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 thread  Author  Topic: where are the remains ?  (Read 1053 times)
INT21
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xx where are the remains ?
« Thread started on: Sep 8th, 2014, 2:52pm »

Over on the Indian star people thread ZETAR asked Drwu..

..DRWU,

WHAT IS THE CUTTING LOGIC WHICH DISPUTES THE ANCIENT ALIEN THEORY ~ ALWAYS RESPECTFUL AND INDEED CURIOUS SIR!



Let me say why, although I accept the possibility of 'ancient aliens' I don't think it happened.

We'll take India (the sub continent) and use it as an analogy.

A few hundred years ago India was an essentially agrarian country with a rich social history.

Then came the British.

They built things like the railways and other industries.

And they then went away: well, more or less .

But they left an industrial modern legacy behind.

This legacy was used by the locals and prospered. It enabled the locals to advance in what we call the modern world.

OK.

Back to the ancient aliens.

It follows that they must have been more technically evolved than the people they met. They must have had metallurgy and engineering sciences.

So where are the traces ?

You cant move an advanced civilisation into a bronze age one and then go away leaving nothing. And didn't the locals learn anything ?

I ready concede that the people of four, five, even ten thousand years ago had thriving civilisations. But thriving in the context of their own technology.

HAL
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drwu23
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xx Re: where are the remains ?
« Reply #1 on: Sep 8th, 2014, 4:01pm »

on Sep 8th, 2014, 2:52pm, INT21 wrote:
Over on the Indian star people thread ZETAR asked Drwu..

..DRWU,

WHAT IS THE CUTTING LOGIC WHICH DISPUTES THE ANCIENT ALIEN THEORY ~ ALWAYS RESPECTFUL AND INDEED CURIOUS SIR!



Let me say why, although I accept the possibility of 'ancient aliens' I don't think it happened.

We'll take India (the sub continent) and use it as an analogy.

A few hundred years ago India was an essentially agrarian country with a rich social history.

Then came the British.

They built things like the railways and other industries.

And they then went away: well, more or less .

But they left an industrial modern legacy behind.

This legacy was used by the locals and prospered. It enabled the locals to advance in what we call the modern world.

OK.

Back to the ancient aliens.

It follows that they must have been more technically evolved than the people they met. They must have had metallurgy and engineering sciences.

So where are the traces ?

You cant move an advanced civilisation into a bronze age one and then go away leaving nothing. And didn't the locals learn anything ?

I ready concede that the people of four, five, even ten thousand years ago had thriving civilisations. But thriving in the context of their own technology.

HAL
INT21


I agree and there simply isn't any objective evidence for the idea that it happened.
The main thrust is from reinterpreted religious texts/myths by those who want to reimagine the events and tales as intrusions by aliens rather than religious myth. Some of the stone glyphs and carvings that have been pointed out are interesting but in and of themselves they don't prove ancient aliens.
It would be really nice if just one artifact that was definitely alien turned up in an archaeological dig.
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xx Re: where are the remains ?
« Reply #2 on: Sep 8th, 2014, 9:29pm »

<<<It would be really nice if just one artifact that was definitely alien turned up in an archaeological dig.>>>


Some years ago a researcher set out to prove that ancients mistook the bones of dinosaurs for monsters.
He assumed that there would be relics of these monsters preserved somewhere in a temple or the like.
Careful review of the notes from some of the best in the business, and reviews of their collections and donations, showed no bones.
It wasn't until the actual daily notes were checked that he found mention of large bones and other items that were discarded as being not relevant to the dig site.
Science often has tunnel vision and preconceived ideas of what should be there.
With the eyes of a digger looking for Troy none other than Schleiman himself destroyed the very city he was looking for.
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xx Re: where are the remains ?
« Reply #3 on: Sep 9th, 2014, 08:56am »

on Sep 8th, 2014, 9:29pm, skizicks wrote:
<<<It would be really nice if just one artifact that was definitely alien turned up in an archaeological dig.>>>


Some years ago a researcher set out to prove that ancients mistook the bones of dinosaurs for monsters.
He assumed that there would be relics of these monsters preserved somewhere in a temple or the like.
Careful review of the notes from some of the best in the business, and reviews of their collections and donations, showed no bones.
It wasn't until the actual daily notes were checked that he found mention of large bones and other items that were discarded as being not relevant to the dig site.
Science often has tunnel vision and preconceived ideas of what should be there.
With the eyes of a digger looking for Troy none other than Schleiman himself destroyed the very city he was looking for.


Thins do get overlooked.....you have a specific example to share..?
I would think that an 'alien artifact'..like a ray gun.... would not get overlooked but then who can say?
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xx Re: where are the remains ?
« Reply #4 on: Sep 9th, 2014, 8:38pm »

While digging for Troy the good Doctor was convinced it lay at a rather specific distance below the surface of the mound. He "blasted" down through the upper layers and then started looking for the city he was after. Later work found that he was way off in his estimate and had gone through the Troy of the Illiad several layers higher.
The Doctor looking for proof that the mythical beasts of the Greek and other legends were based on dinosaurs found the scientists just assumed that the bones were contamination of the site by later occupants.
While a Raygun may be an obvious anomaly, how would a rusted piece of iron be treated in a dig at an ancient tomb? Or a footprint in mud that hardened into stone?
Out of place parts or artifacts are found all the time and are ignored as contamination by science.
My family has a long history of mining for minerals. Some 500 years worth.
One family legend is of the miners finding a lump of coal under Devonshire that contained a brass hammer like object.
While everyone thought it strange no one they talked to showed any interest in it as a scientific relic. It was considered as a piece off some tool or machine that had fallen among the coal and the tight fit in the coal a coincidence.
Science KNOWS the order of things and if it doesn't fit it must not be important.
« Last Edit: Sep 9th, 2014, 8:46pm by skizicks » User IP Logged

