am, Marvin wrote:
Yes, this is an known "hoax."

http://www.hiddenmysteries.org/author/hurley/ufoart.html

User Image

This claimed by many to be a a cave painting found near Fergana in Uezbekistan, thought to be thousands of years old. Part of it is depicted in my copy of Erich Von Daniken's "Chariots of the Gods." (Souvenir Press 1973 Hardback)

Explanation: A french researcher -Lemaire emailed the author the following information. Basically it was a sketch done by a russian artist for a magazine "Spoutnik" in 1967 for an article concerning astronauts visiting mankind 12,000 yrs ago. Spoutnik was a magazine from the former USSR (in Reader's Digest format). It was published in several languages including russian, german, english, french and italian. Below is the original sketch, the artist's signature and the cover of the magazine.

User Image

User Image


Good work of research too, Marvin!!
I think we have nothing new here and nothing related to the drone, in spite of the resemblance....
11
Edit:
You will notice the difference in appearance between the two reproductions of the drone on the drawings
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by newtothis on Nov 13th, 2007, 1:15pm

Hi all, here is link to possible drone connection with Syd Mead posted by Ark at OM:

http://lucianarchy.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=cali1&action=display&thread=1194978614&page=1

I think this could be very helpful to finding some answers! He either knows who made the LAP or is VERY interested in it!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Arkhangels on Nov 13th, 2007, 2:46pm

Hi Hi!!

Yeah I saw this image yesterday, and in first place I communicated UCB Admin Merlin regarding this finding...
But he did not talk to me since yesterday tonight though, but I know he will be soon posting that thread here
(because I could not create one sad )

Regards
Ark
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Nov 13th, 2007, 3:28pm

on Nov 13th, 2007, 1:15pm, newtothis wrote:
Hi all, here is link to possible drone connection with Syd Mead posted by Ark at OM:

http://lucianarchy.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=cali1&action=display&thread=1194978614&page=1

I think this could be very helpful to finding some answers! He either knows who made the LAP or is VERY interested in it!


No need to get exited. This is lifted off the Internet.

True evidence HAS to be explained much better.

Trust me, this is another fortune seeker.

If you want to know the real truth, look for NEW images like the one's presented in the "Isaac" files.

And I mean new aspects of the Primers provided by "Isaac".

--VonStern


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by newtothis on Nov 13th, 2007, 6:08pm

on Nov 13th, 2007, 3:28pm, VonStern wrote:
No need to get exited. This is lifted off the Internet.

True evidence HAS to be explained much better.

Trust me, this is another fortune seeker.

If you want to know the real truth, look for NEW images like the one's presented in the "Isaac" files.

And I mean new aspects of the Primers provided by "Isaac".

--VonStern



VonStern, check out this from Wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syd_Mead

He has done a lot of work in big time sci-fi films. He might have taken it straight from the net, but he is the type of person that might be of some help on this topic...
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by newtothis on Nov 13th, 2007, 6:10pm

on Nov 13th, 2007, 2:46pm, Arkhangels wrote:
Hi Hi!!

Yeah I saw this image yesterday, and in first place I communicated UCB Admin Merlin regarding this finding...
But he did not talk to me since yesterday tonight though, but I know he will be soon posting that thread here
(because I could not create one sad )

Regards
Ark


Ark, Sorry to steal any thunder embarassed I wondered why you hadn't posted it here grin But very good find!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Nov 13th, 2007, 8:10pm

on Nov 13th, 2007, 6:08pm, newtothis wrote:
VonStern, check out this from Wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syd_Mead

He has done a lot of work in big time sci-fi films. He might have taken it straight from the net, but he is the type of person that might be of some help on this topic...


Well, if you feel there is something to this, I suggest you dig into it...You seem to be a good investigator yourself.

If you come up with new evidence, it will be greatly appreciated, and aknowledged!

I just haven't the time to do so myself, so by all means...do investigate!

Best regards,

VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Nov 13th, 2007, 8:16pm

Syd Mead and I went to the same art school. Art Center College of Design, Pasadena California. (Current tuition PER semester is around $12,000) Syd is about 74 years of age and is considered a very talented artist, illustrator and industrial/movie designer. He's a nice guy and lives the life of a man-about-town in Los Angeles.

Like many artists, Syd likes to 'borrow' images from many sources. My guess is that he got caught 'stealing' the Issac language image off the internet.

We used to make fun of art students that did this in our college days. Norman Rockwell used to steal images for his Post covers back in the 1940's.

Artists steal all the time from various sources. They just hope they don't get caught too often.

Does Syd know anything about the Drones? I seriously doubt it.

Dougster
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Nov 14th, 2007, 12:41pm

on Nov 13th, 2007, 2:46pm, Arkhangels wrote:
Hi Hi!!

Yeah I saw this image yesterday, and in first place I communicated UCB Admin Merlin regarding this finding...
But he did not talk to me since yesterday tonight though, but I know he will be soon posting that thread here
(because I could not create one sad )

Regards
Ark


Sorry to take so long to comment Ark.

Nice catch.


VonStern, you may be correct.


on Nov 13th, 2007, 8:16pm, urantia606 wrote:
Syd Mead and I went to the same art school. Art Center College of Design, Pasadena California. (Current tuition PER semester is around $12,000) Syd is about 74 years of age and is considered a very talented artist, illustrator and industrial/movie designer. He's a nice guy and lives the life of a man-about-town in Los Angeles.

Like many artists, Syd likes to 'borrow' images from many sources. My guess is that he got caught 'stealing' the Issac language image off the internet.

Artists steal all the time from various sources. They just hope they don't get caught too often.

Dougster



Hey Dougster,

It is not unusually for an Artist to take something, do a change and make it their own

Maybe ya might get a chance to ask Syd and see what he says?

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Nov 14th, 2007, 12:45pm

Marvin:

Yes, there is nothing really wrong with lifting an image and make it your own. You just don't want to be too obvious about it.

Dougster%20wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by TeachersPet on Nov 16th, 2007, 12:35pm

First Greetz to all..Ark thanx again and Urantia..(i first heard of Urantia book in sixties its fascinating)
I sent a letter and have recieved a response from the business mgr who is awaiting Syds return to the states this week. It is indeed an intriguing possibility as Syd does desings on everthing even a coffee pot reminded me of the circular designs..His involvement would not negate the propulsion or schematics of the drone only that it is a ripple coming from a pebble dropped into the pond a long time ago. We are now at a point where viral programs are now incorporating plugs for several manufactures..alienware dell ea (see Crysis at alienware) wherein each drives the limits of both technology and art and yes entertainment.
that does not mean the source caret or roswell or even the biblical sightings are invalidated..life goes on here and outhere.
I have posted at ATS OM and Here..as this affects us all..
I think Isaac would have liked that smiley and I think Syd would also..Part of his strength is drawn from the likes of us smiley
quote:--------------------------------------------------------
I have sent a second Email and even posted on the guestbook also..I hope they understand we are not gong away..

quote
Dear Syd,
I , and so many others, enjoy your work , but am saddened as I have not recieved a response to a recent email .I assume it did not reach you. But I need your help.
At the August Sigg conference a clip was taken http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfyjM9XghG8
of you displaying a graphic.
at 56 seconds into the film you will note that this is a direct replica of the now famous LAP Issac Caret project diagram that is in virtually every forum across the planet . Are you the creator of these diagrams and or ship design which incorporates that industrial design look so prevalent in your works?
or have you borrowed the display as an \"accent\" to your primary work or is this part of a larger project you are currently involved with and cannot release information?
I and many others were awaiting a response, however we have heard nothing from you and are disappointed, however we know that you will not let your fans at ATS, OMF, UFOCasebook, PosthumanBlues, Aliencasebook, (That I am a member of all as well)and many other devotees down. We eagerly eagerly await word from you.

Sincerely
Sys xxxxchanged


my take is if he went to a massive conference like Sigg and displayed that without fear..I hope he is as brave here and responds..I cant put anymore sugar on the letter than what I did. this is all I can do my friends.

UPDATE..I was going to hit the sack when I went to my email..Perhaps all is not lost
His Business MGR responded to my Second letter.(.Thank you Jesus)

Re: SYD MEAD Response to Manny Vega
From: oblagon (Oblagon@worldnet.att.net)
You may not know this sender.Mark as safe|Mark as unsafe
Sent: Fri 11/16/07 1:55 AM
To: mannysplace@hotmail.com

Manny,

Thank you for taking the time to send us your inquiry. Your input is important to us and your questions will be answered soon. Mr. Mead is currently on assignment but hopes to catch up on his correspondence by next week.

Your patience is appreciated.

Roger Servick
Manager of Business Affairs
Syd Mead Inc.



At least we have a Time frame..

I can go to sleep now..
Good Night
its 255am EST USA
end of quote _______________________________
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Nov 16th, 2007, 4:37pm

on Nov 16th, 2007, 12:35pm, TeachersPet wrote:
At least we have a Time frame..

I can go to sleep now..
Good Night
its 255am EST USA

Excellent work Sys, do you think perhaps this, Timeframe is due to the fact hes been rumbled? Hes probably frantically researching the legal ramifications as we speak!! grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by TeachersPet on Nov 16th, 2007, 5:19pm

on Nov 16th, 2007, 4:37pm, DrDil wrote:
Excellent work Sys, do you think perhaps this, Timeframe is due to the fact hes been rumbled? Hes probably frantically researching the legal ramifications as we speak!! grin



Hi Doc!!
If alienware went ahead and have in writing themselves admiited an open use ..I see no reason why he has to fear litigation from any quarter..I get the feeling somehow that alienware, crytek (crysis) of EA and dell as well as Syd may be connected..and merely capitalizing on the affair. The industrial look of the craft cannot be ignored however as this is one of Syds Hallmarks....his layouts always seem to build on something old. a neo retro look..its just plain good..again we wont know till he answers..
the T that appeared in the diagrams have always bothered me as they were more than copy machine artifacts and did appear multiple times under flourescent lighting/coloring.. so if trademark or geographical orientational markers..I cant say right now

but I do think things are coming to a head..Christmas is near..and whatever is being sold must be sold now..when most profits are made. whether a book or a computer..or film/dvd.

whatever I get I will post at all six forums and blogspots I go to..to get word out one way or another..

Take care
Sys
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Nov 16th, 2007, 5:24pm

Why would Syd be worried about legal ramifications?

The Caret documents are in the Public Domain and nobody will own up to them... never ever. We will never see anyone try and say they own the language primer and all of Isaac's cool info.

The nano-second Isaac put his info on the WWW it entered into the history books of all time and eternity.

"BTW, Isaac, it's been a long time since we heard a peep from you. How goes it?"

Good to hear form you too, Dr. Dill.

Dougster




Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by TeachersPet on Nov 16th, 2007, 8:03pm

[quote author=urantia606 link=board=drone&num=1191662183&start=550#36 date=1195255469]Why would Syd be worried about legal ramifications?

Precisely Dougster..very eloquently put..Many cannot understand the concept of giving away something..let alone open source..many companies give away things all the time just to make their product ubiquitous..and can profit later..Thats why the japanese barcode QR already in use is being put on cell phones free..microsoft is not happy and came up with a higher density version for their DVDs while shotcode in the netherlands is going the proprietary rout..I like shotcode principles but QR is already their and working and yes..free and even works with my desktop cam whereas the other you are bound specifically to cameraphones.

Say Dougster do you have anywork you can let us see..or did you follow a different path ?I always enjoy artwork..specially by old school masters, illustrators, if, fantasy, galaxy,amazing stories. analog,.they were the anime of my time. The ones earlier than this were even better..the illustratotor of this 1980s edition of this Rick Sternbach,went on to do all star trek and still is used as consultant..anyway..just drifting..
User Image

Why we were duking it out in the stars long before Roswell
here is a 1938 illustration from you guessed it...Scoop magazine
User Image

If this didnt bring tears then feast your eyes on the covers at this link

http://www.sfcovers.net/Artists/bpage001.htm

Enjoy.


thanx for your invaluable input too

Sys
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Nov 20th, 2007, 07:10am

Drones in the news...

http://forgetomori.com/2007/ufos/amazing-caretchad-drone-inspired-by-x-men/


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by TeachersPet on Nov 20th, 2007, 08:25am

Hey Marv

They seem to be a little late as omf and ats covered this about 2months ago..It was a strong influence to me but by the same logic so is an industrial or home cieling fan..so we moved on..They also covered carat yesterday as a misspelling on Bonzais which I personally caught and picked up on significance, and Posted on ats around two weeks ago, immediately after banzais letter on omf but ignored the carat advertising agency connection! they own and run ammo marketing and the other word of mouth agencies that do alienware and EA arts virals..
I like the newspaper blog layout out but they are playing catchup and posting as new old news as if they discovered it..thats not nice..I left a polite comment letting them know this was covered already

Now..this wasnt around 2 months ago ..I am pretty sure syd is waiting till its all out before he writes me..I think it will be soon

User Image

Sys
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by murnut on Nov 20th, 2007, 10:11am

Possible drone?

http://www.ufocasebook.com/ontario110607.html
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Nov 21st, 2007, 12:41pm

on Nov 20th, 2007, 07:10am, Marvin wrote:
Drones in the news...

http://forgetomori.com/2007/ufos/amazing-caretchad-drone-inspired-by-x-men/



That's a debunking site. Nothing to see there.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Nov 24th, 2007, 1:11pm


I suspect the drones are cloaked rather than gone, because we never saw them before; and now we're not seeing them again.

Nothing simply disappears from a reality.

What I noticed about them was the lack of sentient oversight.

Impersonal and mechanistic, they exist without anybody to consent to their function.

That's a BAD sign.


Chai
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Nov 26th, 2007, 5:30pm


This video was added in September

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2w_u1ZJuwc&feature=related

all in Greek, so I can't tell whether the drone appeared in Greece or not.

Anybody read Greek?


Shech--
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by raska on Nov 27th, 2007, 06:02am

Hi Sche, and all,

This looks a lot like Leviathan's CG work .
smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Nov 27th, 2007, 06:56am

on Nov 27th, 2007, 06:02am, raska wrote:
Hi Sche, and all,

This looks a lot like Leviathan's CG work .
smiley



This is an older CG work that has been around for quite a while and recycled in to this video. The rest is all Greek to me. wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by TeachersPet on Nov 27th, 2007, 08:04am

Greetings and Salutations,
Syd Mead has responded by email He is not the author of the Graphics

-----Original Message-----
From: Syd Mead [mailtoshockedblagon@worldnet.att.net]
Sent: Monday, November 26, 2007 10:18 PM
To: xxxxxxxxxxxl
Cc: oblagon@att.net
Subject: THE CART caper

Manny

Your inquiry was interesting, especially because it was all prompted by the ubiquity of the current practice of folk who take little tiny pictures with their communication devices and subsequently broadcast them to the world.
This curious practice will surely influence any future presentations that I make anywhere in the world. Now to your question..

I have long been a believer in the alien presence on our planet since at least Biblical days. (Read the book of Ezekiel.) There have been too many eyewitness accounts to argue to the contrary. I was cruising the net when I ran across some interesting graphics that were purportedly a part of a reverse engineering program run by a government agency. The patterns are beautiful, arabesque, intricately geometric. I combined three of them into one graphic and used that pattern as a graphical background between segments of my presentation. I am not aware of any prohibition regarding these images...but to ease your curiosity, I am not 'part of' any particular group that pursues the whole subject of alien presence.

SYD MEAD


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Gort on Nov 27th, 2007, 08:59am

on Nov 27th, 2007, 08:04am, TeachersPet wrote:
Greetings and Salutations,
Syd Mead has responded by email He is not the author of the Graphics

-----Original Message-----
From: Syd Mead [mailtoshockedblagon@worldnet.att.net]
Sent: Monday, November 26, 2007 10:18 PM
To: xxxxxxxxxxxl
Cc: oblagon@att.net
Subject: THE CART caper

Manny

Your inquiry was interesting, especially because it was all prompted by the ubiquity of the current practice of folk who take little tiny pictures with their communication devices and subsequently broadcast them to the world.
This curious practice will surely influence any future presentations that I make anywhere in the world. Now to your question..

I have long been a believer in the alien presence on our planet since at least Biblical days. (Read the book of Ezekiel.) There have been too many eyewitness accounts to argue to the contrary. I was cruising the net when I ran across some interesting graphics that were purportedly a part of a reverse engineering program run by a government agency. The patterns are beautiful, arabesque, intricately geometric. I combined three of them into one graphic and used that pattern as a graphical background between segments of my presentation. I am not aware of any prohibition regarding these images...but to ease your curiosity, I am not 'part of' any particular group that pursues the whole subject of alien presence.

SYD MEAD




Good work TP
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Nov 27th, 2007, 10:43am

on Nov 27th, 2007, 08:04am, TeachersPet wrote:
Greetings and Salutations,
Syd Mead has responded by email He is not the author of the Graphics

-----Original Message-----
From: Syd Mead [mailtoshockedblagon@worldnet.att.net]
Sent: Monday, November 26, 2007 10:18 PM
To: xxxxxxxxxxxl
Cc: oblagon@att.net
Subject: THE CART caper

Manny

Your inquiry was interesting, especially because it was all prompted by the ubiquity of the current practice of folk who take little tiny pictures with their communication devices and subsequently broadcast them to the world.
This curious practice will surely influence any future presentations that I make anywhere in the world. Now to your question..

I have long been a believer in the alien presence on our planet since at least Biblical days. (Read the book of Ezekiel.) There have been too many eyewitness accounts to argue to the contrary. I was cruising the net when I ran across some interesting graphics that were purportedly a part of a reverse engineering program run by a government agency. The patterns are beautiful, arabesque, intricately geometric. I combined three of them into one graphic and used that pattern as a graphical background between segments of my presentation. I am not aware of any prohibition regarding these images...but to ease your curiosity, I am not 'part of' any particular group that pursues the whole subject of alien presence.

SYD MEAD



This is as I expected. Were you expecting any different? It would seem to me if I was to read between the lines, I'd have to put Syd into the "Drones are legit" catagory. If you need confirmation of that then maybe you should send him a follow up email. Also, why not back off on the LMH attack?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by TeachersPet on Nov 27th, 2007, 11:07am

Thank you for your comment lattiude..but if I were to do as you thought.why I wouldn't even have bothered to send emails...or even ask questions..just accept everything as legit..I cannot do that..all of us ar driven by curiosity..there was a use of the elements and it was a simple query which recieved a clear response, rather quickly, I might add.unlike the nice lady you wish me to "back off "of..so that being said..that latter part "aint happenin anytime soon"..until she comes down off her mountain..which in turn (based on her history) "aint happenin anytime soon " either..
Like Syd I believe ..but unlike many in the forums I am searching for artists, thinkers and visionaries..not hoaxters..so my take will lead to a different path than yours and naturally different conclusions and questions..which may mean nothing to you or others but thats my path..my choice..irrespective of forum..which this is..as opposed to a camp which I hope it is not..
Greetz to all..Thanx to Urantia..for the insight..and helping motivate and rediscover some of the old masters works..I hope those of you that clicked the link posted enjoyed it as much as i have and continue to also.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Nov 27th, 2007, 11:45am

on Nov 27th, 2007, 11:07am, TeachersPet wrote:
Thank you for your comment lattiude..but if I were to do as you thought.why I wouldn't even have bothered to send emails...or even ask questions..just accept everything as legit..I cannot do that..all of us ar driven by curiosity..there was a use of the elements and it was a simple query which recieved a clear response, rather quickly, I might add.unlike the nice lady you wish me to "back off "of..so that being said..that latter part "aint happenin anytime soon"..until she comes down off her mountain..which in turn (based on her history) "aint happenin anytime soon " either..
Like Syd I believe ..but unlike many in the forums I am searching for artists, thinkers and visionaries..not hoaxters..so my take will lead to a different path than yours and naturally different conclusions and questions..which may mean nothing to you or others but thats my path..my choice..irrespective of forum..which this is..as opposed to a camp which I hope it is not..
Greetz to all..Thanx to Urantia..for the insight..and helping motivate and rediscover some of the old masters works..I hope those of you that clicked the link posted enjoyed it as much as i have and continue to also.


Thanks for contacting Syd. I have enjoyed reading what you have brought on this. LMH has done a good service for us in bringing a lot of evidence out. While I don't agree with her reasoning for holding back on some information I cannot "throw the baby out with the bath water".
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Nov 27th, 2007, 2:28pm

This is a must see (to fill more time smiley)

It is just over 1 hour... Latitude, this is a mind blower. wink

Be sure to use the full screen feature.


Thunderbolts of the Gods

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4773590301316220374


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by hjdelight on Nov 27th, 2007, 8:23pm

Excellent Marvin! Everyone should watch this video. grin

HJ
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Nov 27th, 2007, 10:46pm


It's ALL ABOUT things, objects, fields, THINGS, plasma, gravity, currents, THINGS--

Where is the Intelligence in this Universe they are describing?

Ain't here.

This is another "materialist" single-dimensional mechanistic description of reality.

Sorry, my reality is concerned with Relationships -- not exclusively with Things.

These Scientists have NO Cosmic RELATIONSHIPS they can refer to.

I feel so sorry for them. It's as if they're describing a house and they carefully go over every inch of the house, every bit of furnishings, possessions, appliances, toys, even the garbage in the garbage can.

But they can't find any PEOPLE in the Universe, beside themselves.

Pitiful.


Shechaiyah
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by hjdelight on Nov 27th, 2007, 11:49pm

Mmmm...I guess that's why they call themselves scientists?

HJ
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Nov 28th, 2007, 08:03am

Bias: a preference for or dislike of something, to influence, in statistics: it is the distortion of a set of statistical results by a variable not considered or discarded in the calculation or due to the variable itself, it is a prejudice or a partiality towards something or someone.

In my lifes experience, we humans live in the paradigm of bias. We all have it. It is built into out very thought processes. Perception can and will harbor bias. We all have our perceptions, do we not?

Scientists are not immune to bias.

What this video exposes for me is the battle of perceptions, between the current Cosmologists (gravity is the answer to the Cosmos), and the Electrical side of the Physics discipline (electricity and magnetic fields are the answer to the Cosmos). It basically is a weak force (gravity) verses strong force (magnetic fields/electricity) argument. This may be the major blow to the dark matter debate.

Shech as a person of faith, I would say all that scientists can do is describe and define the created universe. Ultimately, we know the answer to the over all picture, it's just looking for and understanding all of the loose ends. People without faith are left with a giant mystery, and puzzles that lead to more enigmas with overwhelming loose ends.

It was interesting to listen to the Electrical Engineer say for Cosmologist, they say it is caused by blah blah blah and when this relies on something else to cause it to happen, then they are clueless (or wrong) as to the cause but if you look at it electrically, the answer is easy, it is blah blah blah and you need no further explanations to make it work. It sounds like these two disciplines need to get together and do some late night brain storming.

A change in ones bias always leads to new discoveries. wink

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Nodnunk on Nov 28th, 2007, 09:47am

on Nov 27th, 2007, 10:46pm, Shechaiyah wrote:
Sorry, my reality is concerned with Relationships -- not exclusively with Things.

These Scientists have NO Cosmic RELATIONSHIPS they can refer to.

Shechaiyah


Observational science relies upon the five senses for information (sight, hearing, touch, smell, taste). Theoretical science relies upon logical (mathematical) structures to explain and extend the observations. Mainstream science needs both repeatable observations and a supporting mathematical model to build a valid theory. A great number of theoretical models can be constructed that are mathematically consistent but have little or no observational support. Likewise, observations without the supporting model lead nowhere and are useless.

Consequently, mainstream science rejects the existence of ET's, if that is what you mean by cosmic relationships. I would venture this is because the supporting evidence consists of sightings for which no model can be constructed. Each sighting is unique and cannot be repeated. So, you are correct, scientists have no cosmic relationships they can refer to. This view of the universe is entirely home grown. Scientists have no way of asking a cosmic entity (supposedly of superior intellect and experience) for help and assistance. Even if they could, everything they learned would need to be validated and incorporated into the current scientific dogma.



Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Nov 28th, 2007, 10:42am


So, they place themselves in a box cut off from the multi-dimensional universe, and they expect the rest of us to take them seriously.

Har har. In a cat's eye. They're inter-dimensionally deaf, dumb and blind.

NEVER will I take so-called "Science" literally or seriously. "What is essential is invisible to the eye," is true. They leave out ALL the causes and merely argue on interminably about effects.

Silly stuff.


Shechaiyah
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Nov 28th, 2007, 10:59am

on Nov 28th, 2007, 09:47am, Nodnunk wrote:
Consequently, mainstream science rejects the existence of ET's...




Hi Nodnunk,

I agree with you except for this statement. I think mainstream science is a mixed bag that has come to peace with itself by accepting there is extraterrestrial life (that ET exist), but as a group they have not accepted the notion we are being visited by ET.

Carl Sagan was a big believer in ET (somewhere in the cosmic soup), which is why we have programs like SETI and the following plaque attached to the Pioneer 10 spacecraft (and designed by Carl Sagan).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pioneer_plaque


User Image

(Maybe we need to be reminded of this plaque and compare it to the LAP)

Keep in mind, this plaque was designed to communicate with ET (if the craft was ever found). Here is how to decode the plaque:
http://www.orbit.zkm.de/?q=node/256

Carl Sagan also became the biggest UFO debunker. Ironic, isnt it? I am sure if he were alive today, drones would be at the top of his debunking list.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Gort on Nov 28th, 2007, 2:29pm

on Nov 28th, 2007, 10:59am, Marvin wrote:
Carl Sagan also became the biggest UFO debunker. Ironic, isnt it? I am sure if he were alive today, drones would be at the top of his debunking list.



There is an old saying, something to the effect that everybody has their price. I can't help but wonder how much did they pay Carl Sagan to tote the party line. Myself, being a nobody I could sell my credibility for probably (?), but for somebody like Carl Sagan I just wonder how much; he obviously took it!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by murnut on Nov 28th, 2007, 3:07pm

on Nov 28th, 2007, 2:29pm, Gort wrote:
There is an old saying, something to the effect that everybody has their price. I can't help but wonder how much did they pay Carl Sagan to tote the party line. Myself, being a nobody I could sell my credibility for probably (?), but for somebody like Carl Sagan I just wonder how much; he obviously took it!


Perhaps he wasn't bought for a price, but rather sold a bill of goods, if ya catch my drift.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by hjdelight on Nov 28th, 2007, 3:59pm

Or the fear of Gov was put into him.

HJ
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Nov 28th, 2007, 4:26pm

on Nov 28th, 2007, 2:29pm, Gort wrote:
There is an old saying, something to the effect that everybody has their price. I can't help but wonder how much did they pay Carl Sagan to tote the party line. Myself, being a nobody I could sell my credibility for probably (?), but for somebody like Carl Sagan I just wonder how much; he obviously took it!


Not to accuse Sagan of taking a bribe but it could have been that he simply knew who buttered his bread. Start mouthing off about ETs and government coverups and suddenly all that grant money dries up.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Nov 28th, 2007, 4:27pm

As Carl Sagan might say, "It would take billions and billions and billions of UFO's flying around my backyard for me to believe in the mere idea of ET as a concept."
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Nodnunk on Nov 28th, 2007, 7:46pm

on Nov 28th, 2007, 10:59am, Marvin wrote:
I agree with you except for this statement. I think mainstream science is a mixed bag that has come to peace with itself by accepting there is extraterrestrial life (that ET exist), but as a group they have not accepted the notion we are being visited by ET.



Hi Marvin,
I agree with what you say. What I meant was mainstream science rejects the existence of ET's visiting here, now. To believe that ET's exist somewhere out there, now, or in the past, or in the future, is one thing. But to believe that ET's exist somewhere out there and have found a way to circumvent the cosmic speed limit imposed by the speed of light so that they can zip around the galaxy at will and be visiting Earth now, is another. Given that ET's are visiting us here, now, demonstrates that our known "laws of physics" are incomplete. But, it's going to take more than a few nocturnal lights, crop circles, or abduction claims to convince mainstream science that they are missing something.



Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Nov 28th, 2007, 9:00pm

Quote:
But to believe that ET's exist somewhere out there and have found a way to circumvent the cosmic speed limit imposed by the speed of light so that they can zip around the galaxy at will and be visiting Earth now, is another.


In order to believe this BLANKET DENIAL, one is forced to ignore and deny thousands if not millions of first-person reports, photos, videos, accounts, stories, books and conversations.

I argue, if science is that oblivious to the testimony of so many fellow humans, THEN they do not have any credibility with me on any topic and they are not worth considering, following nor believing on any subject, frame or judgment.

They're stupefied, compartmentalized and programmed.

Shech--
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Nov 28th, 2007, 9:09pm

Let me continue.

This one world coverment is based on secrecy;

has methodically dumbed-down our population.
http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/bookstore/index.htm

considers "population" to be a danger to this planet, especially the population that has a TINY CARBON FOOTPRINT. So they're annihilating third world peoples who live close to the earth.

These maniacal and stupefied humans consider KILLING and CULLING to be a problem-solving method;

These nut cases have already NUKED the planet Jupiter and now they want to NUKE Saturn, just to see what happens.

These weirdos and genocidalists poison the water supply, contaminate vaccines, propagate dangerous drugs; allow food to be adulterated and seeds to become sterile and dangerous to protein metabolism.

These M*****F*****s base our nation's economy on war; carry on torture and the violation of human and civil rights, with impunity.

These are the same political factions that do drugs to our youngsters, manipulate the stock markets to exhaust the equity out of our retirement accounts, and sell porn over the internet to sate their appetite for kiddy and snuff porn.

And you want to tell me, Science has some INTEGRITY?

You have got to be kidding.

You know, in Behold a Pale Horse, Cooper praises a woman astronomer Clair E. Max, who works up the hill from me at the Lick Observatory. So a sent her a couple of friendly emails. She and I are the same age, the same year graduated high school.

She immediately closed down her email account.

Isn't that interesting? She's avoiding talking to anybody -- a scientist of world renown who doesn't want to talk to a retired schoolteacher down the hill.

The whole topic of Avoidance, Neglect of Values and twisted perverted scientists has got my panties in a knot.

Such abysmal stupidity is beyond my imagination. The next thing you know, those stupid men and women who study Astronomy at Universities will be claiming that we live on the OUTSIDE SURFACE of this planet, and not on the INSIDE, as we know we do.

Right?

Shechaiyah
Emily Cragg


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by ZETAR on Nov 28th, 2007, 10:15pm

HEY SHECH,
I WANTED TO BRING UP THE INFAMOUS CYCLIC PATTERN THAT OCCURS IN SCIENCE.
IF WE RECALL MANY OF THE TOP SCIENTISTS IN THE MANHATTEN PROJECT WHOM WERE RECRUITED VIA MONEY AND UNLIMITED FUNDS FOR RESEARCH AND NO DOUBT NATIONALISM/PATRIOTISM...HAD A CHANGE OF HEART ONCE THEIR PROJECT WAS ACTUALLY BROUGHT ONLINE.
FURTHERMORE, NAZI SCIENTISTS WHOM DELAYED AS SOME SPECULATE THE COMPLETION OF THEIR ATOMIC PAYLOAD REALIZED THE RAMIFACTIONS OF SUCH POWER AND OPENING PANDORAS BOX.
THOSE THAT TEND TO ISOLATE THEMSELVES FROM CONTACT FROM A FRIEND...HIGH SCHOOL/ BUD FROM DOWN THE HILL...MAY NOT WANT TO GRASP THE POSSIBLITY OF THEIR ISOLATION ,INSENSITIVITY AND/OR ACCOUTABILITY.
NO DOUBT IT CAN BE MOST FRUSTRATING BUT YOUR EXAMPLE AND THOUGHTS WILL INFLUENCE MANY AND IN TIME MAY REACH IN SOME ROUND ABOUT WAY THE PERSON YOU WERE UNABLE TO BROACH.
SHALOM...ZETAR cool
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Nov 28th, 2007, 10:27pm


These days, Scientism is a religion based on the half-truth that materiality is all there is.

I don't know how we get out from under its big boot.


Shech--
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by ZETAR on Nov 28th, 2007, 10:43pm

MY GOOD FRIEND SHECH,
HARD TO TELL...PROBABLY THE SMUG PERSONA OF THE TECHNOCRAT WILL BE FORCED TO OPEN THEIR EYES WHEN THOSE WELL ROUNDED ACADEMICS WHOM RECOGNISE IT IS AN ART, CRAFT AND SCIENCE REVEAL THAT IT IS MORE THAN JUST THE SCIENCE.
MAYBE ANOTHER "ISM" MAY MORPH AND TEMPER THAT TUNNELISTIC ELITE.
SHALOM...ZETAR
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Nov 29th, 2007, 01:19am


We can sure hope so.


: ) Shech--
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Nov 30th, 2007, 08:36am

on Nov 28th, 2007, 7:46pm, Nodnunk wrote:
Hi Marvin,
I agree with what you say. What I meant was mainstream science rejects the existence of ET's visiting here, now. To believe that ET's exist somewhere out there, now, or in the past, or in the future, is one thing. But to believe that ET's exist somewhere out there and have found a way to circumvent the cosmic speed limit imposed by the speed of light so that they can zip around the galaxy at will and be visiting Earth now, is another. Given that ET's are visiting us here, now, demonstrates that our known "laws of physics" are incomplete. But, it's going to take more than a few nocturnal lights, crop circles, or abduction claims to convince mainstream science that they are missing something.




Got it.



As one reads some of the replies... it seems we sometimes confuse Main Stream Science (that which is politically correct and falls into step with current acceptable main stream views) with Scientists.

There is what is said publicly and there is what is said behind closed doors. I am not trying to put a secretive spin to make scientists appear dark and sinister the unfortunate truth is that Science has become a business. In order to maintain an income, a scientist has to keep a boss happy. Good science will examine and report the data without bias (to the best of the scientists ability). Business science is not free from the temptation to only give good news data that the boss wants to hear or see after all, the scientists paycheck depends on a happy boss and sometimes, one must keep ones opinions to ones self (or between a select few). When you mix politics and science, throw reality out the window, science looses out to the bias of the politicians and their goals. Politicians are good at quoting or even misquoting scientific data to only support their goals, regardless of reality. If what is happening today with the environment is not enough evidence for this, then let me remind everyone of WWII Germany as a prime example of the misdeeds that can and will happen when trusting politicians who claim they have science on their side or that they have scientific consensus.

I am not so sure that we should be down on science or scientists. All science can do, is to observe, measure, explain and reproduce (even if only mathematically) the universe around us. Then the information is at the ethical mercy and integrity of those who use it.

While Main Stream Science may not accept we are being visited by ET, Im not so sure that it is fair to say that all Main Stream Scientists have a closed mind and that they do not ponder the possibility that we are being visited. You have to remember, by nature scientists are very inquisitive folks.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Dec 1st, 2007, 12:46pm

Quote:
I am not so sure that we should be �down� on science or scientists. All science can do, is to observe, measure, explain and reproduce (even if only mathematically) the universe around us.


Science does not deal with the universe; it deals with six senses, period.

Subjectivity, inter-dimensional communication, meta-physics and non-temporal experience will never get analyzed by "Science."


Chai
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Dec 1st, 2007, 11:08pm

on Dec 1st, 2007, 12:46pm, Shechaiyah wrote:
Science does not deal with the universe; it deals with six senses, period.

Subjectivity, inter-dimensional communication, meta-physics and non-temporal experience will never get analyzed by "Science."


Chai




Science and humans tend to deal with the universe around us with our five senses. This is because science deals with repeatability, (the ability to do it again) and reproducibility (the ability for someone else to verify or do what you did in your experiment). The sixth sense, we are still learning about it.

I think it is unfair to say that these things are not investigated, studied or analyzed by science. The two following are public knowledge studies of the sixth sense done on NASAs dime.

http://www.cabinetmagazine.org/issues/5/esp.php

"Edgar Mitchell, an astronaut aboard Apollo 14, was the sixth man to walk on the surface of the moon. While on board the spacecraft, he conducted a series of private ESP experiments that had not been approved by NASA."

http://www.paradigm-sys.com/ctt_articles2.cfm?id=49

"Percipient A was an SRI policy analyst, Duane Elgin. In 1974, he participated in a NASA-sponsored study of feedback training on a four-choice electronic ESP tester and trainer, the Aquarius machine (Targ, Cole, & Puthoff, 1974)."

Chai, just because it is not in the public realm, or that it does not get much press, does not mean science is not analyzing it. You can fill volumes with what you do not see in the news paper. wink

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Dec 2nd, 2007, 01:18am

Quote:
Chai, just because it is not in the public realm, or that it does not get much press, does not mean science is not analyzing it. You can fill volumes with what you do not see in the news paper.


My 25-year-old son is brilliant, got two degrees in three years from University of Rochester.

He believes everything the MSM says, prints and whatever he was taught at the University.

So, what am I supposed to think? He repudiates inter-dimensional communication; laughs at the idea of ETs and UFOs; discounts 911 Truth and stonewalls the topic of catastrophism and the Aztec calender.

Yet he is an "educated" man.

Duh. What am I supposed to talk to him about? He's IGNORANT!! And I ADORE my son!

So, now what?

Chai
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Dec 2nd, 2007, 8:46pm

on Dec 2nd, 2007, 01:18am, Shechaiyah wrote:
My 25-year-old son is brilliant, got two degrees in three years from University of Rochester.

He believes everything the MSM says, prints and whatever he was taught at the University.

So, what am I supposed to think? He repudiates inter-dimensional communication; laughs at the idea of ETs and UFOs; discounts 911 Truth and stonewalls the topic of catastrophism and the Aztec calender.

Yet he is an "educated" man.

Duh. What am I supposed to talk to him about? He's IGNORANT!! And I ADORE my son!

So, now what?

Chai



Love is the answer Chai.

We are all different, with our own unique experiences and points of view... that is both our strengths and our weakness, depending on how one uses it. But, you already knew the answer Chia... love.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Dec 3rd, 2007, 05:20am

---o0o---

December Issue:

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/Magazine.html

---o0o---
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Dec 3rd, 2007, 2:19pm

on Dec 2nd, 2007, 01:18am, Shechaiyah wrote:
My 25-year-old son is brilliant, got two degrees in three years from University of Rochester.

He believes everything the MSM says, prints and whatever he was taught at the University.

So, what am I supposed to think? He repudiates inter-dimensional communication; laughs at the idea of ETs and UFOs; discounts 911 Truth and stonewalls the topic of catastrophism and the Aztec calender.

Yet he is an "educated" man.

Duh. What am I supposed to talk to him about? He's IGNORANT!! And I ADORE my son!

So, now what?

Chai


Maybe he needs to be old and senile like us before he can see the truth. wink Have patients. My opinion is this subject is not a good one for some at their stage in life. Let the children find their own way. But be sure to stay grounded lest they think we are kooks.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Merlin on Dec 3rd, 2007, 5:56pm

on Dec 2nd, 2007, 8:46pm, Marvin wrote:
Love is the answer Chai.