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xx Re: where are the remains ?
« Reply #5 on: Sep 9th, 2014, 10:01pm »

on Sep 9th, 2014, 8:38pm, skizicks wrote:
While digging for Troy the good Doctor was convinced it lay at a rather specific distance below the surface of the mound. He "blasted" down through the upper layers and then started looking for the city he was after. Later work found that he was way off in his estimate and had gone through the Troy of the Illiad several layers higher.
The Doctor looking for proof that the mythical beasts of the Greek and other legends were based on dinosaurs found the scientists just assumed that the bones were contamination of the site by later occupants.
While a Raygun may be an obvious anomaly, how would a rusted piece of iron be treated in a dig at an ancient tomb? Or a footprint in mud that hardened into stone?
Out of place parts or artifacts are found all the time and are ignored as contamination by science.
My family has a long history of mining for minerals. Some 500 years worth.
One family legend is of the miners finding a lump of coal under Devonshire that contained a brass hammer like object.
While everyone thought it strange no one they talked to showed any interest in it as a scientific relic. It was considered as a piece off some tool or machine that had fallen among the coal and the tight fit in the coal a coincidence.
Science KNOWS the order of things and if it doesn't fit it must not be important.


Again I don't disagree that basic things might get overlooked in a dig back then but an alien artifact wouldn't be basic at all and wouldn't get missed these days imo.
Hammers and bones aren't alien; something anomalous would be examined and noted unless of course there was a conspiracy afoot.
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xx Re: where are the remains ?
« Reply #6 on: Sep 18th, 2014, 9:44pm »

We recently watched a documentary called Life After People. It demonstrated scientifically, how if we were to disappear, just the people, suddenly, all at once, how long the traces of our existence would remain on Earth for someone else to find.

It wasn't as long as you'd think. I don't remember whether it was a thousand years, or three, but I don't think it was much more than that. Literally, every trace of us, would vanish.

They made the point that the ancient Egyptians etc. did a far better job of creating monuments that would stand the test of time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_After_People

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xx Re: where are the remains ?
« Reply #7 on: Sep 19th, 2014, 11:01pm »

The Maya and the Spanish were contemporaries. Both civilizations had the same IQs and the same physical bodies and abilities. Both civilizations were about the same age.
However the Spanish had developed technology that was vastly superior to the Maya.
A Spanish soldier, really the whole Spanish army with Cortez, could be defeated easiely by an infantry platoon from WW2.
In each case the basic materials used in the technology are the same. Iron, steel, leather, and cloth.
There is no proof that an ET race would be any older than we are. No proof that they are any more technologicaly advanced than we are with one exception. Space travel, and that is just one breakthrough away from us.
And there is no proof they would use materials any different than those we use. Those materials would all slowly rot away.
If a rusty revolver were found in a dig at Troy it would have been seen as contamination and nothing more.
The brass hammer I mentioned could just as easiely been the control stick of a bulldozer made of iron long since rotted away in the swamp from which the coal was formed.
And man is a really good scavenger. That revolver, or that hammer if it were found in that swamp could just as easiely have been reforged into something else.
My point is that we may well have found physical remains of a Flying Saucer in the past, and just beaten it into cooking pots or cut it into arrow heads.
Then again, how do we know that in some basement somewhere the crushed and rotted remains of a "Raygun" isn't laying there labeled as a piece of temple art ? Would we know it as an alien weapon if we did see it ?
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xx Re: where are the remains ?
« Reply #8 on: Nov 9th, 2014, 01:25am »

Skizicks perspective is most appealing and makes a lot of sense. We know that the Earth beneath our feet is in motion with plates moving and separating, and eventually rejoining in one giant Pangea Redux. Nature covers up and swallows up entire cities with time. With wars we destroy ancient monuments beyond recognition. I once saw a movie The Victors wherein a German officer and his prisoners were in an abandoned castle and it was deathly cold. The only thing to burn were some very valuable French artifacts which to the chagrin of his prisoners , who also recognized their historical significance, the practical German officer broke apart and proceeded to gingerly burn.
Recently ancient tombs and mosques were destroyed in Iraq by Isis. We did the same in Italy in WWII with such structures.
In the OBL operation stealth helicopter had crashed then blown up by the Navy Seals. a valuable component in the tail section survived and a small boy was selling the solid silver component until a Pakistani officer took it away. Eventually the Chinese had a peek at it.
In ET the lovable alien phones home using parts from a phonograph
We may have the same ability alien tech wise but just have not learned the principles to recognize or distinguish Alien as it may not look alien at all. What if people were the batteries, and not a fancy EverReady battery? Recall Stephen Kings Tommyknockers. Right now we have nano motors that operate by an external field. I posted an article like that in the stuff thread.
Again Skizicks makes a very salient point.
« Last Edit: Nov 9th, 2014, 01:32am by Sys_Config » User IP Logged

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