We are all different, with our own unique experiences and points of view... that is both our strengths and our weakness, depending on how one uses it. But, you already knew the answer Chia... love.
I couldn't agree with that more Marvin.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by slobomotion on Dec 8th, 2007, 2:09pm

I feel foolish and have hesitated to post. On November 17, 2007, In Saint-Denis, France, I think I saw two to six drones. It was around 9 at night, local time, a clear night, and extremely cold. I am a fairly experienced stargazer and have experienced Northern Lights, and I've also experienced atmospheric distortions of ordinary things such as planets, but this was something else altogether. I was home alone and had been chatting on the phone to a friend in the States about The Montauk Project. Our phone connection began to fail after that, and I had to call my friend back several times to carry on the conversation. After I finished the call, I had a "creepy" feeling and went to look out my bedroom window in back. I saw two things which I think were drones, hovering down the block, to the North, not very high and not far from me. Sorry I cannot be more specific. The two things were bell shaped and only about the size of an ordinary kitchen table. I have seen similar craft on You Tube. I rang the bell of my neighbor and asked her to come over and be a witness. She kindly agreed. She saw them, too, and agreed it wasn't "normal." I thanked her, and she left. The craft seemed to be winking at me! Then, I saw four more, to the East of them, but far off, looking more like stars. The scary thing was their shimmery quality, and they went in and out of focus. I started to get really scared and tried to log onto UFO Casebook to ask for advice about what to do, but then I "lost time." Next thing I knew, I was standing back at my window, yelling at the drones (or whatever they were) to leave me alone! I feel SO foolish about this! The last thing I recall is phoning a friend in California, but I couldn't get through and got some sort of voicemail. I left my name and number. He emailed me next day saying someone who didn't have my voice at all (!) had left him a message, but the call originated from Saint Louis, Missouri, so he deleted it as he knows I am in France. I guess I then went to bed. My spouse was so annoyed with me the next day. I sure felt like an idiot, but the experience was really scary. A week or so later, a major police operation went on in my nabe, to bust a steadfast (tenacious) group of drug dealers. I may have seen drones used for police ops. I have spoken with as many people as possible here, and they say the drones are used here by the police, they are small and silent, and it's controversial (invasion of privacy issue, etc.). This is not an experience I'd care to have again. I kept looking at the sky there for the next week or so and was able to easily identify the constellations and planets. I saw Halle-Bopp years ago and it didn't freak me out the way this did. I do not have any equipment to photograph things. I only got the 'Net at home this year and am still learning to use it. Any questions? I will try to answer.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by LDN41 on Dec 8th, 2007, 8:38pm

Hi slobo and thanks for sharing your interesting story. I'm a bit confused- did the things you saw look similar to the photos we've seen? Sort of a dragonfly appearance? Also, did your neighbor stick around to watch them until they faded from sight- such a unusual sight, I think I would have (though perhaps she felt uneasy). Have you talked to the neighbor about it since? Why did you find their shimmery quality frightening? I'm not sure what you mean when you say they went in and out of focus- was it because you started to feel woozy/dizzy or did the objects themselves literally go from being in focus to being out of focus (like a camera searching for focus)? You say the craft seemed to be winking at you- were they appearing and then disappearing? If they disappeared did they just blink out or is that what you mean by out of focus- like they faded out and disappeared and then reappeared? What is your last memory before you think you "lost time"? What exactly were you doing- sitting down, walking, what? How do you know you lost time and do you have any idea how much you might have lost? Why did you try to phone a friend (were you scared) and what did you say? I'm confused about something- you say your friend deleted the message because it came from St. Louis and he knows you live in France- I'm not following. Your friend listened to the message right and knew it was from you even though it didn't sound like you? You said he emailed you the next day- so he thought the message was from you right? Or he thought someone from St. Louis was calling him about you? Or? Why did he delete the message?
Anyway, sorry for the tons of questions but I find your experience VERY interesting (and you did say we could ask questions wink ). I personally think we might start seeing a lot of drone reports. Apparently Whitley Strieber is now claiming he saw one. Even if the original photos were fake, I'm starting to think that we might somehow create the form UFOs take when they appear to us. Perhaps something like our collective unconscious is at work. I've heard about people who make crop circles- that they often witness balls of light and experience paranormal phenomena in the circles they create. We're talking about manmade circles, as if these manmade circles can also somehow generate forces we are not typically aware of (though I also believe there are plenty of circles that are not manmade.) Anyway, I'm not saying you did not see what you claim to see- I'm just speculating that perhaps we are somehow creating what is a very real phenomena. That UFOs will start appearing in the form of the drones. I think of the early Kenneth Arnold sightings. He did not see a saucer shape- it was more like a crescent moon shape. But after word got out that it was a saucer shape (a word coined by a reporter because the way the craft moved, "like saucers skipping across water") that's the shape that a ton of early reports initially took (and I think many of those early reports are legit). Or think about the shape of the craft during the airship sightings of over a hundred years ago? Similar to dirgibles. I'm starting to think that ghosts and ufos might emanate from the same source and that whatever evidence we get of these things is what they or their source wants to allow us to get- nothing more. Okay, I'm completely rambling- ! THANKS FOR THE POST slobo! cheesy
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by LDN41 on Dec 8th, 2007, 8:46pm

I just noticed that apparently the word b alls is picked up by the board's naughty word filter. The phrase in my post should read "b alls of light" and not "XXXXX of light" grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Dec 8th, 2007, 9:53pm


That's really childish.

Sorry to see it.


Shech--
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by slobomotion on Dec 9th, 2007, 03:49am

Wow, there are too many questions for me to answer about my sighting, and I don't know how to split the screen and read your questions and answer, but I'll try to remember some of the questions. I was standing up. They seemed to be winking at me because they'd sort of flash on and off, but NOT completely on and off, if that makes sense. I MAY have influenced their appearance and shape. I'd had a weird phone conversation about a touchy subject, and felt paranoid. No, they don't look like the Isaac drones. They look like some drones I saw on YouTube, from 1975 -- there are three of them hovering silently in a daytime sky, and then two of them "demonstrate invisilibity." The ones I saw were kind of bell shaped, and didn't seem very large. They shimmered I think BOTH because I was getting dizzy, and also for reasons I cannot comprehend. You know how when someone holds a video camera shakily? They were moving a little like that. Sort of . . . vibrating! The neighbor is from Africa and speaks French, and I don't really know her, so didn't feel comfortable in engaging in a long conversation with her, nor asking her to stick around in my apartment. After I saw her out, I rang the bell of my other neighbor, and she answered, but said she couldn't come over because she has three little kids to look after, and they weren't asleep yet. I didn't see the black African neighbor again, but the other neighbor, with the kids, who is Arab African, spoke to me next day and said the Black African neighbor had said they did look strange but must have been huge, weird bright stars. (!!) I called my friend in California because I felt as if I were losing consciousness and I was scared, and I couldn't get the UFO Casebook to open and work properly, so I thought he could guide me and calm me down. He has caller ID so when he got the message later and heard a voice saying it was me that was not my voice and that the call was originating from Missouri and not France, he got disgusted, thought it was a prank, then deleted it, but the next day, he decided to email me and mention it. My last memory was, I think, standing in the open window, screaming at the craft. (There were six of them by this point -- two big ones and four tiny ones, just little points of light, but which blurred somehow). I screamed at them in French to leave me alone. I had read that if they are extraterrestrials and not bad ones, if you insist they leave you alone, they will. I had no idea how to phone the police here, and my spouse was at work and can never be reached there (night job in huge airport facility, does not sit at desk with phone and computer and all, no portable phones allowed). I am not sure how much time I lost. The whole experience lasted about two and a half hours but I only seem to remember about 45 minutes of it. I seemed to drift in and out of consciousness. It felt as if everything were going in slow motion, as if I were stuck in a sea of maple syrup. It was hard to even focus my eyes after the initial sighting and the brief visit by the neighbor. (I am glad I at least got a witness, who seemed very uneasy by what we were looking at and when I asked her, "Ca vous parait normale?" she answered, "Non!")
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 9th, 2007, 05:25am

Whitley Strieber recently authorized the following email to be sent to his Unknown Country subscribers list (6th December 2007) and it was emailed on his behalf.

Quote:
This morning at 4:53 AM, Whitley Strieber saw a drone over Santa Monica, California. The Striebers are in California seeing friends, and Whitley has sent me the following email, with permission to publish it. He will write a journal entry about his experience that will be posted on Saturday, December 8.

And remember, there are a lot of people out there lying about the drones and trying to debunk them. But these people ignore ONE THING: Linda's interviews with credible eyewitnesses. Do not be deceived about this.

This was in his email:

Well, in one sense the drones mystery is solved because at 4:53 this morning, I saw one.

I had an extremely restless night, full of complex and astounding dreams that I will record in a journal on my website. They also involved my book the Key and the crop circles, and have led me to a very clear understanding that there is a new level of consciousness available to us now. The dreams lasted from about 3:00 to the moment I woke up and saw the thing outside, which was at exactly 4:53. (I know the times because I sent one of my agents an email at 2:47 about a business matter, then went to bed and was shortly asleep. When I saw the drone, I was looking across the bedroom toward the window, with my wife's lighted clock just visible below the window.)

I woke up lying on my side, and saw the thing moving just below and in the bottom edge of the clouds. It was stormy. The object was enormous, and from where I was lying it must have been no more than a few hundred feet overhead. It appeared almost level with the line of the roof that is visible outside my window. It was moving toward our building at a stately pace, gliding easily, like a dirigible. I had the impression that it was quite large, but obviously, no way to tell for sure. Because of the clouds, I did not see the characteristic tall antennae on it, but I did see structure that looked a lot like what the bicyclists photographed. I immediately woke Anne up and went to the window. But we could not see it from the window.

I looked for a while, trying to see if I could spot some edge of it in the clouds. It had not been moving fast at all, so there was reason to believe it was still there. Not seeing it, I went to the dresser and got my cellphone, which has a camera in it, and put it beside the bed. I then lay down and turned over to the same position I had been in when I first saw it--and there the thing was again, clearly visible just below the cloud cover. Now it was much closer to the house. When I moved my head to get up again, I could no longer see it. When I returned to the original angle, I could see it again. This time, it was gliding west, toward the ocean, only its lower structure visible in the clouds. I opened the cellphone, in an attempt to take a picture of it from that angle, but by then it had passed beyond the edge of the window. I saw nothing more of it, but there is no question in my mind at all but that they are real.


At the time of writing this (Sunday 9th December) his journal has still to be updated and still shows the last entry to be the 27th November. Whitley Strieber has always said he cant prove (and as such didnt know) that the Drones were real and that perhaps the lessons learned from the full experience are more important than the nuts and bolts physical reality of the craft.

Well that all seems to have changed with this latest revelation, the first line of Whitleys recent email states:

Well, in one sense the Drones mystery is solved because at 4:53 this morning, I saw one.

And the last line of the email reaffirms this by stating that:

There is no question in my mind at all but that they <the Drones> are real.

There really is so little information to be gleamed from this brief correspondence thats partly why Ive held off posting anything about it, but since Whitleys self-imposed deadline of the 8th December has come and gone with no sign of him updating his personal journal I thought it prudent to mention it.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Luvey on Dec 9th, 2007, 06:29am

LDN41 wrote
Quote:
I just noticed that apparently the word b alls is picked up by the board's naughty word filter. The phrase in my post should read "b alls of light" and not "XXXXX of light"


Shechaiyah wrote
Quote:
That's really childish.
Sorry to see it.
Shech--


Its a pity that we even have to use a word filter but unfortunately there are those that come to this site to abuse others, and also use words in the wrong context to do so. We are attempting to run a family site here. It is not childish for admin to use a word filter. Unfortunately we must use a word filter to prevent this abuse even though it occasionally interferes with viable postings.

Luvey
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by LDN41 on Dec 9th, 2007, 09:51am

Merci slobo! Your detailed response has given me much to consider. VERY interesting! Thanks again.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Dec 9th, 2007, 1:11pm

on Dec 9th, 2007, 05:25am, DrDil wrote:
There really is so little information to be gleamed from this brief correspondence thats partly why Ive held off posting anything about it, but since Whitleys self-imposed deadline of the 8th December has come and gone with no sign of him updating his personal journal I thought it prudent to mention it.


Is Whitley now trying to come up with a better way to report his sighting? Or maybe he's simply dropping it for business reasons. Many have already come out against Whitley accusing him of using the drone story to drum up subcriptions and generate website hits.

I hope it's real. But at the same time the irony of this seems incredible.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Dec 9th, 2007, 3:02pm

on Nov 27th, 2007, 2:28pm, Marvin wrote:
This is a must see (to fill more time smiley)

It is just over 1 hour... Latitude, this is a mind blower. wink

Be sure to use the full screen feature.


Thunderbolts of the Gods

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4773590301316220374



Very good find Marvin! I encourage everybody in here to watch this video!

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Dec 9th, 2007, 3:16pm

on Dec 9th, 2007, 05:25am, DrDil wrote:
Whitley Strieber recently authorized the following email to be sent to his Unknown Country subscribers list (6th December 2007) and it was emailed on his behalf.



At the time of writing this (Sunday 9th December) his journal has still to be updated and still shows the last entry to be the 27th November. Whitley Strieber has always said he cant prove (and as such didnt know) that the Drones were real and that perhaps the lessons learned from the full experience are more important than the nuts and bolts physical reality of the craft.

Well that all seems to have changed with this latest revelation, the first line of Whitleys recent email states:

Well, in one sense the Drones mystery is solved because at 4:53 this morning, I saw one.

And the last line of the email reaffirms this by stating that:

There is no question in my mind at all but that they <the Drones> are real.

There really is so little information to be gleamed from this brief correspondence thats partly why Ive held off posting anything about it, but since Whitleys self-imposed deadline of the 8th December has come and gone with no sign of him updating his personal journal I thought it prudent to mention it.


Congratulations, DrDil on becoming Global Moderator, now you have the power to throw me out! I'm sure you'll fit the position well.

I personally don't think that Strieber is going for the green...and I am also saying that the California Drones are real.

What would be interesting to know, is if it's possible to find the photographer who took the pictures of the debries lying on the hangar floor, as Isaac provided a picture of? Since it was known in the mid - 80'th, the incident must have happened far before the picture was released to CARET. This picture HAS to be part of a portfolio of some military photographers history. It might be a longshot, but sometimes a tiny straw bring in the harvest!

Just my 2 cents, and as allways, debatable!

VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by murnut on Dec 9th, 2007, 3:22pm

Dr Dil,

Congrats from me as well.

Could not happen to a nicer guy wink

I dont know what to think about these new Whitley Strieber revelations. Some of the original witnesses coming forward or new witnesses willing to step up with photos or media that can be documented, would go a long way.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Dec 9th, 2007, 4:05pm

Perhaps this has to do with the crackling noises heard when a Drone is near?

http://keelynet.wordpress.com/2007/11/13/stopping-cars-with-microwaves/

And maybe not just Alien hardware? Or a technique developed from just that?

Just my 2 cents, and as allways debatable.

VonStern

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by slobomotion on Dec 9th, 2007, 4:29pm

Very interesting, the article on police using microwaves to stop cars. During my encounter with what I think were drones here in France on November 17, 2007, I felt they were "winking" at me. That they saw me. That they knew I was there. That they were trying to tell me something. I became disoriented and felt as though I were "moving through maple syrup." The drones, or whatever they were, were too far away to hear. About ten days ago, we had a problem in our apartment with this weird, annoying humming noise, which only appeared in certain areas of the apartment. It made it hard to sleep, and caused tension. I think we've determined it came from a neighbor's house down the block that is having some work done on it. I am quite familiar with this phenomenon, which is inherently unhealthy if it keeps up for a long time or is used by someone who wants to harm you. So, fortunately, the recent humming noise seems to have nothing to do with my possible drone sighting.
I have become very edgy and paranoid since this experience, and received a couple of messages and I blew them off, saying I don't know who they are and don't want to deal with them. (Especially not anyone who uses Google to translate from French to English and vice versa! Long story . . . ) My apologies go out to this individual, whose messages I deleted earlier today. I do continue to encourage people to ask me questions about what I think were drones, but I want to keep my distance from everyone, and I hope you can understand that.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Dec 9th, 2007, 4:42pm

on Dec 9th, 2007, 4:29pm, slobomotion wrote:
Very interesting, the article on police using microwaves to stop cars. During my encounter with what I think were drones here in France on November 17, 2007, I felt they were "winking" at me. That they saw me. That they knew I was there. That they were trying to tell me something. I became disoriented and felt as though I were "moving through maple syrup." The drones, or whatever they were, were too far away to hear. About ten days ago, we had a problem in our apartment with this weird, annoying humming noise, which only appeared in certain areas of the apartment. It made it hard to sleep, and caused tension. I think we've determined it came from a neighbor's house down the block that is having some work done on it. I am quite familiar with this phenomenon, which is inherently unhealthy if it keeps up for a long time or is used by someone who wants to harm you. So, fortunately, the recent humming noise seems to have nothing to do with my possible drone sighting.
I have become very edgy and paranoid since this experience, and received a couple of messages and I blew them off, saying I don't know who they are and don't want to deal with them. (Especially not anyone who uses Google to translate from French to English and vice versa! Long story . . . ) My apologies go out to this individual, whose messages I deleted earlier today. I do continue to encourage people to ask me questions about what I think were drones, but I want to keep my distance from everyone, and I hope you can understand that.


Hi slobomotion, what made you think, that you saw a Drone like the California Drones?

Did you recognice the shape, or other likenesses related to them?

It is relavant to know, exactly how you percieved the sighting.

Anyway, you are welcome to share your expirience with us here, we will investigate it, and try to find an answer to your sightings.

Greetings,

VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by slobomotion on Dec 9th, 2007, 4:55pm

What I saw on November 17 did not look like Isaac's drones. The ones I saw were smaller and bell-shaped. I wish I knew how to add the YouTube clip I recently saw to this forum, but I don't know how. I was so curious, I looked through lots of drone sightings and got more and more disappointed until bingo, I saw an old video from 1975, in broad daylight, of three silent, hovering bell-shaped metallic type drones, and two of them were demonstrating their invisibility feature. THOSE were 99.99% like what I saw.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Dec 9th, 2007, 5:06pm

on Dec 9th, 2007, 4:55pm, slobomotion wrote:
What I saw on November 17 did not look like Isaac's drones. The ones I saw were smaller and bell-shaped. I wish I knew how to add the YouTube clip I recently saw to this forum, but I don't know how. I was so curious, I looked through lots of drone sightings and got more and more disappointed until bingo, I saw an old video from 1975, in broad daylight, of three silent, hovering bell-shaped metallic type drones, and two of them were demonstrating their invisibility feature. THOSE were 99.99% like what I saw.


You simply copy the link to the right at YouTube that says "URL" and paste it in the "Post" window of your UFO CaseBook posting area.

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by ZETAR on Dec 9th, 2007, 5:52pm

BONJOUR SLOBO,
SA VA BIEN?
I'VE BEEN READING ALONG AND MUST AGREE WITH VON STERN THAT FURTHER INVESTIGATION WILL BENEFIT MANY.
YOU MENTIONED SLOBO THAT THERE WAS SOME INTERDICTION WHICH OCCURED IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD WHERE THE SIGHTING TOOK PLACE.
I ALSO FROM READING THAT FRANCE HAS BEEN A HOT BED WITH RIOTS,CARS BURNED, PROPERTY DAMAGE AND PEOPLE HURT.
I KNOW GOVERNMENTS HAVE THEIR OWN DRONES WHICH ARE USED FOR RECONNAISANCE PRIOR TO SENDING TROOPS OR SECURITE...
HAVE THESE GOVERNMENT DRONES BEEN SEEN OR HAVE YOU HEARD OF THEM WHICH ARE SIMILAR TO U.S VERSIONS.
THEY RANGE IS SIZE ACCORDING TO MISSION PERAMETER.
I AM CURIOUS DUE TO PREVIOUS DRONE SIGHTINGS HAVE HAD DISTINCT DIFFERENCES.
SHALOM...ZETAR cool
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 9th, 2007, 7:31pm

on Dec 9th, 2007, 1:11pm, Latitude wrote:
Is Whitley now trying to come up with a better way to report his sighting? Or maybe he's simply dropping it for business reasons. Many have already come out against Whitley accusing him of using the drone story to drum up subcriptions and generate website hits.

I hope it's real. But at the same time the irony of this seems incredible.

Hi Lat,
Yeah, I know what you mean, perhaps the other most unlikely candidate would have been LMH. I must admit Ive waited patiently without commenting anywhere on it, I cant see any logical motivation for Whitley that would suggest its contrived, as I would have thought it an unnecessary risk to his future earnings, especially at this juncture in his career, irrespective of the short term payoff.

If it wasnt for the fact he said he woke his wife, then the circumstances make it sound like a lucid dream more than a real event. Although he doesnt say she actually saw it:

I immediately woke Anne up and went to the window. But we could not see it from the window.

He then goes on to describe a second sighting of the craft so it will be interesting to see if his wife witnessed it.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 9th, 2007, 7:41pm

Hi VonStern, Murnut and thanks.

I feel the same Murnut, if at least one of the original witnesses could be located and volunteered to be interviewed it would be a major breakthrough, a long awaited turning point.

Vonstern: Im not so sure about the microwave theory as surely the level of radiation generated would lead to poisoning, especially when you consider how close Chads friend must have been to capture the underside of the paddle as he did. Still as has been said many times it could be we are placing human restraints on alien technology.

Regarding the photographer though, if Isaac was able to smuggle out the amount of documentation he claims he has I dont see any reason why others couldnt, I dont think it would be in a portfolio though but I agree that if everything Isaac wrote is true then other people most certainly were privy to the image/s, the items in the images and perhaps even had the opportunity to smuggle them out, but what do you think would be their motivations for risking everything?

Again, according to Isaac it undoubtedly happens, but by the dates provided Isaacs no spring chicken so if any one else did smuggle them out the motivation isnt disclosure or publicity otherwise it should have happened by now.

Also when I read the personal text that Isaac supplied with his documents it certainly seems to be written in the style of someone who is seeking closure rather than disclosure, someone who is weary of his burden and just wanted to ease it and who knows, perhaps his conscience.

It could just be the way I interpret it as I suppose ultimately it's about perception, and perception is an unique, personal and individual tool. smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 9th, 2007, 7:48pm

on Dec 9th, 2007, 4:55pm, slobomotion wrote:
What I saw on November 17 did not look like Isaac's drones. The ones I saw were smaller and bell-shaped. I wish I knew how to add the YouTube clip I recently saw to this forum, but I don't know how. I was so curious, I looked through lots of drone sightings and got more and more disappointed until bingo, I saw an old video from 1975, in broad daylight, of three silent, hovering bell-shaped metallic type drones, and two of them were demonstrating their invisibility feature. THOSE were 99.99% like what I saw.


Hi slobomotion,

This chart may make it easier to relate the shape of what you saw (click on text). Its self explanatory. smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Dec 9th, 2007, 8:18pm

on Dec 9th, 2007, 7:41pm, DrDil wrote:
Hi VonStern, Murnut and thanks.

I feel the same Murnut, if at least one of the original witnesses could be located and volunteered to be interviewed it would be a major breakthrough, a long awaited turning point.

Vonstern: Im not so sure about the microwave theory as surely the level of radiation generated would lead to poisoning, especially when you consider how close Chads friend must have been to capture the underside of the paddle as he did. Still as has been said many times it could be we are placing human restraints on alien technology.

Regarding the photographer though, if Isaac was able to smuggle out the amount of documentation he claims he has I dont see any reason why others couldnt, I dont think it would be in a portfolio though but I agree that if everything Isaac wrote is true then other people most certainly were privy to the image/s, the items in the images and perhaps even had the opportunity to smuggle them out, but what do you think would be their motivations for risking everything?

Again, according to Isaac it undoubtedly happens, but by the dates provided Isaacs no spring chicken so if any one else did smuggle them out the motivation isnt disclosure or publicity otherwise it should have happened by now.

Also when I read the personal text that Isaac supplied with his documents it certainly seems to be written in the style of someone who is seeking closure rather than disclosure, someone who is weary of his burden and just wanted to ease it and who knows, perhaps his conscience.

It could just be the way I interpret it as I suppose ultimately it's about perception, and perception is an unique, personal and individual tool. smiley


Hi DrDil, good to see that you still think.... grin

What I was placing in memory of all here, was if Isaac smuggled out evidence from CARET, couldn't the original photographer own evidence of the provided photo of the debrie in the hangar (Which must have been a part of a copy of a large scale portfolio, made by the officers in charge of the report that was made at military level, long before the pictures was released to CARET?)

What I mean, you don't present CARET or PARC with pictures, unless they are Approved by the origin, which would be the military base, where the debrie was delivered. Or, more likely at a much higher level.

No doubt, there must exsist more than the one hangar picture. Only the one released to us, has reached clearence, at least to CARET.

What I call for, is another "Whistleblower" who might be the original photographer, or his/hers relatives. Someone who might have the original film.

When an incident like this happens, be sure it is documented properly, and several photos had to be included in the portfolio. Remember, it was made to present to high level military security use in the first place.

It sure might be, that it's hidden good, but It's there, or has been.

Anyway, it's not meant for you and me to see, trust me.

Conclusion: There are/has been more evidence. It just might be hidden or destroyed.

VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by slobomotion on Dec 10th, 2007, 04:31am

Hi DrDil, and others. Thank you for showing me the chart of UFO shapes and types. I could not click onto the chart but I noted with a pen what I saw. Lines 3 and 4 were closest, especially around F.
I am not sure I will be able to cut and paste the interesting, very similar drone clips in or not. I do not think my spouse has correctly registered our home computer. I have no idea who our server is or anything. I cannot hook up with most links. They ask for information I do not know. I am getting older and am not experienced with computers. Also, the keyboard and prompts for this computer are in French, and it is very challenging to use. When I push the "help" button it all comes up in French. I do speak the language but it's hard for me. Now, someone else asked me about police acitivity in my nabe. Yes, I have mentioned this. Around Thanksgiving weekend, that is to say November 24, a huge drug bust went down in the housing project near where I live. Drug dealing is a big problem here, always has been, and probably always will be (even after they tear down the project in a couple of years and rebuild there). It was about 6:30 pm on a Saturday evening, and I was out, innocently, to get some cash from a cash dispenser and do a little last minute shopping at the local supermarket, as I wanted to make a nice dinner for my spouse. I have a bad back, so once I got down the block, I sat for a moment on the little bench in a bus shelter, before carrying on with my errands. Right in front of me was a little car, and I was annoyed that those people should be illegally parked and blocking a bus stop. They were four young people, who seemed to be waiting for someone. Just then, I looked up, and across the street and in one of the courtyards of the huge housing project was FULL of cops and cop cars, no sirens, blue lights flashing, people in riot gear and batons running around and busting people, en masse. The four young people in the little car in front of me finally noticed what was going down, and panicked. One of the women screamed, "Oh, merde, ils sont pris!" I tried to signal the police, and not getting any reaction from them, I tried to block the car. Over the next five or ten minutes a protracted altercation went on between myself and these four young people. They threatened to kill me and I just laughed and said, "I'd rather be dead than live in a neighborhood full of criminals like you!" I ended up in the hospital and missed 8 days of work. I am not salaried, so this was very hard for me, and my spouse is very angry with me (also about the drones incident!). I have ruptured kneecaps, sprained, cracked ribs, etc.
Over the next few days, I started researching "drones" on the 'Net, and found out that you can already buy a wide array of them from various manufacturers here. Many are extremely tiny, silent, and they fly themselves. They are useful to the police for observing what is going on in peoples' apartments, on rooftops in housing projects, etc.
I am not sure that what I saw on November 17 were drones. Not at all! But given the big drug bust that went down here a week later, it seems to be a possibility.
I am glad I got a neighbor to be a witness.
You have to understand, I am alone here. I never see my spouse, or almost never. I don't speak French very well. I have no friends or family here. I live in a huge apartment tower in a huge city just outside of Paris, and no way do I mingle with or even know my neighbors, except to say "bonjour." I really doubt I will be able to do any kind of follow-up interview with the neighbor lady who was a witness with me. It's just not gonna happen! I don't even know her name. Various Africans occupy that apartment, and forgive me, but they all look alike to me.
People really keep to themselves here. They are not chatty, they do not smile. It's very different from the culture I knew in the USA (I am from Ohio but lived in NYC for about 17 years). No one talks about UFOs, believe me. Nonetheless, I work part time as a language trainer with adult French business professionals, and several of them know about the drones and say they are highly controversial here, because invasion of privacy is a big deal here.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by slobomotion on Dec 10th, 2007, 05:24am

LDN41's comments and questions are very interesting and thoughtful. Thanks to all of you for your support, questions, thoughts and ideas. I feel much less alone while recovering from a quite bewildering experience on November 17. LDN asked why I was frightened when the objects shimmered. Good question. It was a crystal clear night, and the cold was frightful. You just don't look out your bedroom window and see two UFOs (later, four more) without being nervous, but when they shimmer, the way the highway does on a super-hot day, on such a cold night, THAT makes you nervous. I waved at them, and they started "winking" back at me! Each time I waved, they "winked!" You might say, well, if Slobomition was so scared, why wave at the things? The answer is, I dunno, it was just kind of a hysterical reaction, I suppose. I kept turning my head and trying to blink and "clear" my eyes. I was trying to remember where our little set of binoculars were. (I still haven't found them.) I have always been frustrated in the past when people take shaky videos or photos, or they panic and drop the camera and run, but I am poor and don't have any cameras or anything, and as you know, we do not generally go through our lives thinking, "Oh, maybe I'll meet Bigfoot today! Better be sure my video camera is charged up and operational!" No, that just isn't how life happens. I mean, I had been talking to an old friend on the phone, and I was getting ready to go to bed. I have no idea why I had a hunch that I should look out the window. I just felt that I was being watched! I know, I know, that is SO illogical, right? But I DO have a lot of ESP. I know it, everyone who knows me knows it. People who know me have learned to pay attention to my hunches, and I sure do, too! That does not mean I should run around like a chicken with its head cut off, however. Do I think those could have been stars or planets there that night? YES, it is possible. When ice crystals form in the sky, all sorts of wild things can be seen! But I am pretty familiar with stargazing, I know the constellations as they change in my sky, I know where to look to see planets, I can often identify planets with the naked eye, etc. I've been a member of astronomy clubs, the whole nine yards. The next night and up until now, I now check the sky where I saw those UFOs on September 17, and haven't seen anything like a star or planet around where I saw those six objects. Could I have been drunk? Yes. I'd had a big drink with my dinner a few hours earlier. Could I have had a stroke? Yes. But my neighbor saw them, too! She was sufficiently frightened by what we saw that she went back into her apartment, and I heard her closing all the security shutters (could be she didn't want her kids to see these things and get frightened).
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Dec 10th, 2007, 07:28am

on Dec 9th, 2007, 4:55pm, slobomotion wrote:
What I saw on November 17 did not look like Isaac's drones. The ones I saw were smaller and bell-shaped. I wish I knew how to add the YouTube clip I recently saw to this forum, but I don't know how. I was so curious, I looked through lots of drone sightings and got more and more disappointed until bingo, I saw an old video from 1975, in broad daylight, of three silent, hovering bell-shaped metallic type drones, and two of them were demonstrating their invisibility feature. THOSE were 99.99% like what I saw.


slobomotion... if you send me the title of the You Tube, I will post it for you. smiley


BTW DrDil, congrats! But it sounds like more work to me. grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by slobomotion on Dec 10th, 2007, 07:55am

I shall now try to paste in the YouTube clip which is very, very like what I saw on November 17, although my sighting took place at night. Hope it works.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEgPR61b_9Y
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by slobomotion on Dec 10th, 2007, 07:59am

Hi, Marvin! Thanks for your offer! My spouse was just here and I was able to ask for some technical assistance with adding the clip. First time I've ever done such a thing, and I dunno if I can ever do it again. As I've said, I am not adept with computers, and our 'puter is all in French. The keyboard and software are in French and while I can figure out some of the prompts, I am often very confused by the actual hardware itself. It's so embarrassing! I am 50 years old and have an MBA. I had to learn computer programming, but that was years ago, and doesn't seem to be of much use to me at this point. Believe it or not, I taught an English class at University level here in Paris four years ago, about the history of computers. This was easy, as I'd had to learn all that stuff before. My students were all tekkies and looked at me as if I were a dinosaur, which I am, but when I started to ask them basic questions, such as "what is a parity bit?" they were stumped. Have a good day, everyone!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Dec 10th, 2007, 09:49am

slobomotion,

You might find this interesting:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Billy_Meier

http://thebiggestsecret.online.fr/ufo/billy_meier_smoking_gun.htm

The You Tube you linked, is one of Billy Meier's videos. Personally, I would not classify the craft in his photos as "drone" but I will let you be the judge.

Marvin.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by slobomotion on Dec 10th, 2007, 2:59pm

Hi, Marvin. I am very tired and will go to bed shortly, but I want to thank you for your contact. I was pretty surprised that the clip I saw was from Billy. I thank everyone concerned in this forum for their contact with me, because we, the ordinary people, need some help when we have weird experiences. I think the Billy materials shouldn't be thrown out, but based on all the evidence, they should be seen as questionable. And that is a good thing. Everything should be questioned. I appreciate the questions already given to me by other forum particpants. Here is what I think: Did I see a weird diffraction of light on November 17? Possibly. But I had a witness. She is there, even though in everyday life I could not realistically expect her to respond to further questioning. Did I make all this up to promote any agenda? No, I am just a person, an ordinary person. Could it have been Northern Lights or difraction of light? YES. Could I have been hysterical? Yes, but I have a witness, and she saw it too, and if I "created it" from my psyche, that is something in and of itself that deserves looking into. Look, people, despite the sad conditions of my life, I am not in UFO CASEBOOK to jerk people around or try to get any sort of sympathy or attention. Think: I'd be much better off just looking at the various postings and getting a kick out of all that. But I did see something weird on November 17. If this was a UFO sighting, this would be only the fourth experience of this kind in my life, and I am 50, and have lived on two continents. I respect all the people who participate in this forum. I have posted few times, and have looked around in all the postings, and have criticized only one person or persons in all this time. Here is what I think: I did see something. My neighbor saw it too. It looked like a classic flying saucer thingie to us both. Could it have been northern lights? Yeah, it could have. Was it just my imagination or my desire to post crap? No, as I could produce, if necessary, an impartial witness. What I saw may have been toys floating in the sky. If so, they were about the size of an automobile. That makes me angry. Who would put such things up there, on a calm Saturday night in Paris, France? Did I imagine they were winking at me? That could be, cuz I have a very vivid imagination. Could they have been drones? Possible, because the police did a big bust in my nabe about a week later. But I swear, they were like the UOFs in the clip I shared with you all. And they did seem to be winking at me. And I did have lost time. And I had had a big drink of alcohol that evening, but I was not drunk. Was I paranoid before, based on a telephone conversation? Yeah, I was. I really, really, really think I saw some drones. I don't know if they were from the French police or little green men, I dunno! I just wish it had never happened. I thank God, however, that this forum exists, because it provides a means for me to record my experience. I apologize again to the Forum person who I blew off a couple of days ago, but hopefully this person will understand I am paranoid now, and also, I hate Google translators. I welcome continuing input from you people, and I am willing to put this matter to rest, but dammit, I saw something weird in the skies on November 17, and I have no personal gain involved in any of this. I do wish the best to all the rest of you out there and wish I could treat you all to a fine cup of delicious hot chocolate and a few strong cigarettes here in Paris, and I encourage all of of you around the world to keep looking at the skies and to keep noting what you see, and to share it with others. If we have neutral or good intentions, there is no shame in it. I do not care to openly share my identity, but I am correctly registered in this Forum and will say who I am if need be. Again, I apologize for brushing off the last person who asked me to link up with local French people, but he or she indicated that they were not actually in France, had been asked to check things out, and were using Google translator, and I spooked. Those translators never work!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 10th, 2007, 6:18pm

Hi again Slobomotion,

I think that you are referring to a, Drone in the widely recognized sense of the word, i.e. as unmanned aircraft, known variously as "Drones", "Remotely piloted vehicles (RPVs)", "Unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs) and now, Miniature UAVs (MAVs). The French Ministry of Defence (DGA) are famous for MAVs, the, "Mirador" was a fixed-wing, propeller-driven aircraft 25 centimetres (10 inches) long!!

User Image

Its just that these days on most UFO Related forums if you mention the word, Drone the recent UFO Flap is the first thing the members will think of, more so on this thread as this is the kind of Drone that the title refers to. Funny enough after reading your account last night, I cropped a picture of one of Meiers' Beamships to see if thats what you were referring to, the only reason I didnt post it was Im fairly sure that there has never been three of them captured at the same time (most would argue its as he only made the one model). Anyway as it was one of his crafts you were referring to, here it is:

User Image

Regarding: I do not think my spouse has correctly registered our home computer. I have no idea who our server is or anything. I cannot hook up with most links. They ask for information I do not know. I am getting older and am not experienced with computers. Also, the keyboard and prompts for this computer are in French, and it is very challenging to use. When I push the "help" button it all comes up in French. I do speak the language but it's hard for me.

Its not as bad as you think, if you let me know which Operating System (OS) you are using, e.g. (if windows ME, XPHome, XPPro etc.) then I will be able to help you, unfortunately with most OSs if French is chosen as the primary language then you cant change it to English, the language packs that are available are for software rather than OSs and wont change the language of the prompts. (You can do it, but it requires a reinstall and an OEM disc is required.)

But if you let me know what OS you have then you can still swap the keyboard from an, AZERTY layout to a, QWERTY layout, and it takes less than a minute. (Then you can place little stickers over the keys that are different, e.g. a, Q sticker on the, A key etc.) Do you know/use the keyboard shortcuts? Just PM me if any help is required.

In the meantime, if you print this picture out (click on text) it shows you which keystroke corresponds to what letter on the French keyboard.


Hope this helps smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Xeroid on Dec 11th, 2007, 06:07am

I know that now may not be a good time with all the other chat about French activity.

But I was reading through my copy of the CARET documents and thought it would be interesting to know what FONT was used to create the document. This lead me to consider if there was a "FONT spotter" tool where you could scan a page and have the software tell you what font was unsed in the document.

This may help authenticate the document in terms of when it was written....MAY!

I don't know a whole heap about fonts but there would have been a short list of fonts available back in 1986 before the advent of the modern PC era and the CARENT document would have to use a font from that era to be considered real.

Just a thought.

Cheers
Xeroid


PS: a quick google search on forensic/font/scan/identifcation did not turn anything up.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Dec 11th, 2007, 07:03am

on Dec 11th, 2007, 06:07am, Xeroid wrote:
I know that now may not be a good time with all the other chat about French activity.

But I was reading through my copy of the CARET documents and thought it would be interesting to know what FONT was used to create the document. This lead me to consider if there was a "FONT spotter" tool where you could scan a page and have the software tell you what font was unsed in the document.

This may help authenticate the document in terms of when it was written....MAY!

I don't know a whole heap about fonts but there would have been a short list of fonts available back in 1986 before the advent of the modern PC era and the CARENT document would have to use a font from that era to be considered real.

Just a thought.

Cheers
Xeroid


PS: a quick google search on forensic/font/scan/identifcation did not turn anything up.


Hi Xeroid,

Try these...

http://www.identifont.com/identify.html

http://www.fontexpert.com/feforme.htm

http://ilovetypography.com/2007/08/19/identify-that-font/

http://desktoppub.about.com/od/identifyafont/How_to_Identify_a_Font.htm

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Xeroid on Dec 11th, 2007, 08:25am

Seems I should sharpen up my search skills, excellent work there Marvin smiley

Ok after a quick test of a sample of PACL text from the front cover page, the results are interesting yet inconclusive. As has been the case with this whole saga, nothing found to say HA! got you angry...just another example of perfect creation of a document with fonts that are aged well and used often if we can believe the font tester.

From what I can see, it did a top job spotting the font and multiple hits with the very popular font called: Franklin Gothic.

Sample jpeg from PACL front page:
User Image

Image of results page:
User Image

A little info on the font:
http://www.myfonts.com/products/linotype/franklin-gothic-cd/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franklin_Gothic

Interestinh stuff, I might try another section tomorrow, it's late here.

Regards
Xeroid.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Xeroid on Dec 11th, 2007, 08:54am

I wanted to at least test the body of the document and had these results. After studying the font I noticed the G and H are very unusual so clipped a jpeg test file with those characters and came up with another old and popular font called Palation.

See results below:

test file:
User Image

results- check the H it has a little flick on the outside toe that goes outwards and not on the inside....if that makes sense.
User Image

Info on font:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palatino
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Dec 11th, 2007, 12:11pm

on Dec 3rd, 2007, 05:20am, VonStern wrote:
---o0o---

December Issue:

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/Magazine.html

---o0o---


Thanks VS, for another interesting perspective on our Electric Universe....how many parts are there to this series? I have only looked briefly, but have found no other significant counterparts to the one you posted. Hope all is well smiley


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Dec 11th, 2007, 12:31pm

First.....DrD....congrats on the new elevated status!
I agree with your take on the new "sighting" by Mr. S....a couple of curious observations (which I'm certain occurred to you also). If he is looking out the same window that he was looking out from his bed...why couldn't he see ithuh He would have had a less limited view when at the window. He could have easily duplicated the bed viewing angle when at the window....unless clouds just happened to obscure the "drone" when at the window......seen only from the bed....makes me lean more toward a less-than-conscious experience. Also his perception that it was "enormous" when initially further away and then seemed to be less huge as it seemingly moved closer to his house does not exactly make sense either. Does not sound like his wife saw anything. Not sure what he actually experienced undecided Just another "drone" dud huh
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Nodnunk on Dec 11th, 2007, 12:55pm

on Dec 11th, 2007, 06:07am, Xeroid wrote:
But I was reading through my copy of the CARET documents and thought it would be interesting to know what FONT was used to create the document. This lead me to consider if there was a "FONT spotter" tool where you could scan a page and have the software tell you what font was unsed in the document.

This may help authenticate the document in terms of when it was written....MAY!

I don't know a whole heap about fonts but there would have been a short list of fonts available back in 1986 before the advent of the modern PC era and the CARENT document would have to use a font from that era to be considered real.



You may be interested in this link:

http://lucianarchy.proboards21.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=cali1&thread=1185754594&page=1



Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Dec 11th, 2007, 2:10pm

Here is my DRONE "non-update" of my attempts to get to interview the possible drone witness in Tomball, TX: HELP NEEDED!!!

After many e-mail exchanges with Peter Davenport at NUFORC....I have had no more replies from him to my last several e-mails going back many weeks now. I don't know if he ever contacted the witness or not. Since I was an "unknown quantity" to Peter, he wanted to involve a MUFON investigator....as he has a relationship with MUFON. I told him I was pretty sure MUFON was no longer interested, as they thought it was probably a hoax.....at least this is the last thing I heard.
If anyone here at casebook knows Peter, I would really appreciate a good word.
My only intention is to get an unbiased report from the witness along with a drawing of what he saw (protecting their identity, of course). After which I will would show him some of the drone images to see if that is what he saw or not. If the witness does want to do the interview, that's fine too, but it would be nice for a change for one us here who has followed the drone saga from last May forward to actually be able to interview someone directly......whether it turns out to be a drone craft or not. Any help is appreciated. Sorry for the long delay in reporting back undecided
As many of you know, when working alone (by choice in my case) everything is more of a struggle.....but we can't give up, no matter the outcome.
Best holiday wishes to all!

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Dec 12th, 2007, 12:02am

Hi Cogent:

I have had phone conversations with Peter Davenport and my opinion is that Peter is not an easy person to talk with.

Peter likes his own ideas best. If you bring up a topic that he does not 'own' he can be rather skeptical.

To get along with Peter one has to 'go along' with him.

I sort of gave up on Peter for the time being. But I suppose he is a nice person if you really get to know him.

Douglas
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Dec 12th, 2007, 05:26am

on Dec 11th, 2007, 12:11pm, Cogent1 wrote:
Thanks VS, for another interesting perspective on our Electric Universe....how many parts are there to this series? I have only looked briefly, but have found no other significant counterparts to the one you posted. Hope all is well smiley



Hi Cogent1. Some videos was removed by YT. I have edited my page so it only hold this Documentary:

Ancient Aliens

It's in 5 parts on YT.

Thank you for bringing it to my knowledge.

There are updates here as well:

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/Science.html

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/Paranormal.html

Merry Christmas,

VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by slobomotion on Dec 12th, 2007, 12:29pm

Hello, everyone. I just wanted to explain why this ended up in the "drones" section. Awhile after my sighting on November 17, 2007 here in Saint-Denis, France, I talked to my spouse, looked around a lot on the 'Net, and mentioned this event to some of my trainees. One of them asked me if I knew about "drones" here in France, and I said, no, not really, I know what a drone is, but, no. She said they are used here, and will be used more, and are controversial due to privacy issues. She gave me a link to check, and then, due to my various 'Net searches, I found the clip (now known to me to be associated with the Billy Meier thing, which I had heard about years ago) and wow, THAT was so much like what I saw! I've had nearly a month to absorb all of this, and here are some of my thoughts.
The sighting was frightening. I was scared. I think I may have gone into a state of hysteria during this episode. I am happy that I calmly summoned a neighbor to come and be a witness, and she saw the two UFOs, also, and agreed with me they looked strange. Another member has suggested I may have projected these UFOs, meaning created them with my consciousness. I have read up on this, too, and I think it is possible. I was certainly in a paranoid state of mind due to a long long-distance phone call I'd just had, about The Montauk Project. The "hunch" I had that I was being watched, well, that could be just plain old paranoia, home alone on a cold Saturday night and all. I went to the bedroom window because I had planned to go to bed fairly soon after, and also because I wanted a little fresh air, and because I enjoy looking at the sky, night or day. Could the two craft I saw have been planets or stars, weirdly diffracted in the frosty night sky? Yes. But I remind everyone, that even though I am no expert, I have been a starwatcher for years, and have seen many spectacular displays and anomalies. These two craft were nothing like what I had seen before. They were each the size of about a "Smart" car, but it was and is very hard for me to judge the distance. They seemed to be producing light. They seemed to "wink" at me, and not as stars and planets do sometimes. I also want to say that I live near Le Bourget airport and also see some flight paths to and from CDG Roissy airport, and have seen some odd things over the years, but nothing like THIS. After the neighbor left, and I was unable to get another neighbor to come look (she had kids to look after), I looked again out my window, and saw the two original craft, still there, hovering silently and winking sometimes when I waved at them, but also four other things to the East of them. I started to get truly frightened at this point, because the four other things looked like small points of light that also stretched sometimes to look like rods or bars. The whole "picture" also had an odd, shaky, blurry feel to it. I began to feel very disoriented. The more I tried to focus on the six objects, the harder it became to see them clearly. Could this have been a sickness, such as a mild stroke? Possibly. I am not in great health. I've seen a few doctors since then, have been checked out, and I am fairly okay, I guess. I also had my eyes checked this year and have new glasses. I wish my spouse had been home to witness this with me! We saw an amazing display of UFOs here in Saint-Denis in March, 2002, and he no longer scoffs at the concept. (Many other people saw these things, too, that night, but there was no media coverage of it at all.)
I only began to think they may have been drones after I was assaulted during a police operation in my neighborhood a week later. There is an ongoing problem with drug dealers working in a housing project across the street, a problem of many years, and it is possible I saw some drones which were being used for surveillance purposes. Perhaps my phone call about The Montauk Project had also been picked up on. I was on the phone for about two hours, lost the connection oddly a few times, and could have been listened to and "checked out." I don't know. I wish to repeat, thank you everyone for the respect you have all treated me with, and the kindness. I am usually pretty outspoken, but this weird sighting was scary and I really hesitated to make it public. I am now glad I did. By the way, I would have called the police, but do not know how to do that here, as we've changed phone services this year, and the police here change their phone number sometimes. I also feel that my French would not have been good enough for me to accurately convey the fact that I was being frightened by "ovnis," and that they may have come, told me to go to bed, and left, sending me a bill later (they do that here -- up to three hundred euros is not unheard of!). Sometimes, when I am stressed, I freeze up and can barely speak French. Other times, when stressed, I am completely fluent! Depends. (I find French quite a difficult language, and learning it from near-scratch in middle age has been QUITE a challenge!) Oh, someone asked me about my OS. I think it is Microsoft XP, but not a very new version. Also, I do not need to change my keyboard to QWERTY, as I relearned the AZERTY keyboard here and am now comfortable with that. The reinstalling of the software might be a problem, as my spouse is French mother-tongue and really doesn't want English-language software on the home 'puter. Okay, everyone, thanks again for the kindness you have shown me, and AGAIN, my apologies for blowing off an offer to connect with a French group. I wouldn't be able to communicate with them very well, I fear.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Dec 12th, 2007, 12:49pm


Kewl.

Thanks for sharing your story.

So things are just as weird there, as here. Okay.


Shech--
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 12th, 2007, 2:41pm

Drone Sighting from Whitleys Journal @ UnknownCountry.com

A Most Complex Encounter (Tuesday December 11th, 2007)


Quote:
At 4:53 in the morning on Friday, December 7, I saw a strange object over Santa Monica, California. This was fantastic enough, but the events that preceded the sighting were almost certainly a contact experience. If so, it was the first I have had in years.

<snip>

Almost every night, I wake up between three and four in a state of fear, something that has now been happening to me since my close encounter in December of 1985. But this was special, and it was powerful, and very unusual, as you will see.

I woke up at 4:53 because somebody was clutching two fingers of my right hand, which had been dangling off the bed. Anne was asleep on the other side of the bed.

<snip>

Gliding straight toward the house at what must have been a low altitude was a very complex object that must have been very similar to the 'drones' that were photographed by a number of people last summer. The thing was moving right under and in the cloud cover. It was stormy and the clouds were racing, but the object had a stately, gliding motion that was totally unaffected by the weather.

My immediate thought was that it was a drone. I could not see any of the upper structures that are visible in some of the pictures, but only the body of the thing as it glided toward me. It was not far away at all, maybe just a few hundred feet.

As I got out of bed, I said to Anne, "there's a drone outside the window." We both got up. As I crossed the room to the windows, I grabbed my cellphone in hope of taking a picture. But when we looked out, we could see only the low, rushing clouds.

After a couple of minutes staring at a thickening in the clouds and wondering if that was the object, I went back to bed.

As soon as I put my head on the pillow, I could see the object again, this time moving west toward the ocean. I grabbed the cellphone and woke Anne up again. We rushed to the window and once again saw nothing.

When I lay down again, I could see the object. I finally realized that it was the angle that was enabling me to see the thing, and I went for the cellphone while still lying in the bed. But at that moment, the thing moved beyond the edge of the window, and I never saw it again at any angle.

The most prominent thing that I saw was a white circle on a rectangular object heading directly toward me. It looked exactly like part of one of the pictures taken over Big Basin in Northern California last summer. I have included a clip of what I saw. The only difference is that the circle was facing directly toward me.

<snip>

At about two, I started awake and felt as if I was not going to be able to get back to sleep. So I got up and decided to work. I wrote a few emails, then decided to meditate. I don't often do this in the middle of the night. But this time, when I did it, the sensation was remarkably powerful. I felt as if I could sense much more than my physical body, as if my nerves didn't end in my skin, but extended around me like a living electric field. It was a delightful, wonderful sensation and I stayed there until about three.

This time, the moment my head hit the pillow, I was asleep. At once, I found myself in a really, really peculiar state. The moment I fell asleep, I had a dream that Anne had inexplicably, but out of the kindness of her heart, let a pack of feral dogs into the house, and they were all under the bed.

I was startled awake by this, and went back toward the living room--and was confronted with what was just about the surprise of my life. It almost beat waking up among the visitors on December 26, 1985.

What I saw was a completely different living room. I was in another house, and it was a very strange one, with four large artificial trees in it, of all things. I turned around to go back to the bedroom, only to find that there was a wall there, and a hallway leading off in the opposite direction.

I was shocked, to put it mildly. Then horrified. I couldn't get out of there. I couldn't get back where I belonged.

Then I was in bed again, and aware that I was asleep, and not only that but I was dreaming about the lives of five different Whitley Striebers unfolding in five parallel universes at the same time, one of which was the one I was in.

While this was happening, the five of them were distinct, and I was inside five different selves at once. There was no confusion, and I wasn't on the outside looking in. I was in these lives, living them, all at the same time. I wasn't in the least confused by this. It seemed extraordinary, of course, but also perfectly possible.

In four of these lives, Anne was also present, but not in the fifth, and that was a life I very much wanted to leave. In it, I was walking down a path with a small boy, toward a quay where there were a number of men. The quay was on a pellucid bay, its water an exquisite turquoise-green color. It was daytime in this universe, midday. In this universe, Anne had died of her stroke, and I was walking with my grandson, who was about three.

In another, Anne and I lived in my old family home in San Antonio. It was very worn and run down, and she was bravely trying to clean the kitchen. We were obviously very poor, and clinging to what once had been fine. Here, it was late afternoon.

In a third, we were living together and in an apartment. We were asleep in this universe, and the dogs were under the bed. It was in this universe that the fingers had grasped my hand and were tugging at it.

When I woke up and went to the window, it might well have been in this other universe, which was a close approximation to the one I am living in now. But, to tell the truth, since that night, I don't feel all that fixed anywhere. I am not sure where I am, only that my life is unfolding.

The fourth universe was the one where the trees were in the living room. They were decorative, and the fashion, I was aware, had been adopted from pictures from another world. What was so exciting here was that TV transmissions from another planet were being picked up and rebroadcast by SETI, and they were a gigantic sensation.

This all ended with the yanking on my hand, the awakening at 4:53 and the observation of the drone outside the window.

So this experience actually crossed waking and dream. The first time I got out of bed and walked into the living room and saw the trees, I was wide awake and actually moving across realities physically. Then, when I slept and dreamed, the realities unfolded around me. When I saw the drone, I was possibly in yet another universe, different from this one.

<snip>



--------------------------------

To read the full account then check out Whitleys journal entry for the 11th December.

In the meantime Ill leave you with a true pearl of wisdom from Mr Strieber (and one that he goes on to answer in the journal entry).
--------------------------------



Quote:
So the logical question, at least to me, is this: how could anyone even write such far-fetched nonsense, let alone believe that it really happened?

<snip>

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Dec 12th, 2007, 2:48pm


This posting is in the WRONG PLACE.

It belongs in the Inter-Dimensional thread. He's doing parallel realities, that's all.

Perfectly understandable.

Right?


Shech--


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 12th, 2007, 3:23pm

on Dec 12th, 2007, 2:48pm, Shechaiyah wrote:
This posting is in the WRONG PLACE.

It belongs in the Inter-Dimensional thread. He's doing parallel realities, that's all.

Perfectly understandable.

Right?

Shech--


Cheers Shech, but I think Ill leave it here as the parallel realities he mentions seem to be a sleep induced, dream-state precursor to his Drone sighting.

In fact to a more cynical reader, the parallel reality could be considered a disclaimer of sorts, i.e.

Quote:
The first time I got out of bed and walked into the living room and saw the trees, I was wide awake and actually moving across realities physically. Then, when I slept and dreamed, the realities unfolded around me. When I saw the drone, I was possibly in yet another universe, different from this one.

In short he doesnt discount the fact that his Drone sighting occurred in a different reality/universe, ultimately making it impossible to substantiate that any of this occurred outside of the confines of his mind, let alone in a reality as we know it.

(Who knows, perhaps you and I are simultaneously discussing this in another reality, another universe, another forum and on the, Inter-Dimensional thread. wink)
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 12th, 2007, 3:50pm

Hi Xeroid, as well as the link that Nodnunk posted there was quite a bit of research done into the font at OMF just after the Isaac documents were released, Ill see if I can find the link for you.

Thanks for the kind words Cogent1 & Marvin. Unfortunately I havent any contact with Peter Davenport nor know of anybody who has, and it sounds like Urantia was admirably diplomatic in the explanation of his experiences with him.

Regarding Whitleys sighting, I had a feeling it would not be as cut and dried as simply, "another UFO sighting," so I didnt cast an overly analytical eye over his account, but I too had similar questions.

It has since transpired that the entire experience could well have been in an alternate universe..............
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Dec 12th, 2007, 4:11pm

on Dec 12th, 2007, 3:50pm, DrDil wrote:
Thanks for the kind words Cogent1 & Marvin.


Click on an emoticon:

grin

rolleyes

tongue

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Dec 12th, 2007, 4:26pm

Dr. Dil, I was kidding.

I can always refer somebody here to see this posting because it's right up my alley; but it's a Drones topic so it goes >here<

Please don't take me so literally, Luv.


:hug:

Shech--


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Dec 12th, 2007, 5:29pm

Thanks CB peeps. Finally a place that has it's collective head screwed on properly. I'm really ticked off by this Whitley so called sighting. He's either part of the "plan" or he's simply trying tell sell more of his esoteric books.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Dec 12th, 2007, 5:34pm


Maybe so, maybe not.

Maybe he's just "way far out there," like some of us.

I have had NOT DISSIMILAR experiences; it's no big deal.


Shech--
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Dec 12th, 2007, 5:47pm

on Dec 12th, 2007, 5:34pm, Shechaiyah wrote:
Maybe so, maybe not.

Maybe he's just "way far out there," like some of us.

I have had NOT DISSIMILAR experiences; it's no big deal.


Shech--


Maybe I never understood his place in ufology. I guess we won't be seeing him up on the panel with Fife and Fox. I'm not ready for this side of the subject. Neither is the rest of the world.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Dec 12th, 2007, 5:51pm


I don't try to testify to what the rest of the world does or doesn't need.

I just keep my nose to the grindstone, that's all.


Shech--


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 12th, 2007, 6:34pm

on Dec 12th, 2007, 4:26pm, Shechaiyah wrote:
Dr. Dil, I was kidding.

I can always refer somebody here to see this posting because it's right up my alley; but it's a Drones topic so it goes >here<

Please don't take me so literally, Luv.

:hug:

Shech--


No worries Shech, I must be slipping as I thought it was a literal question rather than in jest. smiley

on Dec 12th, 2007, 4:11pm, Marvin wrote:
Click on an emoticon: tongue

(Touch)User Image
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Dec 12th, 2007, 7:04pm

on Dec 12th, 2007, 6:34pm, DrDil wrote:
(Touch)User Image



grin grin grin
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Dec 12th, 2007, 7:11pm

on Dec 12th, 2007, 5:29pm, Latitude wrote:
Thanks CB peeps. Finally a place that has it's collective head screwed on properly. I'm really ticked off by this Whitley so called sighting. He's either part of the "plan" or he's simply trying tell sell more of his esoteric books.


I have always had the feeling that Whitley's books were fiction.....all of them.

Douglas
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 12th, 2007, 7:36pm

on Dec 12th, 2007, 5:29pm, Latitude wrote:
Thanks CB peeps. Finally a place that has it's collective head screwed on properly. I'm really ticked off by this Whitley so called sighting. He's either part of the "plan" or he's simply trying tell sell more of his esoteric books.

If it is orchestrated in any way then I certainly think its a misguided approach irrespective of his motivations. Its strange that the journal entry was posted three days after it was initially stated it would be. It could simply be Whitley collecting his thoughts but it could just as easily be misconstrued as Whitley making sure every base was covered, especially as he doesnt mention the previous mailing to his list or the delay in posting the report to his journal.

on Dec 12th, 2007, 7:11pm, urantia606 wrote:
I have always had the feeling that Whitley's books were fiction.....all of them.

Douglas

I thought you would approve of them Urantia, do you think it is intentional fiction or wrote in the belief that this is how they were perceived and thus related?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Dec 12th, 2007, 8:40pm


I believe everybody who bares their soul.

None of us make a dime off telling our truths.

In the past year I have received $35 in donations and $270 in expenses.

There's no profit in truth-telling, only costs.


Shech--
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Dec 12th, 2007, 9:54pm

Happy Holidays Dr. Dil:

I really think that Whitley's books are intentional fiction.

Now he have his 'oh so convenient' sightings of the elusive Drones. Next he'll write a book, appear on all the talk shows and we all know the rest of his plan. He may as well cash in while it's a hot topic.

I just have a gut feeling that this is Whitley's modus operandi.

A former editor of the Los Angeles Times did the same thing a few years ago.

How do you feel about this, Dr. Dil?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by ZETAR on Dec 12th, 2007, 10:33pm

THE TRAGEDY WITH MUCH OF OUR ENDEAVER IS THAT THE OPPURTUNISTS SET OUT ON THE BOOK TOUR FOR THAT NICHE MARKET.
WE WONDER WHY WE DON'T GET NATIONAL ATTENTION OR MEDIA COVERAGE...WELL THE OPPURTUNISTS HAVE BURNED SO MANY WHOM WERE TEMPTED TO COVER OUR PLIGHT UNTIL IT WAS DISCOVERED THAT THE AUTOPSY OR FRAGMENT OR WHATEVER...EVEN WITNESS WAS TOTAL FABRICATION.
THE LAST THING REASONBLY APPROACHING THIS TOPIC WAS PETER JENNINGS SPECIAL AND SOON AFTER WHAT... HIS CANCER RESURFACES.
YEAH...THE LAST LARRY KING INTERVIEW OF THE PILLARS OF THE UFO COMMUNITY AND POLITICAL CONVERTS/OBSERVERS BROACHED THE DRONE TOPIC BUT IT BASICALLY WENT WHOOSH WITH NO RECOGNITION.
WHITLEY IS JUST LIKE MANY AND SAW A MARKET AND TOLD HIMSELF ...IF I DON'T DO IT ...SOMEBODY ELSE WILL SO WHY NOT GET THE CHA-CHING....
AT LEAST HE'S NOT WILLING TO SHUN THE ASPECT OF THE EXISTENCE SO I'LL RESERVE MY OPINION UNTIL I SEE HIS WORK PRODUCT.
IT WILL BE THEN THAT I COULD MAKE AN ASSESSMENT AS TO HIS SERIOUSNESS OR CAPITALISTIC INCLINATION.
IT MIGHT BE AT THAT POINT ISSAC MAY ELECT TO SURFACE FOR TO CORRECT OR AN ADENDUM OR OTHER WITNESSES IN THE LOOP MAY DECIDE IT'S TIME FOR DISCLOSURE wink
SHALOM...ZETAR
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Dec 13th, 2007, 12:11pm

on Dec 12th, 2007, 12:02am, urantia606 wrote:
Hi Cogent:

I have had phone conversations with Peter Davenport and my opinion is that Peter is not an easy person to talk with.

Peter likes his own ideas best. If you bring up a topic that he does not 'own' he can be rather skeptical.

To get along with Peter one has to 'go along' with him.

I sort of gave up on Peter for the time being. But I suppose he is a nice person if you really get to know him.

Douglas


Dougster....thanks for the input.....I fully agree.....I guess we all have our own agendas.....I have one more trick up my sleeve before I give up on this one though. I'll let everyone know how it goes. It's a shame people can't work together to solve this case...No matter, I press on.
Cheers to all!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 13th, 2007, 12:26pm

on Dec 12th, 2007, 9:54pm, urantia606 wrote:
Happy Holidays Dr. Dil:

I really think that Whitley's books are intentional fiction.

Now he have his 'oh so convenient' sightings of the elusive Drones. Next he'll write a book, appear on all the talk shows and we all know the rest of his plan. He may as well cash in while it's a hot topic.

I just have a gut feeling that this is Whitley's modus operandi.

A former editor of the Los Angeles Times did the same thing a few years ago.

How do you feel about this, Dr. Dil?

Hi Urantia and I hope you have a great Christmas, to be fair I havent read enough of Whitleys novels to offer an informed opinion, however from what I have read and know, I certainly would agree that Whitley is a very shrewd businessman.

Still, irrespective of what his critics say they cant deny the fact that he almost single-handedly dragged the entire abduction phenomenon out into full view of the public, and also gave it a face, the image of the Grey on the front of Communion.

It has been mentioned in the past (and again quite recently) that this personification is greatly influenced by Aleister Crowleys sketch of his invisible mentor from the, Secret Chiefs (said to be transcendent cosmic authorities) a being that he called, LAM.

User Image

I believe its a possibility, and if the parallels that are drawn between them are to be considered, it still doesnt mean the similarities are an intentional act of plagiarism or deception. Perhaps they have been ingrained subliminally, received on a subconscious level before being unknowingly regurgitated as sort of a culturally adapted and sociologically refined modern day, Alien.

But regarding Whitleys recent Drone sighting Ive never really placed any value on it since I first learned of it, but that probably says more about me than Mr. Strieber..
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Dec 13th, 2007, 12:31pm

on Dec 12th, 2007, 3:50pm, DrDil wrote:
Hi Xeroid, as well as the link that Nodnunk posted there was quite a bit of research done into the font at OMF just after the Isaac documents were released, Ill see if I can find the link for you.

Thanks for the kind words Cogent1 & Marvin. Unfortunately I havent any contact with Peter Davenport nor know of anybody who has, and it sounds like Urantia was admirably diplomatic in the explanation of his experiences with him.

Regarding Whitleys sighting, I had a feeling it would not be as cut and dried as simply, "another UFO sighting," so I didnt cast an overly analytical eye over his account, but I too had similar questions.

It has since transpired that the entire experience could well have been in an alternate universe..............


DrD, I have to agree. If any of Whitley's exotic/ethereal experiences actually happened as experienced.....that would be quite remarkable.....in any Universe wink
Who knows....we search for some absolute truth....yet everything we think we know is based on necessarily unprovable assumptions.....lest we have no starting point at all cool
"After all, I think it's the search that is important." said the Petri dish to the supercomputer....
Ciao for now.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Shechaiyah on Dec 13th, 2007, 12:59pm

I'm not going for the goal of attracting attention to myself.

All I want to do is to get other people thinking, on their own initiatives. Let others take their time and do the work, for me.

That leaves me anonymous, so I can work in peace.

: ) Shech--


on Dec 12th, 2007, 10:33pm, ZETAR wrote:
THE TRAGEDY WITH MUCH OF OUR ENDEAVER IS THAT THE OPPURTUNISTS SET OUT ON THE BOOK TOUR FOR THAT NICHE MARKET.
WE WONDER WHY WE DON'T GET NATIONAL ATTENTION OR MEDIA COVERAGE...WELL THE OPPURTUNISTS HAVE BURNED SO MANY WHOM WERE TEMPTED TO COVER OUR PLIGHT UNTIL IT WAS DISCOVERED THAT THE AUTOPSY OR FRAGMENT OR WHATEVER...EVEN WITNESS WAS TOTAL FABRICATION.
THE LAST THING REASONBLY APPROACHING THIS TOPIC WAS PETER JENNINGS SPECIAL AND SOON AFTER WHAT... HIS CANCER RESURFACES.
YEAH...THE LAST LARRY KING INTERVIEW OF THE PILLARS OF THE UFO COMMUNITY AND POLITICAL CONVERTS/OBSERVERS BROACHED THE DRONE TOPIC BUT IT BASICALLY WENT WHOOSH WITH NO RECOGNITION.
WHITLEY IS JUST LIKE MANY AND SAW A MARKET AND TOLD HIMSELF ...IF I DON'T DO IT ...SOMEBODY ELSE WILL SO WHY NOT GET THE CHA-CHING....
AT LEAST HE'S NOT WILLING TO SHUN THE ASPECT OF THE EXISTENCE SO I'LL RESERVE MY OPINION UNTIL I SEE HIS WORK PRODUCT.
IT WILL BE THEN THAT I COULD MAKE AN ASSESSMENT AS TO HIS SERIOUSNESS OR CAPITALISTIC INCLINATION.
IT MIGHT BE AT THAT POINT ISSAC MAY ELECT TO SURFACE FOR TO CORRECT OR AN ADENDUM OR OTHER WITNESSES IN THE LOOP MAY DECIDE IT'S TIME FOR DISCLOSURE wink
SHALOM...ZETAR

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Dec 13th, 2007, 4:10pm

Some of you may not know that Peter Davenport was not allowed on the Coast to Coast radio show for several years because he requested that he be paid for his appearances. I could be wrong but I believe he requested the sum of $2,500 per appearance. Art Bell and C2C told him, "no thank you".

Several years later Peter agreed to appear gratis as he had before.


Douglas
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Dec 13th, 2007, 4:22pm

--o0o--

I have added a new page to VonStern Magazine:

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/MagazineLinks.html

I hope it will bring new thoughts and items of discussion to the board. Might be off-topic at the moment, but worth a look.

Carry on the good work,

VonStern

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by raska on Dec 13th, 2007, 4:51pm

DrDil: Congratulations on your new title ! i'm sure you'll moderate nicely cheesy
Since you're already around Christmas time here, Happy holydays to all here or in other universes.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Dec 13th, 2007, 5:07pm

on Dec 13th, 2007, 12:59pm, Shechaiyah wrote:
I'm not going for the goal of attracting attention to myself.

All I want to do is to get other people thinking, on their own initiatives. Let others take their time and do the work, for me.

That leaves me anonymous, so I can work in peace.

: ) Shech--




Hi Shech, what you say is what (most of us) do..work alone...and are anonomous...and not drawing attention to our selves.

But sharing anything, sightings, pictures and even thoughts makes us a vast bank of knowledge, even if we does not hit the head of the nail....

It takes only a great mind to share, and a closed mind to withold.

The beauty of it all, we are "incognito".

That doesn't mean that what we share are irrelavant...not at all!

I appreciate your view on topics just as much as I do the same when I present an issue here.

Anyone who find they have something to share are welcome to contribute to the debate, as the issue are debatable in the Forum, and hence it's given anonomously, no personal approach should be taken seriously, if it happens.

So, give it your best shot,

--VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 13th, 2007, 6:01pm

on Dec 13th, 2007, 4:51pm, raska wrote:
Happy holydays to all here or in other universes.

Hi Raska and thanks, I wish you and yours all the best for the festive season. smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Dec 15th, 2007, 5:13pm

Hi All,

VonStern Magazine closes monthly updates and will only update the link section in 2008.

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/MagazineLinks.html

I thank all who supported me. It has been a pleasure sharing my views on this phenomena.

Happy Holidays to you all,

VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 16th, 2007, 09:13am

on Dec 15th, 2007, 5:13pm, VonStern wrote:
Hi All,

VonStern Magazine closes monthly updates and will only update the link section in 2008.

http://vonstern.homepage.dk/MagazineLinks.html

I thank all who supported me. It has been a pleasure sharing my views on this phenomena.

Happy Holidays to you all,

VonStern


Hi VonStern, its been a pleasure reading your views on the subject!!

Regarding, "VonStern Magazine," it seems a shame to, Close shop this soon after getting started.

Why not just provide a monthly update as a links page, you could perhaps link to anything related that has interested you over the past month. Also, I hope that this doesnt signify the end of your contributions to UFOCasebook as your comments were always well received and thought provoking. And just because the Drone flap appears to be over (for the minute) it may be as Latitude has always said, i.e. that the phenomenon will return in the coming May.

Either way there is so much to the UFO phenomenon with or without the inclusion of the Drones that has, does and will provide much scope for discussion. (It just appears that your last post was a, Farewell such was its suggested finality and I sincerely hope this isnt the case.)

Happy Holidays and I wish you all the best in your search for answers smiley

User Image


User Image wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Dec 17th, 2007, 04:45am

on Dec 16th, 2007, 09:13am, DrDil wrote:
Hi VonStern, its been a pleasure reading your views on the subject!!


Happy Holidays and I wish you all the best in your search for answers smiley



Thank you DrDil - and I'll still be here, it's too interesting a subject to leave behind.

It's just that I will be a very busy person in the new year, and I've promised my family to cut down on my hobby - cheesy

When I feel a subject is relavant I sure will post special issues when and if they occur, just not on a monthly schedule.

Happy Holidays to you too,

VonStern


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Dec 17th, 2007, 2:36pm

Thank you VonStern for your hard work and dedication, you and your family deserve a break but gee it sure gets addicting. grin

I for one, will keep reading if you find the time to post. smiley

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Cogent1 on Dec 17th, 2007, 11:25pm

on Dec 17th, 2007, 04:45am, VonStern wrote:
Thank you DrDil - and I'll still be here, it's too interesting a subject to leave behind.

It's just that I will be a very busy person in the new year, and I've promised my family to cut down on my hobby - cheesy

When I feel a subject is relavant I sure will post special issues when and if they occur, just not on a monthly schedule.

Happy Holidays to you too,

VonStern



Sorry to see you cutting back....but family is very important....can't blame you for that! I have enjoyed your monthly magazine and your postings here. I look forward to chatting again here at casebook in the near future. You and your family have a wonderful Holiday Season and Happy New Year.
Sometimes I think it IS the journey that is most important.....Cogito ergo miro cool And WONDER is what it is all about! Take care smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Dec 18th, 2007, 4:56pm

Contact with one of the drone witnesses has been made.

http://lucianarchy.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=cali1&action=display&thread=1198011120&page=1
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 18th, 2007, 6:19pm

on Dec 18th, 2007, 4:56pm, Latitude wrote:
Contact with one of the drone witnesses has been made.

http://lucianarchy.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=cali1&action=display&thread=1198011120&page=1

Cheers for the heads up Lat. Ive just read it and in my opinion only good can come of it. Whether thats to draw out another witness or perhaps convince LMH to release what she has or even just to further confirm or remove a witness from the list, they are all positive scenarios.

First Okuda and now Shirley, it seems the Drones are still being constantly injected with new information, oh and great work by the OMRT!!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Dec 19th, 2007, 09:58am

Thanks.

We hope to get more info out to the public soon. Some aspects of this are still to be worked out. Shirley is just as curious about the drones as we are.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by drewlac on Dec 19th, 2007, 10:27am

Can anyone help me find the postings with i believe Langlee did regarding him finding the street corner of in Cap were Raj took his photos? I'm not having much luck with the search option

Edit: nvm, i found it cheesy
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Dec 19th, 2007, 3:33pm

The closer Science investigates, the closer we are to finding God!
Did it ever occur to you, that it might be the same goal Believers and Science has, because what are we REALLY looking for?
The clever ones say: An answer!
Yes, we are looking for an answer, and we might be disillusionated, because it just might be the one and the same answer!
What if, our entire universe is created by one God?
Has HE provided us with all that we care about, all we hold, all we charish, all we think as Holy?
Has HE created all OUR world in Seven Days?
AND how did he do it?
Who's to know? And are we meant to know? What will
happen when we find the truth?
If this does not arise questions, why shouldn't the few sightings of a Drone arise similar questions?

Or what will follow, if we have to have a new understanding of Our Earthly
Lives.

--o0o--
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6XroLiUSt8

Big Machines Parked In Orbit -
Black Ops, Star Wars Or ET?
--o0o--

Just a Christmas essay from me...

VonStern
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by ghostrider on Dec 21st, 2007, 07:18am

The next time you see something flapping in the breeze on an overhead power line, squint a little harder. It may not be a plastic bag or the remnants of a party balloon, but a tiny spy plane stealing power from the line to recharge its batteries.

The idea comes from the US Air Force Research Lab (AFRL) in Dayton, Ohio, US, which wants to operate extended surveillance missions using remote-controlled planes with a wingspan of about a metre, but has been struggling to find a way to refuel to extend the plane's limited flight duration.

So the AFRL is developing an electric motor-powered micro air vehicle (MAV) that can "harvest" energy when needed by attaching itself to a power line. It could even temporarily change its shape to look more like innocuous piece of trash hanging from the cable.

more:

http://technology.newscientist.com/article/dn13093-spy-planes-to-recharge-by-clinging-to-power-lines.html

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by slobomotion on Dec 21st, 2007, 3:32pm

Ghostrider, your posting is very illuminating.
I have appreciated the input from others on this Forum with regard especially to my sighting here in Saint-Denis, France, on November 17, 2007, of what may have been some drones a week prior to a big drug bust in my nabe.
I am considering filing a formal statement with my local police. Why not? I did it around Thanksgiving, a week after my sighting, when I was injured during the afore-mentioned drug bust, an innocent bystander out to do my shopping. I could do it again, that is, report something. I just don't have the cracked ribs and dislocated kneecap as I did from the assault! I just have a frightened feeling.
Does anyone advise me AGAINST this? I wonder if the Men in Black will show up?
I did get an impartial witness, a neighbor, to look at what I saw. She saw the two craft, too. I later saw four more, that evening, but they had different aspects.
What I don't like is that I feel fearful after this experience. I've had three other experiences in my lifetime, two others with my current spouse, and they were kind of wondrous events in their own disturbing way. This last one scared me, however.
My very best regards to you all, and best wishes for 2008.
I've seen some odd stuff on this site, some fluff, shall we say, but it seems to be a well managed site where people can speak up and share.
By the way, I did see some odd things in the sky around 4 am recently but am sure they were planets distorted in a frosty sky. Looked like vertical rods, yet I do not think they were craft or drones or anything. Very, very different from my November 17 sighting.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Dec 23rd, 2007, 8:02pm


Britain set to release secret UFO files

Published: Dec. 23, 2007 at 4:24 PM

<http://www.upi.com/img/stories/largetype_btn.png>
<http://www.upi.com/img/stories/smalltype_btn.png>

LONDON, Dec. 23 (UPI) -- The British government will soon release previously classified details regarding hundreds of reported sightings of unidentified flying objects.

The Sunday Telegraph said Sunday that this coming spring, the Defense Ministry will release to the general public 160 files about alleged UFO sightings.

Since the British government department began keeping records about the unusual reports in 1950, more than 10,000 sightings have been recorded.

With officials failing to explain 5 percent of those sightings, a growing number of Freedom of Information requests prompted the release of the classified information.

A former head of the Defense Ministry UFO project told the newspaper that no matter what an individual believes regarding UFOs, the released files should prove to be interesting reading.

"Whatever people think about UFOs, these documents are fascinating and show how the MoD has researched and investigated this mystery for nearly 60 years, without an answer," former department official Nick Pope said.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Dec 24th, 2007, 1:37pm

on Dec 23rd, 2007, 8:02pm, urantia606 wrote:
Britain set to release secret UFO files

Published: Dec. 23, 2007 at 4:24 PM

<http://www.upi.com/img/stories/largetype_btn.png>
<http://www.upi.com/img/stories/smalltype_btn.png>


*yawn* No need to get excited. You can bet there won't be any disclosure inducing revelations in it. All of the real good stuff is still classified or simply missing.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by becker44 on Dec 26th, 2007, 07:00am

Any idea if this may be related to the drones? Towards the end of the 4:19 sec clip the object transforms. Some help translating the dialogue may be useful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KervfF5aDhk

Becker
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by nekitamo on Dec 26th, 2007, 07:59am

Interesting find, indeed it changes its shape towards the end. Is that what all that yelling is about?
User Image
Btw, what's portuguese word for kite? Is someone calling it that way in the video?

Google translation of the video description - Quote:
A strange object that will light of day, crossed the sky in the northern part of Sao Paulo, in the neighborhood of Garden Brasil.Isto occurred during the time that we spoke a lot in such a "chupa Goat." See that no one can say that it is a balloon, he, in his path makes some attempts to keep open its 12 claws, so far, as saying that the police - "has exito"

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Dec 26th, 2007, 12:19pm

It all depends on what path this object took. The description says it crossed the sky. That to me may describe a balloon. Were going to need much more information to speculate further. BTW, I don't see any drone characteristics in this. IMO too many people are looking for drones in every ufo sighting.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by nekitamo on Dec 26th, 2007, 2:30pm

What do you mean with "drone characteristics"?

IMO calling something "a drone" is not about its shape, but about it being "manned" or not. If it seems "unmanned", why not...
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Dec 26th, 2007, 9:05pm

on Dec 26th, 2007, 2:30pm, nekitamo wrote:
What do you mean with "drone characteristics"?

IMO calling something "a drone" is not about its shape, but about it being "manned" or not. If it seems "unmanned", why not...


Well, strictly speaking you are correct. What I meant by "drone characteristics" is that it shares characteristics of the California Drones. Like the wires sticking out the top or the toroidal rings or the thin asymmetric arms. I can see none of those in this video. But who knows? Maybe if we had a closer view.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Dec 26th, 2007, 9:25pm

on Dec 26th, 2007, 07:59am, nekitamo wrote:
Interesting find, indeed it changes its shape towards the end. User Image



I am not so sure it is changing shape. On edge, the upper section will appear more disk like until it passes over, reveling the true nature of the spikes. It appears to be the angle of view, that is critical to the shape we see.

I am not seeing a connection to the Drones at least not by morphology.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by nekitamo on Dec 28th, 2007, 03:58am

on Dec 26th, 2007, 9:25pm, Marvin wrote:
I am not so sure it is changing shape. On edge, the upper section will appear more disk like until it passes over, reveling the true nature of the spikes. It appears to be the angle of view, that is critical to the shape we see.

It does seem like it changes shape, but it's hard to tell for sure. Here's a stabilized and slightly enlarged version by spf33:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Z2tkh59FISM

Quote:
I am not seeing a connection to the Drones at least not by morphology.

Although we've learned that drones are modular and come in many different configurations (including some with "spikes"), you seem to dismiss this one so easily. Why? Do you know better?

Sorry if this "desecrates the holly Drones" topic for some of you, but IMO this subject deserves some research. I'm following the drones case since its beginning and it has gathered/educated quite a few skilled and independent researchers here and at some other forums. There's been such scrutiny and reaching for straws so remote to the actual topic that becker44's mentioning of this case should be nothing out of the ordinary here.

What happened, have you lost the spirit of early days? However, at least the aforementioned body of researchers was informed about this case, so they can pursue it elsewhere if it's not welcome here.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Dec 28th, 2007, 10:27am

on Dec 28th, 2007, 03:58am, nekitamo wrote:
Although we've learned that drones are modular and come in many different configurations (including some with "spikes"), you seem to dismiss this one so easily. Why? Do you know better?

Sorry if this "desecrates the holly Drones" topic for some of you, but IMO this subject deserves some research. I'm following the drones case since its beginning and it has gathered/educated quite a few skilled and independent researchers here and at some other forums. There's been such scrutiny and reaching for straws so remote to the actual topic that becker44's mentioning of this case should be nothing out of the ordinary here.

What happened, have you lost the spirit of early days? However, at least the aforementioned body of researchers was informed about this case, so they can pursue it elsewhere if it's not welcome here.


I think it's safe to say the we are very interested in this new "spikey" ufo. I don't think anybody has lost their spirit to search for the truth of the drones. The fact that we are scrutinizing this new sighting shows that we are very interested. I welcome anything you bring to this forum. You have always shown a good balance in your objectivity. The fact that some of us so far see no resemblance to the California drones does not diminish it one bit. Surely there are many different types of UFOs from what I believe to be many different sources. There are probably multiple sources that use "drones". Nobody has ever proven that the Alabama drone is related to the Cali-drones. It is very evident however, that the Chad, Raj, Shirley, Tahoe, Steven, Ty and Isaac drones are from the same source.

If anybody can show why this new object is related to the cali-drones, please feel free to point it out. I for one would welcome such research.

You are so correct that a few are very guilty of grasping for straws. It pains me when I see it and think it is nothing but obfuscation.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by motorcyclerick on Dec 28th, 2007, 11:39am

I for one can not help but wonder why ( if this 'drone' has been seen many times by the person who took the photos ) haven't they submitted any video or sound bytes of it? Instead, only a series of photos taken over a period of days/weeks/months. It raises my suspicions as to any authenticity of this thing being real. I hope I am proven wrong though.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Dec 28th, 2007, 8:52pm

on Dec 28th, 2007, 11:39am, motorcyclerick wrote:
I for one can not help but wonder why ( if this 'drone' has been seen many times by the person who took the photos ) haven't they submitted any video or sound bytes of it? Instead, only a series of photos taken over a period of days/weeks/months. It raises my suspicions as to any authenticity of this thing being real. I hope I am proven wrong though.


Hi Rick,

If you knew the details of the sighting(s), you would already have the answer to your question. It has been wondered before why Chad was not the one to get video. He would have been to only one who would have had the chance. But there may even be a reason that he don't yet know. It seems that Chad did not even own a camera.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by wreckage on Dec 29th, 2007, 06:01am

Sorry to be off-topic, but this is very compelling:

http://realufos.blogspot.com/2007/12/finally-full-footage-comes-out-from.html

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by motorcyclerick on Dec 29th, 2007, 06:27am


Hi Rick,

If you knew the details of the sighting(s), you would already have the answer to your question. It has been wondered before why Chad was not the one to get video. He would have been to only one who would have had the chance. But there may even be a reason that he don't yet know. It seems that Chad did not even own a camera.

Yes latitude, I am sorry, but the reports here are both numerous and scattered over the web and difficult to find, and I am new also and may not know all that you, and others here, know. I have also seen your '2nd drone video' and would like to know more about the pix in it that appear after the 'explanation' title. To learn and find out everything I can about these 'drones' is my goal now, and any help or 'nudge' in the right direction would be greatly appreciated from anyone, thanks.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 29th, 2007, 07:17am

on Dec 29th, 2007, 06:27am, motorcyclerick wrote:
The reports here are both numerous and scattered over the web and difficult to find, and I am new also and may not know all that you, and others here, know. I have also seen your '2nd drone video' and would like to know more about the pix in it that appear after the 'explanation' title. To learn and find out everything I can about these 'drones' is my goal now, and any help or 'nudge' in the right direction would be greatly appreciated from anyone, thanks.

Hi motorcyclerick,

I compiled a .PDF document with all of the Drone sightings, images and accounts, download it here, for a direct link, click here, or if you dont have Adobe, you can view it online by clicking here (although the embedded links dont work if you view it online at the last link).

Hope this helps. smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by motorcyclerick on Dec 29th, 2007, 10:04am

on Dec 29th, 2007, 07:17am, DrDil wrote:
Hi motorcyclerick,

I compiled a .PDF document with all of the Drone sightings, images and accounts, download it here, for a direct link, click here, or if you dont have Adobe, you can view it online by clicking here (although the embedded links dont work if you view it online at the last link).

Hope this helps. smiley




Wow! Very little these days tends to scare me, but if even a portion of this pdf report is true...well, it certainly confirms more then a few of my own life-long suspicions, especially the one where I have always thought that we are 'monkeys tampering with dynamite' when it comes to even beginning to understand the environment in which we exist. Thanks for the email, DrDil, and if exposing this thing is what is needed, then let's 'pull back the curtain and see if we cant meet the wizard'.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by slobomotion on Dec 29th, 2007, 12:53pm

Of course, it will take me time to verify any of this amazing recent clip about what seems to me to be the famous Rendelsham incident. Astonishing. Why isn't mass media on to this? Can anyone advise me as to how to contact the media? It was easy enough for me in the States, but I live in Europe now and am sluggish at the native tongue (French) and wouldn't know how to assert myself.
BTW, a business contact recently offered to put me semi-directly in touch with a French woman who has been doing UFO reasearch here for years, and a lot on drones. I have to check this out further before I take the plunge. I am not sure who the heck this woman is.
Please recall, everyone, I had an experience on November 17, 2007 here in Saint-Denis, France, which MAY have been a drone incident.
I am struck by what this guy said in the clip: "They seemed to be winking at me . . . like an eye . . . " That is what I saw! When I waved at them, they blinked back! When I contacted them with my thoughts, they blinked back! If I was hallucinatory, you gotta credit me for being inventive. It was better than a Hollywood movie, 'cept for the fact that it scared me, and my impartial witness. Eek!
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Dec 29th, 2007, 2:07pm

on Dec 29th, 2007, 12:53pm, slobomotion wrote:
Of course, it will take me time to verify any of this amazing recent clip about what seems to me to be the famous Rendelsham incident. Astonishing. Why isn't mass media on to this?


It was covered quite extensively by the media, I posted a little about it myself: To watch video clips, news reports, or just for more information on this event. (International Pilot Testimonies) & Larry King Are UFO's For Real & Watch NPC Pilot UFO Conference Video & Is Full UFO Disclosure Beckoning? smiley
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Dec 30th, 2007, 5:53pm

on Dec 28th, 2007, 03:58am, nekitamo wrote:
It does seem like it changes shape, but it's hard to tell for sure. Here's a stabilized and slightly enlarged version by spf33:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Z2tkh59FISM


Hi nekitamo,

This is helpful... but since the resolution and focus are both less than desirable, it is difficult to say it is morphing. I will "sit on the fence" that it is shape changing until better video shows up. But if forced to answer that question, I would lean toward not changing.

It is an odd and interesting object...
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by VonStern on Jan 4th, 2008, 6:00pm

Happy New Year everyone!

Here is a little game for those who want to learn:

http://www.sciencemuseum.org.uk/launchpad/launchball/

I'll keep my score a secret, not to pollute anyones initial goal.... grin

It's not my favorite game, but it is fun and gives one some retaliation of skills long gone in the past...

Enjoy,

VonStern

Ps.: It might be off topic, but some science included might have resemblance of the workings of the "Drones".
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Jan 7th, 2008, 6:06pm

on Dec 28th, 2007, 03:58am, nekitamo wrote:
It does seem like it changes shape, but it's hard to tell for sure. Here's a stabilized and slightly enlarged version by spf33:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Z2tkh59FISM


Maybe this is also helpful...

This is time compression version... you will see the spikes show up at 9 seconds and then blend back (but I think it is the focus and the poor resolution) and pop back out at 14 seconds again. You get more of a feeling it is drifting like a kite (in this version).

http://youtube.com/watch?v=r-z8CwdRt2s&feature=related
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Jan 7th, 2008, 6:17pm

Here is a "slow mo" version... but due to the resolution, it gives it an errie almost "alive" feel.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=DtT6iLXZBkY&feature=related




... not related: but this could be freaky if you have not seen one before... they are making some cool kites these days!

User Image
(from the Coast to Coast site.)
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by danblast on Jan 9th, 2008, 06:48am

They look more like Balloons there is a concave convex difference when comparing them to the other kites.

Imagine these with led lights in them. Nice find.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Jan 9th, 2008, 08:22am

on Jan 9th, 2008, 06:48am, danblast wrote:
They look more like Balloons there is a concave convex difference when comparing them to the other kites.

Imagine these with led lights in them. Nice find.


Hey danblast...

Hey is some more info on these:

http://www.peterlynnkites.co.nz/kites/bigkites/octopus.htm

http://www.gombergkites.com/plynn.html



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YvwcyC-fbDc&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uejuaP12d_s&NR=1

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by drewlac on Jan 11th, 2008, 1:50pm

I just got this email from MUFON. Be sure to review the link/presentation on the drones/CARET.

MUFON Special Team Operations -Veritas (STOV Team) Investigation of the Drone Photos/CARET Documents

By James Carrion, MUFON International Director

MUFON's Special Team Operations - VERITAS (STOV Team) has conducted an indepth investigation into the Drone Photos and CARET Documents that surfaced on the Internet in 2007. Please read our preliminary report at http://www.mufon.com/documents/Drones-CARET.ppt. Our investigation is ongoing and if you have further information anout this case, please email us at hq@mufon.com.

Sincerely,
James Carrion
MUFON International Director
www.mufon.com
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by motorcyclerick on Jan 11th, 2008, 2:11pm

i dont have office powerpoint, what other program will open this file so I can see it?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by drewlac on Jan 11th, 2008, 2:13pm

Its not a shocker that MUFON believes that Drones/CARET is a massive disinfo campaign.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by motorcyclerick on Jan 11th, 2008, 5:05pm

on Jan 11th, 2008, 5:02pm, DrDil wrote:
More information and PDF file of (new) MUFON investigation available here smiley


drewlac was kind enough to send it to me in pdf format, thanks to both of you.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Marvin on Jan 11th, 2008, 9:27pm

I don't get it.

How does MUFON make the jump or connection with the Drones and Caret to Kecksburg... by simply focusing on the year 1965?? That is more than a stretch, it more than a jump, it is one heck of a leap (a wild guess at best, not backed by objective evidence).

I might buy the issues with the photos, I have seen some of the issues myself. But Caret = Kecksburg? It is more than disappointing, it is why UFO research gets a bad name.

Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by urantia606 on Jan 11th, 2008, 10:28pm

The MUFON report is a lot of nonsense....as expected.

As you all know I went a lot of effort to show that Drone type objects are NOT a new phenom in the skies of this planet. They go back over 150 years and probably for more than 2000 years at the least.

Few people have seen them. Why? As we all know now....they are cloaked. It is Issac's speculation that 'someone' was fooling around with the decloaking device.

That, coupled with a lot of handy digital cams and there you have it. New and very revealing photos of an object that is NOT supposed to be seen.

Well guys, we've seen it.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Jan 12th, 2008, 10:29am

on Jan 11th, 2008, 10:28pm, urantia606 wrote:
The MUFON report is a lot of nonsense....as expected.


I'm with you, Dougster. This mufon thing is definately odd. Why now? Why try to tie the drones to Keckburg? It's a total incoherent mess, just like a lot that has been going around lately.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by slobomotion on Jan 12th, 2008, 11:02am

I agree, why tie the drones in with Kecksburg? I have heard here in Europe that Kecksburg has been solved, that it was a Russian probe to another planet that fell there, and our government wanted to nab it and examine it. Was this disinformation? I dunno, had the ring of truth to me. Just as I write, I hear military jets (not sure, my guess) outside in the skies. I think we are onto something about the Drones. Some are manmade and as here in France, are done for police work. That is kinda stupid sometimes, cuz there is nothing like a beat cop on the street. I lived in a very bad nabe in Brooklyn, New York, and two beat cops, a man and a woman, were put on patrol, and just stood there and watched. It did the nabe a world of good! I am serious!!!!! A few here in my Paris nabe would be a good idea, and not those couple of people who ride around on horses, either. As for the OTHER drones, I think it is likely that they have been here for a long time, and are usually cloaked. Why they have been, or MAY have been, uncloaked a bit, is interesting. Who did it? Why? Perhaps "they" want us to think, and to observe. Or maybe someone is monkey wrenching things, an interesting thought, huh, The most important thing is that we keep talking and thinking and sharing. I thank this site again for the fact that NO ONE has ridiculed me for my postings. I feel safe to post and don't feel defensive. Some odd things have happened to me since I joined this site, however. Some of these things are related to my new awareness, for sure, but some others, I dunno . . . For example, a few weeks ago, I saw weird letters, like from the CARET drone ships, inside my living room (and the shutters were closed!) I could not determine the source of these letters. Heiroglyphics. They were on the white curtains in my living room. I woke up my spouse, who was annoyed, but he got even more upset when he couldn't find the source, either! They later transformed into Runes. No, I didn't write them down. I regret that. He berated me. I think what I saw was condensation on my single pane windows on a frosty night, with outside street light making weird patterns through a tiny slit in the shutters. My spouse opened the shutters, though, and the letters were still there, but bigger. I've also heard weird droning noises, which sometimes sound like ululations. I have been able to put a lot of this off to garbage trucks outside or neighbors doing renovation in their houses, but I cannot help but feel a bit spooked. Happy New Year, everyone. Let's keep our eyes open and keep talking.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by elevenaugust on Jan 12th, 2008, 11:27am

on Jan 12th, 2008, 10:29am, Latitude wrote:
I'm with you, Dougster. This mufon thing is definately odd. Why now? Why try to tie the drones to Keckburg? It's a total incoherent mess, just like a lot that has been going around lately.

Seconded....
And oddly, James Carrion came on OMF and not here.....
hhmmmm...
Why??
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by drewlac on Jan 12th, 2008, 11:52am

This is an opportunity to be heard on this topic, MUFON has engaged UCB and OMF on the Drone/CARET topic. These pages need to reviewed and re-read to find the best information/research completed to-date then presented to MUFON. If the History Channel's UFO Hunters is going to do a show on the Drone/CARET case, I'd like it to be at accurate and impartial, allowing the viewer to formulate their own opinion.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Takabb on Jan 12th, 2008, 1:18pm

Full length drone video footage from Sao Paulo, Brazil. The quality is better than the youtube. The video was made in 1995 in VHS.

http://rapidshare.com/files/82743889/UFO_BRAZIL.ZIP

Thank to anarkhy from Unexplained-Mysteries.com for uploaded.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Jan 12th, 2008, 2:25pm

on Jan 12th, 2008, 11:52am, drewlac wrote:
This is an opportunity to be heard on this topic, MUFON has engaged UCB and OMF on the Drone/CARET topic. These pages need to reviewed and re-read to find the best information/research completed to-date then presented to MUFON. If the History Channel's UFO Hunters is going to do a show on the Drone/CARET case, I'd like it to be at accurate and impartial, allowing the viewer to formulate their own opinion.


Normally I would agree but Mufon's past actions have shown they are not to be trusted when the drones are concerned. I'm leaning towards some kind of cover up with Mufon participating in some capacity.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by drewlac on Jan 13th, 2008, 11:12am

on Jan 12th, 2008, 2:25pm, Latitude wrote:
Normally I would agree but Mufon's past actions have shown they are not to be trusted when the drones are concerned. I'm leaning towards some kind of cover up with Mufon participating in some capacity.


I've been following the discussion with Mr. Carrion at OMF. The first thing that he is requesting is contact information of witnesses and experts to begin their investigation. Honestly, this is a very a reasonable request. Although, I'm not 100% certain that LMH has been contacted to assist MUFON with any investigation. If she has, what her response was. I am hopeful that she would work with them.

If not, this is why this field of study is soooooooo disfunctional. No one ever wants to collabrate, share information, work together. rolleyes At times, it appears to me that no one wants to know the truth of these matters. Isn't it obvious that MUFON is extending the olive branch here? I hope that is opportunity doesn't just pass us by. angry
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Jan 13th, 2008, 12:24pm

Drewlac,

It could be that LMH has some very good reasons for not working with Mufon (I believe she does). Remember Steve Reichman? One thing I have learned through this is LMH can be trusted. I can't say the same for Mufon.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Jan 13th, 2008, 12:30pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 12:24pm, Latitude wrote:
Drewlac,

It could be that LMH has some very good reasons for not working with Mufon (I believe she does). Remember Steve Reichman? One thing I have learned through this is LMH can be trusted. I can't say the same for Mufon.


Steve Reichmuth?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Jan 13th, 2008, 1:14pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 12:30pm, DrDil wrote:
Steve Reichmuth?


Yep.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Jan 13th, 2008, 1:24pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 1:14pm, Latitude wrote:
Yep.

Just keeping it on track Lat, and saving members searching for an unrelated Steve Reichman!! wink
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by drewlac on Jan 13th, 2008, 1:44pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 12:24pm, Latitude wrote:
Drewlac,

It could be that LMH has some very good reasons for not working with Mufon (I believe she does). Remember Steve Reichman? One thing I have learned through this is LMH can be trusted. I can't say the same for Mufon.


Its time to start fresh and let go of the past. What is the benefit of withholding information? Isn't there more to be gained, learned, and discovered if everyone would just work together? This goes for MUFON, LMH, and OMRT. Aren't we all searching for the same thing, the truth?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by murnut on Jan 13th, 2008, 1:51pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 12:24pm, Latitude wrote:
Drewlac,

It could be that LMH has some very good reasons for not working with Mufon (I believe she does). Remember Steve Reichman? One thing I have learned through this is LMH can be trusted. I can't say the same for Mufon.



What leads you to believe LMH is more trustworthy than MUFON?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Jan 13th, 2008, 1:57pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 1:51pm, murnut wrote:
What leads you to believe LMH is more trustworthy than MUFON?

Hi Murnut, smiley

Possibly as shes a believer regardless of evidence whereas MUFON require evidence regardless of believers.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by motorcyclerick on Jan 13th, 2008, 2:02pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 1:44pm, drewlac wrote:
Its time to start fresh and let go of the past. What is the benefit of withholding information? Isn't there more to be gained, learned, and discovered if everyone would just work together? This goes for MUFON, LMH, and OMRT. Aren't we all searching for the same thing, the truth?


What is the benefit? Well, I think it is obvious that it is ego- everyone wants to be 'the one' who delivers undenyable proof for the very first time. Whether we want to believe it or not, undenyable proof of 'first contact' is going to make SOMEONE historically famous. We are, after all, a very vain race.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Jan 13th, 2008, 2:05pm

Sorry, I should add thats why believers credit LMH as being more trustworthy, not that its an established fact but the credentials required it would seem are a little more than a slight belief in the possibility, hearsay and rumour. Oh and a bad memory to forget early discrepancies and very possibly a subscription to Earthfiles.

I struggle to implicitly trust people who charge me for knowledge that they were bestowed with for THE SOLE REASON of making it public. undecided
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by murnut on Jan 13th, 2008, 2:22pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 2:05pm, DrDil wrote:
Sorry, I should add thats why believers credit LMH as being more trustworthy, not that its an established fact but the credentials required it would seem are a little more than a slight belief in the possibility, hearsay and rumour. Oh and a bad memory to forget early discrepancies and very possibly a subscription to Earthfiles.

I struggle to implicitly trust people who charge me for knowledge that they were bestowed with for THE SOLE REASON of making it public. undecided



Not only that, but she doesn't report on the drones anymore, does she?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by motorcyclerick on Jan 13th, 2008, 2:26pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 2:22pm, murnut wrote:
Not only that, but she doesn't report on the drones anymore, does she?


In her defense on that, I recently emailed her asking when her last contact with Isaac was, she stated it was early fall, and added that the 'ball was entirely in his court', so...until/unless Isaac contacts her (or anyone else) again, what is to report?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Jan 13th, 2008, 2:41pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 2:26pm, motorcyclerick wrote:
In her defense on that, I recently emailed her asking when her last contact with Isaac was, she stated it was early fall, and added that the 'ball was entirely in his court', so...until/unless Isaac contacts her (or anyone else) again, what is to report?

Go back and have a look at the questions she asked Isaac back in the Fall and you will see why the lines of communication broke down so needlessly

I haven't said much on this lately, mainly as I believe I've said it all before, and this runs a lot deeper than the recent events. Here's a couple of my posts from over three months ago and not a thing has changed since, including my views..... undecided

on Sep 7th, 2007, 1:11pm, DrDil wrote:
What I was trying to say without actually spelling it out was that I think its incredibly nave to think that LMH hasnt had any of the original images analysed.

For example lets say she has had them analysed and the conclusion was that the images are beyond reproach and actually show what they purport to show, i.e. a Drone. Obviously then the next course of action would be to organize a press conference and, Go public in every sense of the phrase!! Personally if I was at the helm I would make it my sole purpose to ensure that there wouldnt be a country in the world where at least one of the major newspapers werent running this story.

I also believe this is achievable, especially with the current media climate surrounding the UFO phenomenon, as even over the last three years I have witnessed first hand the choke hold on the media regarding UFOs gradually being slackened, indeed recently Ive even seen some UFO reports on mainstream media AND THEYVE NEVER ONCE REFERENCED THE X-FILES (or used the X-Files title theme as background music.) This is an astronomical leap forward if you look at UFO reports from only five years ago.

Of course, every now and then in the past, a journalist would pop up who had a little integrity and presented a factual report on a UFO sighting but these were few and far between, now (in my opinion) they are becoming more the rule than the exception that proves it. In summary Im trying to say that if you had what you believed was authenticated and verifiable proof of life beyond earth then the worlds media would sit up and listen!!

BUT, that wasnt so much what I was getting at as I believe that LMH would have had these images professionally analysed by now, what I was getting at is there could be an easily recognizable error in the original images which becomes impossible to detect once they are manipulated (cropped, resized, sharpened etc.) for posting to a website. And its because of an error such as this that LMH has turned her back on the community that shes SUPPOSED TO SPEAK FOR. Or at least the community she represents in some small way, and to people who are observing from outside the community LMH is probably seen as the more presentable and respectable side of UFOlogy!! (Even if its an obviously tainted and diluted view.)

Because after seeing her sporadic reporting on Isaac and the Drones (now you see it, now you dont!!) there must be some reason that we are not aware of that LMH consistently blows hot and cold over the whole issue. And if you accept that LMH would have had these images analyzed by now (which I do) what other reasons could there be for her not reporting in a more professional and investigative style?

I feel this has gone well beyond the realms of jealousy and getting, One over on her critical and cynical peers, I feel as I have said before that this failure to release the images for investigation plants her firmly in the unenviable position of lead conspirator.

Hopefully if she ever visits any UFO forums she may see one of the many posts that are similar to this one and may realise that the people who used to look to her for answers no longer even factor her into the equation.

I think I may credit her perceptiveness a little too much though and the chances are shed just sneer at any such criticism and simply keep up the pretence of being a credible reporter, while ignoring any and all requests for knowledge THAT SHE WAS TRUSTED TO CONVEY!! As remember, we are not asking her to break anyones trust because she was passed this information FOR THE SOLE REASON OF PUBLISHING IT IN ITS ENTIRETY!!

She is acting unethically and betraying the trust from those who looked to her for answers as well as the trust of every single person who has emailed her regarding the Drones, yes that even includes the anonymous and, Professional people who see fit to waste their time contacting her. And the recent experts who frequented the forums have tried to answer intelligently questions that are asked of them, but all of them within a couple of days or so have stated that they need the originals.

Wouldnt now would be the perfect time to share the wealth that LMH s currently hording?

Unless of course theres something she doesnt want us to see..

on Sep 6th, 2007, 8:19pm, DrDil wrote:
But dont you wish you knew what it appears LMH knows?

I feel that its beyond the realms of possibility that LMH has received all of these, Professional emails claiming to further advance the credibility of the entire Isaac saga, and hasnt once thought,

Hmm Im 100% sure I have the real deal here, in fact I could single-handedly force full disclosure!! I may as well have them authenticated so that they are beyond reproach by handing out a couple of the ACTUAL photographs to trusted friends and experts in the relevant fields.

Even if this entailed supervising the images every step of the way, the ends surely justifies the means?

We all know LMH is a very shrewd operator; she had to have been to attain the loyal following, semi-celebrity status and media power that she wields today. Sure shes had her ups and downs, her wins and losses, but thats what happens when you conduct your investigations in, Real time and in the public eye. (This may also explain the hesitance to publish her findings so quickly this time around, whatever those findings may be.)

If anything this makes LMH more likely to verify any evidence personally, as shes a tough cookie and should be very hard to fool (again), remember the (Southern I think) old adage immortalised by Bushs less than perfect recital,

Fool me twice, fool on me.

Or perhaps she hasnt been fooled at all. Perhaps we are the fools and the joke is on us!!

So do we not credit LMH with practising one of what surely must be a fundamental and the most basic of protocols, i.e. get everything independently verified!! (Then ideally get at least a second -and hopefully corroborating- opinion/hypothesis!!)

Can we really safely assume that LMH hasnt had any of the Big Basin images checked out?


Who knows, this could be why they cant be released to the baying crowd of forum members, CGI experts etc. because they are already doing the rounds with the relevant experts.

Personally I dont think this is the case but I do think that LMH would have had an independent analysis done on at least ONE of the original images by now, even if just for her own piece of mind before she pushes forward with any more disclosures from Isaac.

So, if youll further indulge me in this thought process, then I feel it at least alludes to the possibility that LMH knows, Something she doesnt as yet want to reveal. Something she may have known since she received the Big Basin images, but that, Something wouldnt keep the subscribers happy so she humoured all involved and sent a particularly nasty email to Isaac knowing full well that he is no more a whistle blower than the Big Basin Drones are, Huge in size?

Or maybes she pre-warned Isaac then purposefully misled the PTB into thinking that her and Isaac aren't as close as they are, or that they aren't in contact?

Maybes I grossly underestimate LMH, maybes even as I type this shes putting together irrefutable evidence and irrevocable proof that will conclusively determine the origins and credibility of the, 2007 Drone Flap, one way or another.
But somehow I doubt it..............

Possibly part of the reason that she has still failed to release the images is that it will prove conclusively what her unannounced status is in the disclosure game, whether that be the, Player or the, Played.

"Dont hate the player/s, hate the game?" grin



Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by murnut on Jan 13th, 2008, 2:56pm

Dr. Dil

These post still make great sense, and your pretty much right, nothing has changed.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by motorcyclerick on Jan 13th, 2008, 3:03pm

Go back and have a look at the questions she asked Isaac back in the Fall and you will see why the lines of communication broke down so needlessly

I haven't said much on this lately, mainly as I believe I've said it all before, and this runs a lot deeper than the recent events. Here's a couple of my posts from over three months ago and not a thing has changed since, including my views..... undecided

Yes, Drdill, I agree with you, but I like to refrain from 'slinging mud' as it has no positive effect. HOWEVER, as long as you mentioned it, I was both stunned and offended by the choice of the critical letter that she had chosen to send to Isaac, I thought that the choices were made in very poor judgement, and wonder about the intent of sending them to him.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Jan 13th, 2008, 3:09pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 1:57pm, DrDil wrote:
Hi Murnut, smiley

Possibly as shes a believer regardless of evidence whereas MUFON require evidence regardless of believers.


Wrong. Mufon has already shown a pattern of deceit regarding this case. I keep saying it but you people seem to have short memories. They have attempted to kill this thing with lies and disinfo. I am not ready to forgive all of that. James has a lot of explaining to do.

You people do not know what is going on with LMH and that makes you very uncomfortable. I have not always agreed with her regarding the drones. But in my opinion, she is genuine and has never attempted to lead us astray. In other words, she's not perfect, nobody is, but she's speaking the truth as she knows it.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Jan 13th, 2008, 3:10pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 3:03pm, motorcyclerick wrote:
Yes, Drdill, I agree with you, but I like to refrain from 'slinging mud' as it has no positive effect. HOWEVER, as long as you mentioned it, I was both stunned and offended by the choice of the critical letter that she had chosen to send to Isaac, I thought that the choices were made in very poor judgement, and wonder about the intent of sending them to him.

Welcome to the misunderstood, contradictory, untenable and maligned world of a, Dronie..... undecided
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by DrDil on Jan 13th, 2008, 3:14pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 3:09pm, Latitude wrote:
Wrong. Mufon has already shown a pattern of deceit regarding this case. I keep saying it but you people seem to have short memories. They have attempted to kill this thing with lies and disinfo. I am not ready to forgive all of that. James has a lot of explaining to do.

You people do not know what is going on with LMH and that makes you very uncomfortable. I have not always agreed with her regarding the drones. But in my opinion, she is genuine and has never attempted to lead us astray. In other words, she's not perfect, nobody is, but she's speaking the truth as she knows it.


Speaking of short memories.....

on Aug 18th, 2007, 10:21am, Latitude wrote:
You are absolutely correct. That's why her excuse is not the real motive for holding back. More hi res photos will only strenthen the case for real. It's the low res photos that are easier to poke holes into. When people see the detail involved in the hi res they will only have one reaction. What will the pro hoaxers do with the hi res shots that they haven't already done with the low res? Linda already saw what happened after she released the first hi res. The forum community did her analysis work for her and pointed out the LAP on the panels of the drone. I have told her this. I have already informed her that these forums are full of intelligent analysts ready to do free work for her but she's ignoring that fact. She needs to understand we are all part of the same team.

So her argument is bogus. So which theory is the most likely? The book. But people, the book does need to be written. If done properly, she has a best seller on her hands. Who knows what that might lead to, a movie deal?

on Oct 5th, 2007, 10:48am, Latitude wrote:
I hope LMH is writing a book if only so we can see what has been kept from us. I think a book from her would be missing many important points.

I think the reason LMH is so quiet when it comes to the forums is because she does not trust us or simply does not like us. That's sad. It seems to me that we are her most ardent followers.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by nekitamo on Jan 13th, 2008, 3:18pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 1:44pm, drewlac wrote:
What is the benefit of withholding information? Isn't there more to be gained, learned, and discovered if everyone would just work together? This goes for MUFON, LMH, and OMRT. Aren't we all searching for the same thing, the truth?


Exactly! Couldn't agree more.
You've also answered your own question - they don't care about the truth. Seems like it's about something else now...

Forgot to add: I, for one, won't ever buy any kind of book about the drones, not even one written by Isaac himself. The moment such book or DVD or any other kind of publication appears will be the moment I fall from the fence on the hoax side.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by motorcyclerick on Jan 13th, 2008, 3:19pm

I would also like to add my confusion over Isaac's decision to contact C2Cam as his ONLY means of communication. Why THAT group? Why not (as IMO it would be more logical) contact a respected national or world renouned NEWS reporter, via attorney? I know, anonymity, yes, but let's suppose for a moment that his information is true and genuine and that there are 30-50 others who also know what he has revealed so far. Do any of you out there honestly think that the powers that be who stand to be damaged by this release of information would NOT go ahead and see to it that ALL of these people meet with 'untimely deaths due to accident'??
Think about it - the revenues from a slow release of technology over DECADES....more money than there may be a word for.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by murnut on Jan 13th, 2008, 3:29pm

Quote:
You people do not know what is going on with LMH and that makes you very uncomfortable.


Her silence makes no sense to me.

And her whining about cgi questions, which are legitimate concerns regarding anonymous witnesses/photographers, reminds me of a child who takes their ball and goes home.

I was a believer in the drones, right up until she clammed up.

I would for once like to see some real facts in this case, which support belief in the drones.

I am tired of theories.

All the facts I see support hoax.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by motorcyclerick on Jan 13th, 2008, 3:35pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 3:29pm, murnut wrote:
Her silence makes no sense to me.

And her whining about cgi questions, which are legitimate concerns regarding anonymous witnesses/photographers, reminds me of a child who takes their ball and goes home.

I was a believer in the drones, right up until she clammed up.

I would for once like to see some real facts in this case, which support belief in the drones.

I am tired of theories.

All the facts I see support hoax.



unfortunately, I have to agree with the summation.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Jan 13th, 2008, 4:05pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 3:14pm, DrDil wrote:
Speaking of short memories.....


That was then... this is now. Things change and so do my opinions.

Murnut posted: Quote:
Her silence makes no sense to me.

And her whining about cgi questions, which are legitimate concerns regarding anonymous witnesses/photographers, reminds me of a child who takes their ball and goes home.

I was a believer in the drones, right up until she clammed up.

I would for once like to see some real facts in this case, which support belief in the drones.

I am tired of theories.

All the facts I see support hoax.


Look who's whining now! She not going to tell all so you are going to scream HOAX? The two are not related but gives you some measure of retaliation. rolleyes

Not very scientific of you. Seems kind of childish to me. Maybe if you considered that she may have had a very good reason to get quiet?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by murnut on Jan 13th, 2008, 4:16pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 4:05pm, Latitude wrote:
That was then... this is now. Things change and so do my opinions.

Murnut posted:

Look who's whining now! She not going to tell all so you are going to scream HOAX? The two are not related but gives you some measure of retaliation. rolleyes

Not very scientific of you. Seems kind of childish to me. Maybe if you considered that she may have had a very good reason to get quiet?


Another theory or do you know something?

This case needs facts.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by Latitude on Jan 13th, 2008, 4:23pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 4:16pm, murnut wrote:
Another theory or do you know something?

This case needs facts.


It's a possibility. Sorry, that's all I have on that. All I'm asking is that we give her the benefit of the doubt.
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by murnut on Jan 13th, 2008, 4:33pm

Fair enough.

I am just perplexed by her silence.

These could be the best ufo photo's ever and yet this case has not progressed much in a very long time.

Theories are fine, when presented along with some facts.

The drones need more facts at some point.


Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by tommi01 on Jan 13th, 2008, 4:35pm

on Jan 13th, 2008, 2:56pm, murnut wrote:
Dr. Dil

These post still make great sense, and your pretty much right, nothing has changed.


But something did happen. Can anyone remember some guy going around the Internet posting that he had "cracked" Issacs web IP addy? This didn't happen of course, it was all talk. Does anyone remember this?
Re: #6 The Drone Enigma A Global Search For The Tr
Post by motorcyclerick on Jan 13th, 2008, 4:42pm

Well, IMO, this case is not going to move in ANY direction without more input from Isaac, plain and simple. For as many 'experts' that conclude that the